An Open Plea For Sorin/rich/tex

[Bob Lipinski]

I hope to see what those guys can do in a regular comp. I am not calling them out, I would just love to see a normal axle lift at a scheduled comp with a few other events from those guys. Obviously they will win overall or come close.

I don't want any american grip records to be handicapped cause the best don't feel like playing our game, or don't have the opportunity. Part of me thinks that Rich deserves a record for that axle performance, but then again the rules were different, the implement was different, and it is just judging by a different criteria after the fact. Rich had (did I think) 500 up, held to a pause with no hitching in him on that day. And more.

Anyways, if we are gonna raise the bar, let's get it over with! There is an old man in central southern Michigan I need to goad into lifting harder!

[rico300zx]

I second that, can Richard put something on?

Rico

[MalachiMcMullen]

I second that, can Richard put something on?

Rico

I would actually make the 14hour trek across those damned Appalachians and into SC to compete at Richard's place.

[dubthewonderscot]

a grip contest at summer of strength 3?

that would rock the grip world.<br><br>and i would be happy to help sponsor, judge, load, carry water...whatever at that one.<br>

Edited March 11, 2010 by dubthewonderscot

[Matt Brouse]

I second that, can Richard put something on?

Rico

I would actually make the 14hour trek across those damned Appalachians and into SC to compete at Richard's place.

I'd put it on my calender. That aint worth much coming from me, for those you know me. But I did start training grip again...

[1stCoC]

Rich and Tex love to train and be strong.They have a right to do and choose what they want to be part of. They showed in a field of the best of the very best what they could do. If Mr. Lipinski(hopefully he was there stageside at the Arnolds supporting the other gripsters efforts) takes the time to study the ranking of the Monster Bell lift you will see many names that do appear on the American "records "axle list. The Monster's weight was exact,built to specs provided by the Arnold's comittee. The bell was untouched or used by no one until the competition.Everyone had an equal training chance on all events. Yes, it was an official contest sanctioned by the worlds largest strength event the Arnold's Classic. IF one bothers to look at the video you can see the quality of the reps done by Rich and Tex and Dr. Todd officiating. I think his credentials are in order. The bar was exactly a 2"axle. I , they or we claim nothing other on that day in a sanctioned contest the greatest on record 2 hand double overhand 2" axle deadlift was done..and for 8 full reps. I will entertain a grip event idea at Summerstrong #3. Those interested in putting forth effort can contact me.The Mighty Mitts contest was intended to be a positive step taken to give those out there working hard on grip strength a place to showcase their strength. I would hope at least that would be respected and appreciated.Sincerely, Richard Sorin

[jad]

Record or no record, Rich's performance on the Sorin Monsterbell was the most incredible thickbar performance I've seen. Total domination of the implement. THE standard for all other thickbar feats to be compared to and this is coming from somebody who is not a thickbar fan.

[The Natural]

I think whether Rich and Tex want to do a "regular style comp" is more or less just a matter of book-keeping at this point. In other words, they're bound to re-write whatever thickbar records there are, and so it's just a matter of whether they regard those records as being worthy enough to break. It's much like Wade Gillingham and the 2 hand pinch. Him breaking it is pretty much a matter of buying a plane ticket and making time on a weekend. I think the same is true for Rich and the "official" axle record. Yes, Andrew holds it, but Andrew himself is going to admit that Rich is better at thickbar. So the interest in getting Rich and Tex involves should be less about getting them to 'prove themselves', which they've already done, and more about asking them to do grip a favor and re-write the record books so that the names that should be in there *are* there. And again, that's a favor they'd be doing, kind of like a world-class deadlifter doing the WABDL a favor and raising the record to something respectable, so that the federation as a whole benefits.

[Bob Lipinski]

Basically I agree with Rex's post. Rich and Tex would erase all records, and it would be a nice favor for them to set the record books straight, so to speak.

Richard- Rich's reps were clean, but the rules at the Arnold allowed hitching and cheating. The event was consistently judged, but they did not require a normal DO axle as most of the "records" have so far.

[andurniat]

I plan to be down at Summer Strong 3 this year. If something is set up, I'm game. If not, it's still an incredible weekend of lifting with friends.

I didn't see Rich or Tex hitch one of their reps, so that is a moot point. Let's stop squabbling over pointless aspect and get excited to see what I expect to be lots of 'grip records' fall this year. EVERYONE's game has been pushed to a higher level because of the Mighty Mitts.

[mobsterone]

I said as much then. Let's get it on!!

[IROC-Z]

Record or no record, Rich's performance on the Sorin Monsterbell was the most incredible thickbar performance I've seen. Total domination of the implement. THE standard for all other thickbar feats to be compared to and this is coming from somebody who is not a thickbar fan.

Agreed 100%. I was there for the Mighty Mitts comp, and I can honestly say that anybody in the audience that knew anything about thickbar was speechless while Rich was repping the Monsterbell! It was THE most impressive display of hand strength I have ever seen. I was sitting a few rows back from the front of the stage, and I heard Mr. Sorin say: "I've never seen anything like this".

