HAMMERHEAD Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Setting a gripper means you use your non-gripping hand to squeeze the handles together a bit so your gripping hand can get the fingers around the handle. Holding the spring with the free hand is a training tool to help exert more force during your crush. -HH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Pat, Excellent point about fingertip beginnings for chin-ups! Wish I would have thought of that. Now I'll have to steal that line! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mac Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Drawing a comparison between a chin-up bar you cannot reach and a gripper you cannot get your whole hand around is somewhat ridiculous. It is a bit like saying if the uprights on a squat stand are set at 60 feet I cannot reach it to squat with it. Totally true but unhelpful in this situation. Everyone (unless your hand spread is less than a couple of inches or so) can get their fingers (or at least enough of them) around a COC gripper. Of course it makes it more difficult with smaller hands but that is the nature of the beast. In effect a set close is using two hands to get you past the bit you cannot get past yourself (or don't like to) - it would be like using your second hand to close a gripper and that being allowed (forgetting Ironmind's rules for a minute). Both use two hands over some portion of the close. Joe, in your idea of using the second hand to "set" on the inch bell, using the same definiton of "setting" a gripper, it would be like lifting it the first two inches with two hands. Always remember that "setting" your grip on a bar is different from "setting" a gripper (using two hands to get it where you want it - which means closing it slightly) - don't confuse the two Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bender Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Drawing a comparison between a chin-up bar you cannot reach and a gripper you cannot get your whole hand around is a great annalogy. Well stated. While everyone on this board can physically get their fingers around a gripper, there still remains the factor of where the palm-side-handle is seated. On a large hand, it can be perfectly set. On a normal hand, It's out of the normal grove, and all the more impressive to do. I've watched a 6-year-old play with my gripper, and his hands did indeed grasp the gripper where finger-tips were around the handle, but the other handle was supported by thumb-tip. Yes, in this case, the case of the 7.5" hand, and the 9" hand, hand-size effects the no-set close, but ultimately it comes down to the strength of the hand and the desire of the person to close the gripper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mac Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 If the "feat" in question is how many people can do chins from a 10 foot high chin up bar then it is a valid analogy. If the feat in question is how many people can close a gripper with one hand then why are you allowed to use two for part of the closure? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat 74 Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Joe, in your idea of using the second hand to "set" on the inch bell, using the same definiton of "setting" a gripper, it would be like lifting it the first two inches with two hands. Always remember that "setting" your grip on a bar is different from "setting" a gripper (using two hands to get it where you want it - which means closing it slightly) - don't confuse the two Yeah, and if you can't lift the bell it's not going to be any easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmmicklabs Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 (edited) TomofIowa2 I will do this for you this year. My hands are 7 and 1/2 inches from tip of middle finger down to my first wristline. My # 3 is 3 and 1/4 wide. I just tried it without a set and got it down to touching my thumb. My thumb is 3/4 inches wide. btw...I do not set grippers and I do not use chalk. If I set the gripper first then I cannot even budge it. I cannot even close a trainer if I set it first. And yes I have KTA and have watched the videos. Setting does me no good at all. I build up my momentum with my sweep. Edited May 13, 2003 by tmmicklabs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmmicklabs Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 I am with Bender, The Mac and Terminator on this one. If Ironmind changed the rules about setting, then how many guys would be certified right now ? My guess is about 50 or so. Even Richard Sorin once made a comment about how many COC's can pick up any # 3 gripper and close it without chalk and without a set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSW Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 My guess is about 50 or so.I am thinking more like 10.They don't make people do pullups starting with the tips of a couple fingers touching the bar, do they? Yeah, that would turn chinups into a GRIP feat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griparn Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 I also think there would be less certified people then. for you guys that can do a no-set #crush Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrik_F Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 From what you are saying tmmicklabs, your hand must be in the right groove without a set when you close grippers. So why not allow others to get the gripper in the right groove by using a set? How would you like it if there was a rule that said that you had to set the gripper? I bet you would rather like to be in groove and use the technique where you can use your strength properly? Its not the first part of the sweep that is hard, everybody who has used a gripper knows that. I dont think it is fair to compare it to using the other hand near the close or anything like that. Like it has been said before the set is more like jumping up to be able grab the chin bar instead of being able to