burkhardmacht Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 What a stupid idea this new rule! Getting certified now is a very complicated method to measure your own hand!! It could be easier to take a ruler Mr. Strossen! Hey everybody: email to IM and tell them how silly they are. I've never heard about such bullshit commercial tactics! The customer is the king and we are the people to show IM this fact! By the way: a 3#-close is great - but with the new rule it's hand-measuring! B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Walker Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 Dan- I am with you. I will be doing the same. Saturday my COC #3 tattoo starts getting covered up by the mash monster logo. I am utterly disgusted. Disgusted for my friends Smitty and Heath. And disgusted for my step-son Derek. Rick Walker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat 74 Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 Who out there can no set a 4? John Wood will do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Lipinski Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 As far as early certifiers not using a set, I certified around Dec-Feb 00-01, and I used a set. Actually, I came up with it before reading the gripboard, because it was perfectly obvious that I could not get my damn hand around the gripper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 Why not include a spacer with each gripper- it could even be attached to the bottom of one handle, swung up to make contact with the other handle, and obviously then the grip would have to be relaxed enough to allow the spacer to fall out of the way. Anybody got the Patent Office phone number handy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMunger Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 OK so I am going to be flamed....I actually like the idea behind the rule, I dislike the distance required. What do people think if the rule was set it, hold a ruler, prove at least 1" is open and then remove the ruler and crush. That would not be a drastic change of the requirements from day 1 (always required to show 1" of crush after the set). I think few people have problems with the actual rule. It's the CHANGE that has people PO'd. It would be a great rule if it was made in 1990. Or even made before a single person certified with a set. But as soon as he certified someone with a 1" set, that ship sailed. If he's really gonna do this, he needs to clean house and get the setters off the list. Your idea is all well and good, but it's a pointless proposal. Plus we went through this w/ the MM and decided parallel was approx 1" and a lot easier to judge than "1 inch" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gamidon Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 Munger the rule was: The free hand may be used to position the gripper in the gripping hand, but must then be removed, and must stay at least a foot from the gripping hand at all times during the squeeze. Similarly, nothing may be in contact with the gripping hand or the gripping arm from the elbow down (for example, the free hand is not allowed to steady the wrist of the gripping hand or hold the spring, etc.). At least the last inch of the squeeze must be clearly visible: the gripper cannot be closed while blocked from view and then turned and presented as already closed So proving that you have at least an inch would be a judgment issue not a rule change. Using a ruler to prove it would only be reducing judging error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danegarreau Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 Roark, your spacer idea is actually pretty good, assuming it would be a 1'' spacer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mANVIL Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 I honestly think a three finger close would work for a small handed person. Samuelson managed to close the #4 with three fingers and IIRC, Sorin has closed a #3 with two. RSW - I don't necessarily disagree that a no-set close should be implemented, but just because Magnus can close a #4 w/ 3 fingers and Richard Sorin can close a #3 with 2 fingers doesnt mean that it's even remotely possible for the other 99.99999% of us. A rule or method shouldn't be based on what 2 of the best grips in the world can do. I think most people purchase the #3 with the hope of one day closing it. The IM #3 certification should be difficult enough that the average person with average hand size can work up to it in a number of years of consistent hard work. The new way with a credit card eliminates that. Before everyone goes and boycotts their certification or IM products I believe that Strossens new rule will be removed or at least ammended in the following days/weeks when he realizes he alienated the majority of his clients. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Black Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 The rule as written says nothing about the credit card not being bent. I bet I can set my #3 as normal and pinch a credit card in the gap with no problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austinslater Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 After talking to another board member maybe the best solution would be to just have a separate no set list. What do you guys think? I also feel bad for guys like Clay,Heath, Smitty etc who were planning on using the cert process soon. Its too bad. I also dont agree with boycotting there products and would hate to see that happen. they make great products and that has nothing to do with the cert process. This is also a great time to really promote the mm process and I think Bills mmg level would be great for the potential 3 closers. Just my thoughts. Austin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSW Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 I think most people purchase the #3 with the hope of one day closing it. The IM #3 certification should be difficult enough that the average person with average hand size can work up to it in a number of years of consistent hard work. The new way with a credit card eliminates that. The question is: "Is closing a #3 with a set worthy of a write up in MILO?" I think closing a #4 is but closing a #3 is not under the old rules. Therefore, Strossen had to either stop certifying #3's or make the rules tougher. Not long ago a #3 close was being seriously considered a World Class Feat ! Not every trainee expects to be world class with afew years training. I know I don't. Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mANVIL Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 RSW - I agree, but i think it's just too late. What the #3 was 5 years ago is what the #4 is today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elmaco Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 This is so fxxxxd up,i was going to certify in a couple of days. Now i have to tell my witness that i will get back to him.... in 2006 Anyway ive tried the new rule and i can no set close the 2# so this crap wont bring me down, ill be back IM! /Markus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMunger Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 The question is: "Is closing a #3 with a set worthy of a write up in MILO?" Would have been a lot simpler to just change to a mere listing of the names. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nils Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 As to writing to Randy. I have actually done that and recieved a reply quite quickly. It doesn't seem like he really understood what I really meant in my letter(which seems to be common, I am apparently quite convoluted when I write in english) but he answered in a very civil way. I urge you guys to do the same if you write him. Nils Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AP Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 what did he say nils? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSW Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 RSW - I agree, but i think it's just too late. What the #3 was 5 years ago is what the #4 is today. No, it isn't too late because your name has a year next to it on the list. We will know that standards were different for the pre-2004 closes. At that point in time said individual had achieved an elite status with the grippers which warranted a write up in MILO. Usually these feats move in the opposite direction with the athletes of the past's accomplishments being marginalized. I like the idea of the feat actually becoming harder now that more people are involved in griptraining. Maybe it was a lot harder for John Hick's to train for the #3, than it is for a newbie with the KTA program? Bob Lipinski had to invent the set to train for the #3. What the earlier #3 closers did was much more impressive IMHO. Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Lipinski Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 The thing is though Robert, when I was training the gripper, I emailed strossen and asked if the set was okay. He said yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom of Iowa2 Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 (edited) I thought some sort of 'strange'and wacky rule change was coming.This IS all about power.The writing was on the wall.His behavior was becoming more and more inconsistant.His resistance to all the certs was obvious to me.It was obvious to me that something was in the works. I think many of you who thought my post on Jan Bartl's Rolling Thunder WORLD record being negated was irrelevant?It wasn't.It dramatized that Iron Mind can and will do whatever he/they want. Poor Jan. He isn't a member of the forum and may not even have a computer...but he took it in the 'can' as bad as any of you.Actually worse...A world record?or being stripped of a world record?that had been observed and judged by the 'inventor'of the Rolling Thunder (and being observed by Professional strongmen)Was a warning.It shows you that all the 'rules'can and will be changed on a whim. This is what is known as a 'will to power':an unconcious(or concious) desire to exercise authority over others. Nietzche wrote the book on it. Edited March 12, 2004 by Tom of Iowa2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubthewonderscot Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 (edited) This Is Randy's response to my email. "Weldon, Many thanks for taking the time to write and while we are sorry to hear that you think we were motivated to do this as a marketing ploy or that you don't think we support strength athletes, I am glad that you are training hard and I'd like to wish you all the best - wherever you decide to buy your equipment. Thanks again for taking the time to write. Best wishes. Randy Randall J. Strossen, Ph.D. IronMind Enterprises, Inc." .....Its not often I see a company willing to say goodbye to customers. Edited March 12, 2004 by dubthewonderscot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMunger Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 (edited) We will know that standards were different for the pre-2004 closes. No we won't. Not unless Randy puts a big ol asterisk and a written explanation. Not every gripper is on the gripboard. EDIT: Hell, 6 months from now people won't kknow unless we run around with a chip on our shoulders for life making sure everyone we meet knows. Edited March 12, 2004 by CMunger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tou Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 I still close my #3 with the previous rules but I'm not even close with this new rules. With my 7" hands, I can't put the pinky around the handle. I'd have to do a 3 fingers close btu i'm not Magnus Samuelsson. Talk about a crappy rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bballdad Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 TBone been trying for weeks to get a reply back from IM about getting a witness for his #3 certification. Never heard a word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 Tom, What makes you think it is unconscious? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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