[mobsterone]

I'm in a pedantic mood so bare with me: neither the Arnold nor ANY US record (other than any lift done under the auspices of the USAWA) can be called official per se as you still don't actually have an association with paid up members.

I know that the papers have been submitted and you've half done the website but that's it.

Once there is an official US Hand strength association and those members wishing to have the record recorded have paid a few bucks membership THEN it can be official. Otherwise, at best, regardless of who says it's ok (Arnold Classic included - saying otherwise doesn't make it so) it's 'generally accepted'. On that basis Andrew holds the record as is (in accordance with likely rules of any such organisation) in the US. Unofficially it'll be what was done at the Mighty Mitts and the world record will be Janne's 215 kilos.

Get the association set up and 1) all records can become valid and 2) permission can be given to the MM 2011 as having recognition but it will mean a) the bar MUST be controlled at the top and b) approval for use of the equipment as it is NOT an axle as they are understood. An expensive and very nice bit of kit.

None of the above is meant to knock ANY efforts made thus far as 500lbs on any thick bar is good and when it's done for reps... Ooowwww mama. But official? No. I have no doubt, should Tex or Rich care to do so that they'd take the record in a blink of an eye.

[Matt Brouse]

Let's stop squabbling over pointless aspect and get excited to see what I expect to be lots of 'grip records' fall this year.

+1.

Edited March 17, 2010 by Matt Brouse

[1stCoC]

You talk about strength and gameness ... take a look at Andrews performamnce on the Monster Bell.. multiple, strong reps all the way to near lockout pound for pound a truly mind numbing effort.I think if he hit his groove things could have changed. I hope we can all learn something from him, integrity, true functional strength and a competitive spirt above anything I have ever seen. That gentleman deserves every record and honor that has been bestowed on him.......he earns it!RS

[climber511]

Please don't anyone take this as a slam at big guys. But when I see Tex - and Rich and all the others guys who outweigh me by 100 or more pounds - I simply can't make myself believe I can be as strong as they are and do the things that they do. But then I look at Andrew - who is around 20 or 25# bigger than me and built somewhat like me (but with muscles). I then run out of excuses and have to just shut up and go train. Skinny Power Andrew lets me know what might be possible for me - he gets my mind right is perhaps a good way to say it. Like I think most people - I have to be able to convince myself mentally something is possible (for me) before I can do it. Andrew allows that for me.

[MalachiMcMullen]

I'm in a pedantic mood so bare with me...

Let's stop squabbling over pointless aspect and get excited to see what I expect to be lots of 'grip records' fall this year.

+1.

You talk about strength and gamenes...

Please don't anyone take this as a slam at big guys...

+a googolplex

Edited March 17, 2010 by MalachiMcMullen

[AP]

Obviously the big guys proved they have it. Is "it" the record? No, but whatever they have more than enough of "it" to go around. Lets bring it from here...

[1stCoC]

We are looking at the last weekend 26th, 27 June this year for Summer Strong #3. If there is an official American Handstrength "person" looking at putting on a real contest for establishing a record or two please contact me at Sorinex. Equipment, venue, and crowd will be available. I am also interested on how the American Handstrength association is organized,membership, and how the rules,prize structure if any, insurance, regulations and how "approved" events and equipment have been established.I am very interested in the history of things as you may guess and providing opportunities to further interest in grip strength.Richard Sorin

[ChrisJames]

Not trying to rock the boat or anything but i've done 507 lbs on a non knurled bar in front of two wpc refs and one bwla ref, weighing 230 lbs .

Not meant to disrespect anyone and i look at you guys as heros of mine (in a non gay way)and inspiration.

If back not playing up i'll try 530 or 550 lbs on friday.

ps .. love to be invited to Mighty Mitts next year !!!

[Jedd Johnson]

We are looking at the last weekend 26th, 27 June this year for Summer Strong #3. If there is an official American Handstrength "person" looking at putting on a real contest for establishing a record or two please contact me at Sorinex. Equipment, venue, and crowd will be available. I am also interested on how the American Handstrength association is organized,membership, and how the rules,prize structure if any, insurance, regulations and how "approved" events and equipment have been established.I am very interested in the history of things as you may guess and providing opportunities to further interest in grip strength.Richard Sorin

Richard, do you still have the weights marked with what they weigh per the weighings Smitty and I did for the GGC we did at your facility in 2006? I would be willing to try to bring my pinch down to Summer Strong. We would definitely need the weights weighed and marked for the contest though for the pinch records.

Thanks - Sounds very cool, my friend.

-Jedd-

[mobsterone]

We are looking at the last weekend 26th, 27 June this year for Summer Strong #3. If there is an official American Handstrength "person" looking at putting on a real contest for establishing a record or two please contact me at Sorinex. Equipment, venue, and crowd will be available. I am also interested on how the American Handstrength association is organized,membership, and how the rules,prize structure if any, insurance, regulations and how "approved" events and equipment have been established.I am very interested in the history of things as you may guess and providing opportunities to further interest in grip strength.Richard Sorin

As per a check of mine via google recently and chats with the guys: the US Hand Strength Association has stalled. They have a domain name 'parked' but not connected to their actual site (no idea why). The site is, at best, half done and has been since early 09 (see dates on the pages for update dates). The papers to set up an association have been submitted but that's it (I forget the actual US legal term). No insurance as most lifters, much like the Mighty Mitts (wasn't insured either) sign waivers at every competition esp GGC. There are no fees nor are there any actual members. It is, as I've told the guys, a mess.

