Deinhibition Reflex Training

[Grippster]

Just curious to know if this works or not. It's supposed to allow more reps and more tearing... and therefore builds more strength faster. Where would I learn more about this and also would you guys recommend it?

[timiacobucci]

Have you got any links or info on this?

I've never heard of it specifically but it sounds like some kind of cns training to do more work or produce more force. If that is the case I think Gazza is testament to the value of isometrics to that end. It takes allot of will to push through all out on a iso for longer than a few seconds but some wierd stuff starts happening if you can really push through it.

Same with gripper overcrushes.

I have thought about trying this with something like squats, trying to bend a certain size bar locked in a squat rack. It is best to have something that you believe you can move or bend or whatever than something completely impossible like a brick wall. Unless you REALLY believe you can move that wall.

[Grippster]

I can do it with a heavy negative but in other cases I don't know how. If I take my BC400 and set it I can only move the handles halfway - less than parallel. If I use the other hand to do a full close, and then let go my body for some reason lets me use more force and I can hold the handles about 3mm apart. Getting that gripper to 3mm would require you to be able to close an HG350, which is something I know I cannot do.

p.s. In case anyone is confused, deinhibition training is a technique that allows you to use more of your muscle's potential. There are little organs (called Golgi) which limit the strength of the electrical current being sent to the muscle when it senses stress. However, the Golgi kicks in long before any muscle or tendon damage would occur. This is called autogenic inhibition reflex. Deinhibition training attempts to fight this reflex in order to get the most out of the muscle being worked.

Edited September 21, 2008 by Grippster

[timiacobucci]

That is what I figured. Like I said isos all the way. I can feel it a bit with grippers like you say on the negatives. Try a really hard overcrush, something you can get pretty easy and crush the hell out of it like you are trying to destoy the handles for as long as you can. Then rest a bit and try a hard gripper. Big time deinhibition for me if I can do the overcrush all out.

I still feel it the most with bending though. On max braced stuff especially, I've gotten a much clearer feel for it now. My muscles and tendons will be straining and at a certain point no more power is coming, if you will through it and persist the rest of the power will add in after a few seconds. Which is tough because it is a defensive reflex, you are literally telling your body it is ok to continue to the extent of injury. Probably not terribly smart and pretty unreasonable to train with just for muscle growth or health, but it sure builds a hell of allot of power.

Master of deinhibition at work http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=6fNEc5kD1DA

If you watch each big hit you can see exactly what I am talking about.

[Grippster]

Apparantly explosive power can help overcome the inhibition reflex. I know it works in armwrestles. When you explode you're going full out. You have to add a tad of anger for it to work though.

[Grippster]

I'm amazed that there's been 100 views and out of all the strongmen here nobody knows what I'm talking about.

[timiacobucci]

I'm amazed that there's been 100 views and out of all the strongmen here nobody knows what I'm talking about.

Well I think it is pretty dangerous to do with big lifts. I am telling you it works and people do it all the time bending. Rephase this question specific to bending and post your question in that forum and I bet you will get more responses.

You can certainly hurt stuff in your arms and shoulders doing it short bending, hell Gazza broke a bone in his hand. The docs were even freaked about that one when he told them how he did it. He even bent a g5 for them with a cast on with a broken hand to prove it to them, tell me that ain't deinhibition. But hurting small stuff in your hands is a far cry from say your back. I really awoke to this when I pulled my transversus abdominis doing this while using a braced bending technique on some 5/8" grade 60 rebar. I felt it stop, I pushed through until the inhibition let go, the bar started to move, all like normal, then twing! And I couldn't rotate my torso in certain planes or it felt like a needle was being stuck up under the side of my ribs and my rib cage would just sort of fall and flop into my guts like someone pulled the plug on my abdominals. Not fun and I am very wary of using this on big lifts using the back and legs. Especially if you are supporting a large weight on your back or a big ass tire or stone, what if your muscle gives out or a tendon snaps? Hell that could kill you.

I understand what you are talking about and I can feel it clearly when I am bending now. I don't know about specific techniques like explosiveness as you say, I learned it through isometrics. It is mental though. Once you understand and are familiar with the mechanism and connection you can access it. It is like humming or popping your ears to relieve pressure in the cabin of a climbing air plane. I can't really explain it very well but you will know it when you feel it if you are paying attention.

I have been very tempted when I am stalled on a heavy deadlift for example, I feel the muscles stopping before my will, I know if I push through I can continue but I also feel my body shaking and my muscles and tendons on the edge and busting up stuff in my back is not something I want to do if I can possibly avoid it.

[Grippster]

What I'd like to know, is why you don't hurt yourself from doing deinhibition when you're mad or really really energized. For example, I've hurt my forearm from trying too hard to close the BC300, but the time I was really stressed out and decided to take it out on the gripper, it just closed and it didn't hurt at all. I mean, I just don't get that. There's more to it, there has to be.

[kyle102887]

What I'd like to know, is why you don't hurt yourself from doing deinhibition when you're mad or really really energized. For example, I've hurt my forearm from trying too hard to close the BC300, but the time I was really stressed out and decided to take it out on the gripper, it just closed and it didn't hurt at all. I mean, I just don't get that. There's more to it, there has to be.

Maybe you recruited more muscle fibers on the angered attempt at the gripper. Than you did on the other attempt.

CNS and the brain are a funny thing. I think it's all mindset when you get right down to it.

[carlsipes]

I'll take a shot at this. In Pavel Tsatsouline's book Power to the People he has a section were he talks about disinhibition training(I'm guessing we're talking about the same thing). Specifically he talks about the feed-forward tension technique. The way he describes this technique is using no resistance or a very little resistance and mimicking the motion with as much tension as possible. What this is suppose to do is teach your body to ignore the "just give give enough effort needed" message that the proprioceptors in your body send your brain. The carry over would be that when you are comming close to or attempting to better your max you have practice with shutting this response down and will be able to use your muscles and tendons to a closer percentage of their full potential. Similar to martial arts guys that practice sanchin.

I'm sure the book explains it better than I can but this should give you the idea. Hope it helps.

[Grippster]

Thanks for that post Carl. What I've been trying so far, is doing negatives with the BC400 and if I'm really into it I can do deinhibition. What I try to do is remember how it feels when I overcome that limiter reflex. My theory is that if I get exposed to doing this enough, eventually it will start to come more natural and I'll be able to do it on a regular close and not just a negative. If I could do it on a regular close now, I'd be about 3mm from closing that monster

Edited September 26, 2008 by Grippster