A little emotional but sincere about Tiziano, Carl and trust and respect in our inner circle

[slazbob]

9 minutes ago, Jared P said:

To be fair, I don't think Carl's max CCS is 220, if he can get 256 from 38mm. I'm not sure how much higher he has attempted, but I'd be willing to bet his CCS max stretches into the upper 220s/low 230s.

I thought about that, too. And it’s never a hold and show close. It’s usually touch and release. I think it’s pretty close to his max …I could be wrong. That’s why I say his strength is unique or at least rare. His deep set doing that is up there and normal with most, but block setting it is Everest right now! I guess handle spread has also got to be put into the mix as well. 
 

id like to maybe have him try my Monster Gripper one day! I think he could definitely cheat it shut but holding it would be a stretch. It’s filed so much.

[dubyagrip]

9 minutes ago, slazbob said:

I thought about that, too. And it’s never a hold and show close. It’s usually touch and release. I think it’s pretty close to his max …I could be wrong. That’s why I say his strength is unique or at least rare. His deep set doing that is up there and normal with most, but block setting it is Everest right now! I guess handle spread has also got to be put into the mix as well. 
 

id like to maybe have him try my Monster Gripper one day! I think he could definitely cheat it shut but holding it would be a stretch. It’s filed so much.

What's crazy is that GHP grippers are pound for pound the most difficult.  Their handle spreads are insane.  That makes it even more impressive.

[Climber028]

1 hour ago, slazbob said:

I don’t think his numbers match many high end or low. He’s definitely a beast. It’s probably length of hand that can go into this, too. Like I said…does anyone have a 30m block set 30+ pounds more than their ccs? I think Carl is special in this aspect- again, why that Russian guy is sour.

It's only 30lbs because he's so strong, but again 16% is pretty typical that's like block setting a 2.5 and CCS a GHP 4. If his gap was a larger percentage, the that could be a reason for more suspicion but he's within the normal ranges of what different sets are. We probably don't have enough data to get precise numbers but this is at least reasonable relative to other gripsters percentage differences. 

[Jermiah Merciconah]

1 hour ago, slazbob said:

I don’t think his numbers match many high end or low. He’s definitely a beast. It’s probably length of hand that can go into this, too. Like I said…does anyone have a 30m block set 30+ pounds more than their ccs? I think Carl is special in this aspect- again, why that Russian guy is sour.

Carl has a disproportionately long pinky, His fingers were only slightly longer than Larry's but if he was able to straighten his pinky it would've towered over 

[slazbob]

41 minutes ago, Climber028 said:

It's only 30lbs because he's so strong, but again 16% is pretty typical that's like block setting a 2.5 and CCS a GHP 4. If his gap was a larger percentage, the that could be a reason for more suspicion but he's within the normal ranges of what different sets are. We probably don't have enough data to get precise numbers but this is at least reasonable relative to other gripsters percentage differences. 

That’s what I’m trying to say …it’s not normal. I don’t see it in other gripsters like you mentioned. Spread of handles and such can skew things…no perfect science here. But it would be rare to see someone ccs 175 gripper and 30 mm block set 210 no.4 unless they can do easy reps with that ccs 175rgc which is not the case here. 

[Alawadhi]

So did the argument shift from he faked his #4 and GHP 10 to he can cert on the #4 but faked his GHP 10? Comon guys, let it rest. Carl is the man.

[Climber028]

9 hours ago, slazbob said:

That’s what I’m trying to say …it’s not normal. I don’t see it in other gripsters like you mentioned. Spread of handles and such can skew things…no perfect science here. But it would be rare to see someone ccs 175 gripper and 30 mm block set 210 no.4 unless they can do easy reps with that ccs 175rgc which is not the case here. 

That is a 20% gap, which is very large. It would be like CCS a 175 and block setting a 203 or CCS a 181 for a 210 block set. Those don't seem very crazy. If his gap was 20% or 30% I'd assume there were some shenanigans, but a lot of people have a 15% gap between CCS and block set, mine is only 13% but I don't really train grippers so I expect to be lower than normal. 

[Cannon]

In the Grip Show interview Carl discusses how IronMind sweated him over the card insert because they wanted it “like a spark plug” not swiped through from the front. Carl says he could CCS his #4 about 2 years before getting consistent with the different insert. He said that simple change to the insert required him to get about +10% stronger on CCS to get the job done. 

