IROC-Z Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 Novice is there for newcomers to learn and develop. You can waive your ability to compete as a Novice and enter the Open class, but once you do so, you are Open until you graduate to Elite. No jumping back and forth. I sent you an email - wondering if you got it? Thanks. Jedd I see. I misinterpreted your initial response to Matt's question. I thought you were saying that anybody with less than a year would automatically go into the Novice class, and then you and Matt posted again right as I was posting my question. Sorry about that. I'm crystal clear on the rules now. Got your email. Thanks for everything, Jedd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
climber511 Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 I have been mudding and sanding drywall all day and still have painting to do this evening but I'll try and get some directions to the house up and some hotel information too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barbe705 Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 I have been mudding and sanding drywall all day and still have painting to do this evening but I'll try and get some directions to the house up and some hotel information too. Been training tonight. can not wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
climber511 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 I have been mudding and sanding drywall all day and still have painting to do this evening but I'll try and get some directions to the house up and some hotel information too. Been training tonight. can not wait. I haven't been training at all since starting the bathroom. I may or may not compete in Nationals . I "think" my back is getting better though so that is a really good thing - it gave me some real trouble this time when it went out. I am going to have to evaluate the one hand lift as to where my back is on the day - nothing else should hurt me unless Jedd gets us in the Medley with something stupid heavy (in which case I probably can't move it anyway). The bathroom is coming together nicely at this point - some stuff still on order but another few days and then wait on the bathtub to come in and it should be good to go. A port o let in the back yard isn't making momma to happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedd Johnson Posted June 7, 2011 Author Share Posted June 7, 2011 Chris, with your back as it is, if you want to just sit out that event and compete in the other events, at least you can push for higher numbers, such as in the pinch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jad Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Probably too late for this year but why do we have the same qualification standards for novice as open and elite, for Nats? I mean if you can pinch 200, pull 180 on the RT, and close a #3 are you really a novice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Parker Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Some things came up that will prevent me from coming to this competition this year. I will do my best to be there next year. Good luck to all competing, I look forward to seeing the results come contest time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedd Johnson Posted June 8, 2011 Author Share Posted June 8, 2011 Probably too late for this year but why do we have the same qualification standards for novice as open and elite, for Nats? I mean if you can pinch 200, pull 180 on the RT, and close a #3 are you really a novice? Good point - had not thought of that. What do you think would be good levels for Novices? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Rinderle Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Count me in. Nationals is all bending this year, right? Can't wait! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jad Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Probably too late for this year but why do we have the same qualification standards for novice as open and elite, for Nats? I mean if you can pinch 200, pull 180 on the RT, and close a #3 are you really a novice? Good point - had not thought of that. What do you think would be good levels for Novices? I would not have qualification standards for novices or if you absolutely want standards; maybe 500# total on grippers, pinch, and axle(?). Until Nationals becomes so big that you need to reign it in for lack of space, what would it hurt to have more people there? I mean what are they really competing for anyway; The novice national title? Nats should be the cream of the crop as far as contests so I like the idea of a guy/girl coming to their first or second contest and seeing what a top-notch contest should look like. They have a good experience and maybe they stick with it. I like your rules about not being able to switch back and forth and maybe after so many novice competitions and/or win(s) they have to move up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andurniat Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Probably too late for this year but why do we have the same qualification standards for novice as open and elite, for Nats? I mean if you can pinch 200, pull 180 on the RT, and close a #3 are you really a novice? Good point - had not thought of that. What do you think would be good levels for Novices? I think the levels are fine and I would drop the novice class at Nationals, just have an Open Light/Heavyweight and a woman's class. A lightweight can choose to compete heavy if they so choose. Nationals is to find the best. Regional comps need to be broken down to promote growth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedd Johnson Posted June 8, 2011 Author Share Posted June 8, 2011 Good points. Let's table them and focus on the upcoming event. Does anyone have questions about the contest and events themselves? Thanks. Jedd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barbe705 Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Good points. Let's table them and focus on the upcoming event. Does anyone have questions about the contest and events themselves? Thanks. Jedd yes, why is the plat buster a bs 2" lift instead of lockout? the 2" lift is a holdover from the 1" v-bar. anyone who sees that wants to know why in the hell we only lift it 2 inches. ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jad Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Good points. Let's table them and focus on the upcoming event. Does anyone have questions about the contest and events themselves? Thanks. Jedd yes, why is the plat buster a bs 2" lift instead of lockout? the 2" lift is a holdover from the 1" v-bar. anyone who sees that wants to know why in the hell we only lift it 2 inches. ridiculous. Jedd mentioned it in one of the updates. I don't remember the specifics but I want to say it was a skin tear thing or a back strength issue. The 2" vbar is 2" too and the 2HP is a mysterious 16.5". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barbe705 Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Good points. Let's table them and focus on the upcoming event. Does anyone have questions about the contest and events themselves? Thanks. Jedd yes, why is the plat buster a bs 2" lift instead of lockout? the 2" lift is a holdover from the 1" v-bar. anyone who sees that wants to know why in the hell we only lift it 2 inches. ridiculous. Jedd mentioned it in one of the updates. I don't remember the specifics but I want to say it was a skin tear thing or a back strength issue. The 2" vbar is 2" too and the 2HP is a mysterious 16.5". I have argued against the 2" v-bar being short before. it should be a full lock out. no question. the 2hp not being locked out makes sense to a degree because it's between your legs. also, there's history there. we could do the plat buster event correctly from the beginning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedd Johnson Posted June 8, 2011 Author Share Posted June 8, 2011 RE: 2HP Height The Pinch is 16.5 inches because that was what our marker was set at at GGC 2004. It was a mid-range pull that did not require people to pull to lockout and it still exhibited control over the lift. It was adopted by David Horne also, when he innovated the Euro-Pinch. RE: Plateau Buster Height You can't pull the Plateau Buster to lockout without it hitting your thighs. The handle is nearly a foot in length, plus, not everyone will grip it completely parallel with their waistline. It will most likely be perpendicular, which would catch people in the sack-ola. I also really don't want any excuses that there is bracing with the thigh going on like that one year at the European Championships. Not to mention the fact that there is no doubt in my mind half a dozen people would rip calluses off going to lockout. With a 2-inch pull, you just have to straighten the legs a bit and stay tall and you have a two-inch pull. Hopefully that is all cleared up - two issues I totally did not expect to come up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedd Johnson Posted June 8, 2011 Author Share Posted June 8, 2011 Brent I re-read your post and it seems you are saying that the public will say, "why are these idiots only lifting it two inches." If that is the case, I see your point. It might seem strange, but that is just a matter of explaining the reasoning. It's the same as asking why the hell those guys throw that hunk of straw with a pitch fork. Or why do they try to flip that pole up - it all looks the same to me, why don't they get the same score??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barbe705 Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 (edited) Brent I re-read your post and it seems you are saying that the public will say, "why are these idiots only lifting it two inches." If that is the case, I see your point. It might seem strange, but that is just a matter of explaining the reasoning. It's the same as asking why the hell those guys throw that hunk of straw with a pitch fork. Or why do they try to flip that pole up - it all looks the same to me, why don't they get the same score??? I think that people will view the shorter lift as a way to get bigger numbers. also, we had a plat buster lift at andrews this last weekend and it was to lockout no problem. as for using a neutral grip, it could simply be not allowed. I really feel like this is another obstacle for grip sport to have to overcome with people outside the sport. I'm also not sure I see how a 2" lift will not tear skin but, a 4" would. I've siad all I have to say but, I do think that outside opinions do matter to some degree. also, the sheaf toss, highest height wins. perfect sense. a lift where you don't pick it up all the way?? Edited June 8, 2011 by barbe705 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andurniat Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 I believe a full lockout should be used. I have not heard anyone complain about getting hit in the groin. plates will brush the thighs but not to a point of any advantage gained. I'm confused about the bracing on the thigh? Is this with the free hand or the handle? Calluses will tear regardless when your grip slips. Either way, I'm for the full lift for the simple fact that it is a full lift. