Slim

[Roark]

Any of the board members at the AOBS dinner ask

Slim to try to close a gripper?

[Bearcat 74]

No, I was too afraid of him........

[OldGuy]

He would only have a slim chance.

[Sybersnott]

Ya know, and Heath can correct me if I'm wrong on this... but he didn't cruise around our table, and no one asked him to.  I did see Dennis come up to watch Heath doing some gripper stuff, but as for Slim... maybe he was saving himself for the night's performance.  Whether he could close a #3 or not is up for debate.

[RiotGrip]

I believe that Tom Black said in a previous post (a while ago), about when he went to some function that Slim was at, that he's heard Slim can't close the #2.  Tom's post dealt with him bringing the BBM to the affair and stating that he didn't test slim with it because Slim has nothing to prove to him.  Tom will correct me if I'm wrong about this

[Guest baldy]

It's kind of funny to me the way rumors float around about all the great strength athletes who "can't even close a #2", etc (Slim, Ed Coan, others). It is like we find some small consolation that "well, he may be able to lever a 28 lb hammer in strict form, but by george he can't close this gripper..." I guess it is human nature to want to "see the strongman stumble".

Me myself, I would rather have Slim's phenomenal levering ability than my meager ability to close my #2 gripper. I remember when we were talking about this months ago and someone brought up Svend Karlson ("I heard that Svend Karlson can't take a #3 past parallel", or something like that), Pat said that he would gladly trade his COC rank for Svend's WSM 2001 title. I agree with Pat.

[supersqueeze]

Well said, Baldy!! Let's not forget that most of these stories are just rumors. In fact many of the rumors have been contested on this board by an extremely reputable board member who has personally known most of the greats. As you said "people want to see the strongman stumble" ... well, I'm NOT one of them! Anyone who can deadlift 900 lbs (Coan, Henry, etc.) or leaver a 28 lb hammer has done something MEASUREABLE and clearly has very strong hands. Nobody knows what closing a #3 gripper is other than hard. Many people have what they consider to be bigger fish to fry than a gripper. If grippers are your thing, great, but they're not for everyone you must remember.

Mike M.

[Guest woody36]

Coan back in 95 was doing timed holds with 465 for two sets

of 30 seconds duration one handed in a rack.

Guy's a Monster!

[RiotGrip]

I wasn't trying to talk any trash, or put myself on a pedastool.  I was simply recollecting what I remembered from a previous post.  Slim's achievements are better than anything I've achieved.  Besides I didn't start the topic, I just provided my input.

[Roark]

I began this thread hoping for comparative strength

levels to be reported. So far as I know, Slim does not

practice on the grippers, nor practice crushing move-

ments. I meant no slight at all to this great man, just

hoping for some info. It is interesting that people come to

his defense when he is not being attacked.

It appears to me, though, if he would really, really try,

he could set a Weaver stick record that would be off

the scale!

[Tom Black]

Sybersnott is right he didn't come around our table, but he did notice what was going on at our table because he made a comment during his show.  RiotGrip was referring to the time that I went to the York barbell strength spectacular.  Actually, I think I wrote about it in the Log, not a post.   I had the grippers there with me that day and what I remember now is that I didn't even pull them out, as RiotGrip said, Slim has nothing to prove too me.  I do recall that JD was testing some guys at the Dinner last year, but I don't remember the results.

[Guest baldy]

I wasn't trying to talk any trash, or put myself on a pedastool.  I was simply recollecting what I remembered from a previous post.  Slim's achievements are better than anything I've achieved.  Besides I didn't start the topic, I just provided my input.

Greg, this wasn't aimed at you. Nor was it aimed at Joe. Just a general remark that has been in the back of my mind whenever a topic like this comes up. If someone was just to step back and read some of the recent posts here in an objective manner you would see what I mean. When people say they seek out strong looking people just to hand them a gripper and watch them fail, then get the gripper back and shut it in front of them, that reeks of insecurity. If someone would have handed Rick Walker a #2 last year Rick might have failed, though his PL total would have probably been about 1200 lbs higher than the gripper owner's. Now with some gripper training Rick is closing his #3 and he still has the total, so who is better off?

As for "coming to Slim's defense" Joe, maybe that is the way you read it but that isn't the way it was meant. Someone with his ability doesn't need people "coming to his defense", his feats do that. Nor did I feel that Slim was attacked by anyone. It was just a place to put my 2 cents. Also, about the weaver stick, I remember David Horne posting about his overhead levering on some homemade pipe / bar device and it was huge. Seems like it was over 30 lbs. If his overhead levering is in Slim's league then maybe he could comment on the comparison between overhead levering and weaver stick lifts?

[Roark]

Well put.

Though there is a general base of grip strength

built by focusing on only one of the field's main

endeavors, there is not a ready crossover value

onto another of the enndeavors until training is

also focused on it also.

Perhaps Slim could not close the 2 if someone

handed it to him. But I suspect if he put his

determination to it, the handles would touch soon.

When I worked in radio we had some U of Illinois

football players come in for an interview, and I had

the old Ironman blue (like a 3), and the first thing I

would say is, 'I can't close this, but I keep trying to

find someone who can'. That took away the challenge.