There are some rules on their site (just google US Hand Strength Association and it'll take you to the right pages) but they are incomplete. If you need a point of reference we have a set up and running BHSA (British Hand Strength Association). I registered the domain using membership fees. Rules can be found both on our forum (incomplete) and on David Horne's site (linked to). We've also instigated group/gym memberships as well as individual and even have BHSA sleeveless T's.

In the US guys defence there has been some interest in taking part in a World Of Grip Strength International Super Series. The main issues is no one has stepped up to the plate and taken charge. There are a few reasons for this which I understand but they boil down to issues of time and, being frank, fear of the pain in the ass issues which can arise. Every time I come to the US I nag the boys about stepping up. So far...

I've also mentioned that no reinventing of the wheel is required regarding association rules and event rules. There are many power, strength and weightlifting federations which can be used as templates. Most GRIP event rules are more or less standardized and understood and can easily be copied and pasted (or you can check them as suggested above - it's better that you search to get a good idea of where they are at rather than me post rules for you).

All that is currently required, as per what we have here,

1) is a boss/president/CEO and a association secretary. Applicants can be voted on if need be or merely step up now and step down when the association is up and running. It's not a popularity contest so don;'t be afraid to be a hard ass as required.

2) an account (can be paypal) for fees to be submitted to and used for payments to others

3) membership fees (see above). I suggest $10.00 individual and $50.00 group (up to 10 members of a local gym,. club, etc)

4) ALL events rules done and dusted. Must include a basic core group of standardized rules ALL can use (ie: easily available equipment and or access at events). The rest can be debated over and provide some differences at contests.

Get this done soon and you could be using USHA rules etc by late spring latest.

I'd also suggest the association provides some items. For example and only with membership approval and funds in place a rated/ratified set of grippers (torsion or Vulcan) which can be used at all big events. It takes the variation out of the equation (use the MM as a model if need be).

[The Natural]

Not trying to rock the boat or anything but i've done 507 lbs on a non knurled bar in front of two wpc refs and one bwla ref, weighing 230 lbs .

Not meant to disrespect anyone and i look at you guys as heros of mine (in a non gay way)and inspiration.

If back not playing up i'll try 530 or 550 lbs on friday.

ps .. love to be invited to Mighty Mitts next year !!!

Chris I think you're in a similar situation to Rich and Tex. At the last summer strength event they both pulled numbers above the official record (or maybe just Rich did, I can't remember if Tex did or not). However it wasn't with an IM axle which is needed to be official (correct me if I'm wrong here), and the plates may have not been calibrated. Like I said in another thread, it's frustrating for grip enthusiasts when there's a big gap between official records and unofficial records, and you mentioning your 507 just confirms that a proper and official venue is needed for the big axle lifters to raise the bar. I think the tension amongst Rich, Tex, and Andrew will all but ensure that the record gets raised to 500+. You're in England right? You are in just as much of a position to get the Americans on the defensive with a big world record pull in the BHSA. It would be great to see you save your maxes for an official contest and stir things up on this side of the lake.

Edited March 24, 2010 by The Natural

[Hubgeezer]

You're in England right?

Wales.

I think Chris is the only fellow that "we" truly forgot about regarding participation in Mighty Mitts. I personally say this because I exchanged a few emails with Terry Todd when I was trying to pry a photo out of him concerning Stanless Steel for that MILO article I wrote. That was in December, and Terry was very interested in my opinion of different people (he didn't know any better and assumed I was an important guy ), and not that my opinion would have made a difference , but at least SOMEONE would have said something. Because Chris is the type of fellow who keeps a low profile, and may be more modest than some, no Yank spoke up. On the other hand, I did say, "there is a guy in England named Gardener who would be hurting for money but I know he would fly over in a heartbeat if he could swing it" (really did say that, and little did I know that Todd and Gardener were well aware of each other). I don't think anyone is ever going to forget about Chris James again.

Chris, I think the Infamous Vbar Incident with your bicep at the 2007 Brits caused many of us to think you were not into the sport the way you used to be. Obviously, you have returned stronger than ever

Sorry guys, didn't mean to hijack the thread about competition, but I think we have proven that Chris James was one of the best-kept Secrets in the Sport, and that will not be the case in the future.

[Bob Lipinski]

I am also interested on how the American Handstrength association is organized,membership, and how the rules,prize structure if any, insurance, regulations and how "approved" events and equipment have been established.I am very interested in the history of things as you may guess and providing opportunities to further interest in grip strength.Richard Sorin

Richard, if you aren't just being a smart ass, I would be happy to help with any details for a contest. Jedd Johnson, Eric Milfeld, and Chris Rice among others would know as much as I do, if you don't want to deal with me. We have a very loose knit, fledging organization.

On the other hand, if you already know the answers and are just mocking the current state of affairs, maybe we could use your help.