After Running A Few Grip Comps

[Jedd Johnson]

1. Mostly contest 2 handed events (pinch, bending, etc.) or just one hand of other events

2. One endurance event or medley. Breaks things up and is usually fun to watch

3. Keep comp time to less than 5 hours- The above will help

4. Strongman type scoring- Easier to follow for competitors and others

5. Rounds system

6. One minute to count as an attempt- Too many of the friction lifts are just so touch and go with position.

7. I hate the vbar because of skin tears. I will still have it at comps, just not every one

8. People enjoy different events and unique events

Not all of these are appropriate for a championship or world or maybe even national level contest, but these are great for local level comps. The name of the game at the local level is increasing participation, and to do that you have to have a contest that will appeal to local powerlifters, strongmen, throwers, and maybe even the average gymrat.

- I love medleys - the blob medley at GGC 06 and BBB 06 were great events.

- the shorter the contest the better.

- I prefer the Gripboard Grip Bash scoing system, where the best performance gets 10 points and all the other performances are divided by the best performance and multiplied by ten. Strongman scoring is good though, and is very easy.

- 1 minute for every attempt I disagree with, because the european events, so I am told, are usually based on one try per turn, like a powerlifting competition. we aremoving to that this year at GGC.

[Scott Styles]

The weights I use on v-bar are half of what the strong guys are using, so take this with a grain of salt. My experience had been that the v-bar makes my skin burn like crazy. It was to the point that I would feel it for hours after doing work on the v-bar. As a result, I never trained it.

Then I tried training it multiple times a week with sub-max singles and a generous warm up. At first my hands burned and it was very painful. Over a period of weeks, however, the pain gradually diminished and eventually went away completely. While previously I had been limited by fear of skin tears and pain, I got to a point where I was instead limited by my vertical supporting strength.

I still hate the event and have stopped training it now that the contest has passed. But I now have a way to train it that is practical for me and relatively pain free.

[Bob Lipinski]

One thing to keep in mind is that what you are doing is different than alot of promoters Jedd- You are having a top level nationals, so it is only right to keep things a little more rigid and focused on the hardcore grip guys.

I have wavered back and forth on having handsize divisions. For fairness purposes it is best cause you can't negate the handsize factor completely. Like I wrote above though, I want to keep grip with a deep competition field. The GGC has done this, I don't know how many local comps can.

I might toy with having a prize for the top competitor with under 7.75 or 8" hands at my next comp.

[EricMilfeld]

Maybe a compromise between hand tearing risk and hand size becoming too much of a factor would be a 1.5" v-bar...?

[dthor]

I agree that the adjustable two hand pinch is about as fair event as you can get.

The rising bar is definitely easier, however it is nice to be able to drop the weight back down for a new lifter.

I agree that the 1" or 25mm v-bar is a pain. I have trained on the 2" v-bar lift with Stew and Nick Rosendaul. Their hands are both on the smaller side and they are excellent on this lift. I found the 2" v-bar actually works your hands and especially thumb very hard, as opposed to the 1" version. I doubt that skin tears would be an issue with the 2" version, less weight and more skin contact with the bar.

Medley's are probably the most interesting event.

[climber511]

Novice Class – a great idea but as Gazza said - how do we decide who is a novice – and do you need a novice class for 1 or 2 people if that’s all that show up. I do think we need to start light enough that anyone can at least do the event – especially if we want to have a teen or female side to the contests.

Scoring – I’ll leave that to others but whatever is used needs to be kept current at all times so people can figure strategy for lifts so I suppose I like something simple unless the whole thing can be kept on an Excel sheet or something that calculates automatically. Calling Scott Styles maybe???

Blood on apparatus – what if - some competitor catches a blood borne disease – maybe from the hottie in the bar last Sat night – but he was also exposed at the v-bar event at your contest – how long do you think you, as the guy who put on the contest, is going to be in court over that one? Heck, the pain aspect is irrelevant and a non issue to me. But it’s a scary world out there and a defense of “judge, I didn’t think trading bodily fluids between competitors was a big deal” may not work real well – and “the chalk soaked it right up” might not be any better. No offence guys, but I don’t want to risk my meager fortune on that one. Not likely but do you want to bet your future on it? What does this mean to the future of the v-bar and 2 HP? For me, it means I won’t have a 1” or 25mm v-bar event at MY contest – I would have a 2” one but not this time around. It means I will have the 2 HP but I will have cleaning materials present to wipe the edge down (I’ve not seen actual blood spots on one yet) and anyone who tears their thumb web will have to use super glue – second skin etc. Not perfect but it’s a start and what I intend to do. Will I do the v-bar event at other contests, yes I will, unless I mess my back up again doing it, then I’ll call it too high risk for me and call it a day for v-bar but that’s a personal issue not for this discussion.

Standard versus changing events – If the events never change, those people who are really good at that set of events will always do the best and others with perhaps a different set of strengths (but equally strong all around) will quit showing up over time. I like changing events and I like the idea of not knowing what the events will be until you show up but I realize that’s not very good for record setting purposes. Perhaps 2 or 3 known in advance and a couple “wild cards” announced at the start.