[slazbob]

5 hours ago, Climber028 said:

That is a 20% gap, which is very large. It would be like CCS a 175 and block setting a 203 or CCS a 181 for a 210 block set. Those don't seem very crazy. If his gap was 20% or 30% I'd assume there were some shenanigans, but a lot of people have a 15% gap between CCS and block set, mine is only 13% but I don't really train grippers so I expect to be lower than normal. 

Yeah I was referring to his 220ccs and 256 block set.

[Climber028]

8 minutes ago, slazbob said:

Yeah I was referring to his 220ccs and 256 block set.

Right me too, that is a 16% difference. 20% stronger would be a 264 block set which would be tough to believe, 30% more would be 286 which is even more silly

[David_wigren]

Isn’t the GHP also a little bit easier pound for pound because of their softer sweep? I mean 256 lbs on a GHP isn’t exactly the same as 256 lbs on an Ironmind gripper with their relatively harder sweep.

[Cannon]

2 minutes ago, David_wigren said:

Isn’t the GHP also a little bit easier pound for pound because of their softer sweep? I mean 256 lbs on a GHP isn’t exactly the same as 256 lbs on an Ironmind gripper with their relatively harder sweep.

You’ll hook someone with it. 

[David_wigren]

Carl: *Is a giant human. Has competed in many competitions over many years over and over. Has multiple of the hardest world records in grip set in competitions. Does video with Larry Wheels*
Nikita: “This dude is a fraud!!!”

Tiz: *Performs incredible feats WAY beyond what anyone else in his weight class can even even dream about. But it’s only on video. No competitions. No meet ups.*
Nikita: “OMG this guy is legit!”

 

[slazbob]

8 hours ago, Alawadhi said:

So did the argument shift from he faked his #4 and GHP 10 to he can cert on the #4 but faked his GHP 10? Comon guys, let it rest. Carl is the man.

No, Bader. I’m just pointing out it’s unique to Carl, and the Russian guy is probably thrown off by it. Totally on Carl being legit.

[slazbob]

3 hours ago, Climber028 said:

Right me too, that is a 16% difference. 20% stronger would be a 264 block set which would be tough to believe, 30% more would be 286 which is even more silly

You lost me. No one mentioned 20 %. but you did when I gave you my comparison. Of 175 to 210. Im saying…16% is not what others are doing, and is unique to Carl. 

[Climber028]

22 minutes ago, slazbob said:

You lost me. No one mentioned 20 %. but you did when I gave you my comparison. Of 175 to 210. Im saying…16% is not what others are doing, and is unique to Carl. 

All good, we ultimately agree that Carl is legit no biggie getting lost in the weeds of trivia

[slazbob]

36 minutes ago, Climber028 said:

All good, we ultimately agree that Carl is legit no biggie getting lost in the weeds of trivia

Correct,  haha.

[steeve tremblay]

we need proof to say such slander and there is such an extremely rare phenomenon on a planet that we must accept that it is stronger than us and leave our pride aside because this one is our enemy

[Londonjoseph]

On 1/23/2024 at 10:55 PM, steeve tremblay said:

we need proof to say such slander and there is such an extremely rare phenomenon on a planet that we must accept that it is stronger than us and leave our pride aside because this one is our enemy

Steve, I don't think the issue was a matter of pride. 

 

I think the idea was enormous feats have the burden of enormous proof. 

[steeve tremblay]

4 hours ago, Londonjoseph said:

Steve, je ne pense pas que ce soit une question de fierté. 

 

Je pense que l'idée était que d'énormes exploits avaient le fardeau d'énormes preuves. 

what I maintain is that Tiziano simply proved it and seeing these feats it cannot be faked like lifting stones of around 300 pounds for a man of 140 or 150 so I give him my hat and others

[David_wigren]

18 hours ago, steeve tremblay said:

what I maintain is that Tiziano simply proved it and seeing these feats it cannot be faked like lifting stones of around 300 pounds for a man of 140 or 150 so I give him my hat and others

It would be very easy to lift stones and just make up whatever number for its weight. For stone lifting to be legit. You need to either weight the stone on camera. With a scale that is untampered with. And not doing any shenanigans, like having the scale on lbs and claim it to be in kg’s. Another way to do it legit is to travel and lift known lifting stones. In my city there are a set of famous lifting stones with the heaviest one being 178kg. It would be very hard to fake that lift on video. Because other people could recognize whether I’m lifting the actual stone or not. But if I just drive to the nearest quarry, find a random flat and wide stone and lift it in an angle making it look as big as possible. That’d be super easy to cheat.