One player could squat with 600 he said, and he hardly

budged the blue, and it bothered him more than somewhat.

It made me happy I had not said, "I can close this, can you'.

Of course, I try not to lie anyway.

[David Horne]

There is a similarity between lowering hammers to the head and the Weaver stick to the rear. Both tax ulna flexion, which is achieved by the flexor and extensor carpi ulnaris muscles. Well I'm pretty sure that's the names without getting a kinesiology book down from a shelf. I must admit that I don't like guessing what can be done because of....... I suppose I could let Steve Gardener have a go at the 35 1/4lb hammer apparatus if he wants when he comes up, since he holds the Iron Grip Weaver to rear record.

David

[Guest StrongerthanArne]

Baldy,

Regarding Svend Karlsens ability with grippers, I was told by Håkan Petschler, the Swedish representative for the IFSA, that although Svend failed to close a #3 (which I believe belonged to Magnus Samuelsson) he got it fairly close (to about 1/4) and, more importantly, got the #4 to well beyond 1/2 (good sweep in other words).

[RSW]

I would be more interested in seeing what kind of a bend Slim could put in an Ironmind Red nail.  Asking Slim to close a gripper is like having Carl Lewis run a marathon.  Slim's a great athlete, but he doesn't train grippers.

Robert

[Guest baldy]

David - Thanks for the input. I figured that the same groups were involved, yet the lifts differ at the same time. I would be curious how Steve would do on your setup, since he had the higher weaver stick lift at your competition last year.

Mikael - I was using Svend as an example because someone mentioned him in this context months ago. I am confident that if Svend had any desire he would crush a #3 in no time flat. I think that just about anyone at or near his level could if they would train grippers. Also I would imagine he would have a good sweep from his pl background and events training in strongman. While watching the 2001 finals my jaw dropped when Janie Virtanen (sp?)  said "Svend doesn't have very good grip" during the arm over arm vertical pull. I don't know where he got that idea.

Robert - You hit the nail on the head with your anology in your second sentence. If I could have witnessed firsthand such a stunning feat as what Slim did at the 2002 AOBS I couldn't imagine handing him a gripper afterwards.

[Roark]

Let's see, was the reverse true? Or did not Slim

ask Heath to try the hammers- which Heath was

willing to do?

[Sybersnott]

Slim called Heath onto the stage, and asked him to lever the sledge.  I'd be willing to bet 99 percent of the guys in that room couldn't do that feat either.  I was really hoping Tom Black would jump on stage and give it a try... but Slim looked at and called up Heath - probably on purpose.

[Roark]

So, why is no one crticizing Slim for challenging

someone regarding his specialty?

There would be no disrespect if someone had asked

Slim to try one of the grippers.

Goose/gander.

[RSW]

Roark,

                  I think it was part of the act to show that the  leverage was a very difficult feat. I think it was much gutsier of Slim to pick one of the stronger people in a crowd of strength athletes than from a typical crowd of spectators (as I assume he normally does).  I don't think he was trying to "show up" anyone.  I don't think anyone there could have lifted the 17lb sledge anyway.

             If grippers were part of some strongman's show, I am sure he would have audience members try  them to demonstrate the difficulty of the feat.

Robert

[Roark]

I did not imply he was trying to show up anyone,

but some have assumed the reverse- that someone

handing him a gripper would have been trying to show

him up.

[Guest baldy]

Good point Robert, that Slim probably picked the toughest looking person he saw nearby.

Joe, I only state that I wouldn't hand him a gripper. If someone else wants to that is their business. IMHO I have no right to put someone of his caliber to any test. He is a 70 year old... I mean 70 year young, Ray... strongman of incredible ability. His biggest shows were before I was even born. For me to ask him to do something that I have been working on for a year or two that is outside the realm of his specialty is (again, IMHO) disrespect. It would come off as a feeble attempt to make less of what he did. This is why I wouldn't do it, I can't speak for anyone else.

[Roark]

Tim,

All I am saying is- and this is just my opinion- whether

it is asking for a measurement or handing a gripper, if

either is  not attempted in the first place,

there was an opportunity missed.

So now, what we have to offer for history is, 'Yes at

the dinner there were abundant grippers, and a man

with some of the world's strongest wrists was there,

but it was deemed inappropriate to ask him (because

of the very age that causes his demonstrations to double

in awe?).

Bottom line: there was no advantage to having Slim and the

grippers in the same room at the same time so far as recorded

history is concerned.

I hope this does not sound harsh- that is not my intent. Just

opportunity missed. I do not see handing him a gripper as a

brash 'challenge', anymore than perhaps Slim saw asking Heath

to handle the hammers was such. Either endeavor is a specialty; I was

curious about crossover strength.

I am still curious. Here's how I would have handled it: Introduce myself, ask permission to 'feel' the hammers,

fail miserably (that's just a guess - then ask if he has ever

had a chance to grasp one of the grippers being bandied about

the room.

[Guest woody36]

I can't for one minute believe that Slim as never tried a gripper.... anybody asked him?

My opinion, i think the 2 wouldn't pose a problem to him!

All those years of extremely hard graft (work) and is toying

with the hammers.....but i could be wrong!