3 or 4 attempts – It does add time but probably allows for differences in apparatus – the first thing I see people doing at any contest is checking out the friction on the pinch and v-bar to see how it compares to the one they train on and how to adjust their openers. I’m in favor of four – especially on friction events. This tie’s in with the rising bar/rounds discussion as rounds allows somewhat for this. I tend to favor rounds but rising bar is faster and easier.

Medleys – never for time! I always hated getting beat on a medley after lifting every implement because I moved slower in between than someone else – it’s not a foot race. Time should be used as a tie breaker, sure. Increasing difficulty medleys are fun and very spectator friendly. Blobs are fun but offer a huge advantage to the bigger hands. I like a mixture of stuff much better as I believe it’s fairer and more fun.

Along with this comes the hand size issue – there’s no question certain events favor large hands. Depending on the event choices how critical this becomes in a contest. Big hands have an advantage – big bodied guys have an advantage – young guys have an advantage, bald guys have an advantage ……. we can’t make life perfectly fair but hand size seems to me to be the best division for grip the way it is now. Necessary, no, but not too difficult either. I can go either way here but like this better than the novice class idea as a way to help equalize a contest. The current 7 ¾” seems a good size.

One minute – 30 seconds – one attempt?

I like to think the goal is to allow everyone to perform at their best that day and allowing an extra try within a short time frame seems a good idea to me. Especially newer people have trouble setting a gripper, dealing with unfamiliar implements etc. Friction devices have spots with the chalk worn off etc. I guess I’d vote for 30 seconds here. I think the one attempt rule will definitely hurt the less experienced or new to an event person.

I really like an endurance event done as a finisher - and really enjoyed Bob's head to head format a couple MGCs ago.

That’s my two cents. I’ll still go to every contest I can pretty much no matter what the rules and events are just because it’s fun but I think it’s also good to work all these things out ahead of time and not surprise people after they sign up or show up.

Edited August 6, 2007 by climber511

[Scott Styles]

Good thoughts Chris. I'd be happy to work up an excel spreadsheet for a contest if needed, but I'm not sure how practical it would be to have a computer out in the lifting area with all the bodies, weight, sweat, and chalk. I personally favor a simple scoring method and don't like to see one exceptional performance on a single event give a person a huge lead.

[Jedd Johnson]

Good point on the national versus local. Certainly at a local event where we are trying to promote the support, it can be relaxed. Very good thought.

I think it would be cool to run a short competition some time next year, not a GGC, just an open event.

One thing to keep in mind is that what you are doing is different than alot of promoters Jedd- You are having a top level nationals, so it is only right to keep things a little more rigid and focused on the hardcore grip guys.

I have wavered back and forth on having handsize divisions. For fairness purposes it is best cause you can't negate the handsize factor completely. Like I wrote above though, I want to keep grip with a deep competition field. The GGC has done this, I don't know how many local comps can.

I might toy with having a prize for the top competitor with under 7.75 or 8" hands at my next comp.

[climber511]

Another thing I like is going head to head by two or more competitors on those events that allow it. Bob's 100# plate hold for time, the RT for reps comp at GGC, bending at several events now. It takes less time obviously but also adds some excitement for the spectators.

Some seem to be leaning towards a difference between "local" contests and national ones - I think this is a good thing. Allowing some leeway for small meets if and when we develop into a unified body can add another dimension to the fun.

Edited August 16, 2007 by climber511

[madss]

As always good points for contest, guys.

1. I personally have always disliked 1" V-bar, as a small hand guy I prefer a 2" any day. I don't think hand size is huge factor in it as you might believe. It more technique.

2. 2-hand pinch is a nice event- as for hand tears, does rounding the edge help?

loading speed is the problem with contest, MGC in Germany took forever something like 2-2.5 hours.

3. Medley are the best. Not for time like Chris points out, just get them done in a set time frame. Have enough different items that something will stop everyone. Go by points. Big hands will have an advantage but this is why we need groups. either by weight or hand size. I vote by weight then at least you are competing against guys your size and its easier to weight in at a contest then measure a hand, IMO.

If not I really have never minded losing to some of the monster, I am just happy to get to compete with them Winning a open size event is not a option for 95% of us.

4. After all the talk about contest events I want to put on a small contest in the South if anyone is interested and try out some of the idea from this thread. time for me to start planning.

[Bob Lipinski]

Scott- Did just the pinch take 2 hours in Germany?

With 14-15 competitors, I think I made it out at about an hour an event, probably closer to 30-40 minutes for grippers and 1.5 hours for vbar, and 15-20 minute breaks in between events.

[madss]

Scott- Did just the pinch take 2 hours in Germany?

With 14-15 competitors, I think I made it out at about an hour an event, probably closer to 30-40 minutes for grippers and 1.5 hours for vbar, and 15-20 minute breaks in between events.

I am pretty sure pinch was 2-2.5 hours. I guess mainly because you could choose 4 different width and just making sure the weights were the right ones and poundage was correct for the records. If I am way off here some of my German buddies could correct me.

Everything else went pretty quick.

I find it is always the longest event mainly due to loading, tighten of plates etc.. maybe some of those Sorinex plastic locking collars would speed it up a bit. I check into them.