reach the bar without jumping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratavarious_connection Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 a late welcome ....sorry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSW Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Like it has been said before the set is more like jumping up to be able grab the chin bar instead of being able to reach the bar without jumping. More like jumping up so the rep is 3/4 complete, because you are not strong enough to do the full ROM. If setting is such a problem IM should make the grippers with 2" wide handles so that no one needs to set. If 90% of the people in your gym coudn't reach the chin up bar, wouldn't you lower it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmmicklabs Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Good points from both Patrick B and RSW. This setting the gripper thing is a really touchy subject. Check out this video of a perfect no-set # 3 close. Truley amazing. Dave...No set # 3 close Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrik_F Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 RSW, I see your point with the fact that it becomes a partial rep if you use a set. But you have to agree that the very start of the sweep isnt really the hardest part of a gripper close. You only set the gripper to come in groove. It is not like if I dont set the gripper I cant budge it at all from the start because I am not strong enough in that position, the trouble begins later, closer to the close when you lose all leverage because the gripper almost sits in your wrist by now. If only the gripper could slide towards the fingers not the thumb That is why people with larger hands are at an advantage in no-set closes, because they can wrap (all) their fingers around the gripper and still have it reasonably in groove and high in the palm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MikeTheBear Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 CT, No, I'm not trying to stalk you on other boards. I'm also here because of the post by Wannagrip on your forum, and yes, I "wanna grip." For the next several months I'll probably only be able to do grip work. Anway, here is Pavel's "Grease the Groove" article. Pavel is big on the synaptic facilitation side of the things which is what GTG is designed to do. You don't even need to do 2 sets of 5. You just do 1 set several times a day. Sets and reps can vary, but he recommends a set of 3 with your 5RM. The article explains more. I would guess it would work very well with the CoCs. Grease the Groove Article Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmmicklabs Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 MikeTheBear, Welcome to the gripboard. Are you into the COC grippers like the rest of us are ? Tell us a little bit about yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom of Iowa2 Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Not trying to kiss anyones ass here but it IS more difficult for a small hand to do a 'no set'close.Terminator did it with slightly less hand length than I have. It IS do able. I think it is a hell of an accomplishment. Anyone else?less than 8"able to do the 'no set'close? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSW Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Patrik B, I guess my biggest problem with setting is that I think a reasonable person observing someone setting a gripper for the first time would probably say "hey that guys cheating!". I think the more natural test is a no-set close. If the grippers are too wide, then IM should make narrower ones. I understand that the gripper is only at 80% strength when the handles are parallel, but I find it a lot easier to close my #2 when I set it. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom of Iowa2 Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 RSW, No doubt about it.I've passed off the gripper to a lot of complete strangers.Some of em closed the dog gone #2 first shot too...so they WERE strong dudes. Sometimes i'd show them the 'set' and they just say WTF is up with that? So to a complete 'newbie'it doesn't make any sense.Obviously some were OK with it- others just shook their head. The reaction was mixed. I didn't even shown Josh a 'set' and when he lifts the INCH type dumbell or the Rolling Thunder he won't even touch his leg with the free hand.He feels that is cheating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Piche Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Not trying to kiss anyones ass here but it IS more difficult for a small hand to do a 'no set'close.Terminator did it with slightly less hand length than I have.It IS do able. I think it is a hell of an accomplishment. Anyone else?less than 8"able to do the 'no set'close? With what? I've done a double no set with a 2 in each hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom of Iowa2 Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Oh...a no set with a #3 with LESS than 8 inch hand. I think?most no sets-with a #3- have been done with 8 inches or more? Terminator is the only one I've heard of.David Horn? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MikeTheBear Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 tmmicklabs, Thanks for the welcome. I'm into Olympic lifting, powerlifting, and kettlebells, and I've noticed that my grip has been the limiting factor. I like the CoCs and I have John Brookfield's MOHS. I work on the computer all day and keep my CoCs at my desk - I've found that doing a few reps during the day makes my hands feel better after all that typing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Harlan Jacobs Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 That video of Dave pisses me off every time I watch it ! So easy ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Horne Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Tom, Yes I can. David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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