And also. A 300 lbs stone for a 140-150 man is not that crazy. Impressive yes, but not outer worldy.
 

I myself lifted a famous stone weighing 145kg the very first time I tried stone lifting. My BW at the time was around 80kg. 

Edited January 26 by David_wigren

[steeve tremblay]

2 hours ago, David_wigren said:

Il serait très facile de soulever des pierres et de composer n'importe quel nombre en fonction de leur poids. Pour que le levage de pierres soit légitime. Vous devez soit peser la pierre devant la caméra. Avec une échelle inaltérable. Et ne pas faire de manigances, comme avoir la balance en livres et prétendre qu'elle est en kg. Une autre façon de le faire est de voyager et de soulever des pierres de levage connues. Dans ma ville, il existe un ensemble de pierres de levage célèbres, la plus lourde pesant 178 kg. Il serait très difficile de simuler cet ascenseur en vidéo. Parce que d’autres personnes pourraient reconnaître si je soulève ou non la pierre. Mais si je me rends simplement à la carrière la plus proche, je trouve une pierre plate et large au hasard et je la soulève selon un angle pour qu'elle paraisse aussi grande que possible. Ce serait super facile de tricher.

Et aussi. Une pierre de 300 livres pour un homme de 140-150, ce n'est pas si fou. Impressionnant oui, mais pas extérieur au monde.
 

J’ai moi-même soulevé une fameuse pierre pesant 145 kg la toute première fois que j’ai essayé de soulever des pierres. Mon poids corporel à l’époque était d’environ 80 kg. 

yes you are right I think I lacked judgment and consistency thank you for clarifying the situation.

[degradated]

Wow. I read through pretty much this whole thread and the drama is immense. Being a somewhat newer person in the world of grip, I have a lot to explore. To me the CoC4 certification has always been my personal goal and what impresses me the most. Now I am familiar with other brands and the GHP10 cert is probably even more of an accomplishment, though Gillingham's company is far lesser known than Ironmind and seems to be on the fritz with an unforeseeable future. Regarding the attempted defaming video NY posted, I have personally lost a lot of respect for the man. I imported a GM-150 recently and saw that he is #1 in the world officially on this device, which has given me inspiration to one day be in the top 10 hopefully. However, his disrespect toward Carl is uncalled for. I agree that Carl's IM4 certification video didn't turn out the greatest, requires more scrutiny (and probably shouldn't have been approved), but I personally believe the man and if Strossen accepted it to be officially legitimate, then it is in our best interest to be in agreement.
It should be pointed out that it's 2024 now and the technology is there to more easily fake YouTube videos, especially with the advent of AI. The gripster community seems to be kind of a smaller group (in comparison to say bench press or deadlift WR seekers), so we should for the most part know nearly everyone by name who has made any major accomplishments (such as a GHP9, CoC3.5/4, Mash Monster, GG6, etc). At this elite level, this grip community definitely would benefit from a more standardized way of recording, judging and certifying. It would be prudent if Ironmind made an addendum to the rules on how exactly the video be filmed, so that there are no doubts for anyone in the future. So in summary, Nikita, Ivan and any of the Russians aren't completely from a different universe in questioning Carl's certifications, however the way in which it was done is unacceptable and malicious in my opinion.

[Hubgeezer]

Questions for anyone: i don’t see Tiziano listed as a Number No. 3 Captain of Crush. 1) Am I reading that correctly? and 2) Has there been anyone else for which they started successfully with a 3.5 Certification? and 3) Has this been brought up before?

[Cannon]

33 minutes ago, Hubgeezer said:

Questions for anyone: i don’t see Tiziano listed as a Number No. 3 Captain of Crush. 1) Am I reading that correctly? and 2) Has there been anyone else for which they started successfully with a 3.5 Certification? and 3) Has this been brought up before?

1) Yes you are. I do not believe he did the #3. There is not a corresponding IronMind article either. 

2) Yes. Michael Burke also started with the #3.5. 

3) I don’t recall a discussion about it