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barbe705 Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Brent I re-read your post and it seems you are saying that the public will say, "why are these idiots only lifting it two inches." If that is the case, I see your point. It might seem strange, but that is just a matter of explaining the reasoning. It's the same as asking why the hell those guys throw that hunk of straw with a pitch fork. Or why do they try to flip that pole up - it all looks the same to me, why don't they get the same score??? I thought about this some more. at a highland games you can be called over by spectators and asked questions. announcers and AD's can explain events. this grip stuff will mostly be seen on youtube. no one will be there to explain why a 1/2 lift should count. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
climber511 Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 I have never seen or used a Plateau Buster - if I remember right, Jedd told me it is 20 or 21" to the top of the handle. I just played around with a loading pin set at 21 (top) - when at full lockout I'm maybe 5 or so up off the floor - I just guessed at this - kinda hard to lift it and measure it too. I do a sort of Sumo leg spread to get my hips under me and protect my back so it would be a little higher with my feet closer. Now think Bob Lipinski and 2" makes sense. Either way is OK with me I guess. I would tend to play with it and see what is easiest to judge maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedd Johnson Posted June 9, 2011 Author Share Posted June 9, 2011 Brent I re-read your post and it seems you are saying that the public will say, "why are these idiots only lifting it two inches." If that is the case, I see your point. It might seem strange, but that is just a matter of explaining the reasoning. It's the same as asking why the hell those guys throw that hunk of straw with a pitch fork. Or why do they try to flip that pole up - it all looks the same to me, why don't they get the same score??? I think that people will view the shorter lift as a way to get bigger numbers. also, we had a plat buster lift at andrews this last weekend and it was to lockout no problem. as for using a neutral grip, it could simply be not allowed. I really feel like this is another obstacle for grip sport to have to overcome with people outside the sport. I'm also not sure I see how a 2" lift will not tear skin but, a 4" would. I've siad all I have to say but, I do think that outside opinions do matter to some degree. also, the sheaf toss, highest height wins. perfect sense. a lift where you don't pick it up all the way?? So you don't like Vertical Bar lifts either then? Only point I was making with the sheaf toss is that it would be natural to ask why they are doing it. Of course outside opinions matter, that is why I forwarded you the entire rules sheet before I put it out to the public. Yes, skin tears will happen regardless of height, but the longer the skin is under tension, the higher the risk for a tear, don't you agree? Is there any video of the Plateau Buster being contested under lockout conditions? If so, I'd like to see it so I can make a good call here. Andrew, bracing on the thigh was permitted in the One Hand Lift in the Euro Champs contest like 5 years ago. Made the event a technique event instead of a support grip event. In my eyes, the Plateau Buster is way superior for testing support Grip Strength because it is not high enough for the hand to be braced against the thigh, as was done with that other lift a few years back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barbe705 Posted June 9, 2011 Share Posted June 9, 2011 So you don't like Vertical Bar lifts either then? Only point I was making with the sheaf toss is that it would be natural to ask why they are doing it. Of course outside opinions matter, that is why I forwarded you the entire rules sheet before I put it out to the public. Yes, skin tears will happen regardless of height, but the longer the skin is under tension, the higher the risk for a tear, don't you agree? Is there any video of the Plateau Buster being contested under lockout conditions? If so, I'd like to see it so I can make a good call here. Andrew, bracing on the thigh was permitted in the One Hand Lift in the Euro Champs contest like 5 years ago. Made the event a technique event instead of a support grip event. In my eyes, the Plateau Buster is way superior for testing support Grip Strength because it is not high enough for the hand to be braced against the thigh, as was done with that other lift a few years back. I have argued a number of times that 2" should be a full lock out. I don't agree about the skin tears. I have never torn skin on any lifts so I don't know that it would make a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedd Johnson Posted June 9, 2011 Author Share Posted June 9, 2011 I did not realize that you were against 2" lifts for the vertical bar stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barbe705 Posted June 9, 2011 Share Posted June 9, 2011 I did not realize that you were against 2" lifts for the vertical bar stuff. I understand. a lot of people tune me out. it's also possible it's never come up with anything you were hosting that I went up for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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