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Tommy J.

6th man to bench press 700#

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Stephen Anderson
21 minutes ago, Joseph Sullivan said:

He will be a human being. Some are faster, some are slower. Some are stronger, some are weaker. Some are fat, some are fit. We are all different and some are more blessed than others, this includes intelligence. Work with what you’ve been blessed with and CAPITALIZE ON IT BRUTTHAAAA!!!

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Hopefully

450 for a first time deadlift isn't that hard to believe for a guy with a big build. A little bit rare perhaps but certainly not ridiculous in any way. I have seen it myself. 

A 500 bench is definitely reasonable natty, however imo you would have to have very good genetics and train for a long time to do it. I have trained with plenty of good benchers and it would be a stretch to think that they would ever touch 500.

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Stephen Anderson
58 minutes ago, Hopefully said:

450 for a first time deadlift isn't that hard to believe for a guy with a big build. A little bit rare perhaps but certainly not ridiculous in any way. I have seen it myself. 

A 500 bench is definitely reasonable natty, however imo you would have to have very good genetics and train for a long time to do it. I have trained with plenty of good benchers and it would be a stretch to think that they would ever touch 500.

I came very close in college at 6’3 320 in my prime i was at 465-bench. Thats the most i had ever gotten. And i was in college there wasnt a ton of focus on it! 

 

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Hopefully
8 minutes ago, Stephen Anderson said:

I came very close in college at 6’3 320 in my prime i was at 465-bench. Thats the most i had ever gotten. And i was in college there wasnt a ton of focus on it! 

 

Yup, for sure possible. It would have to be a big guy like you though. 

Although I weigh around 225 atm, a good weight for my frame is around 175. So 500 won't happen for me. Unless I destroy my body and get up to around your weight. Then I could _maybe_ do it if I dedicate my all to that end. Like you though I dont care about it much anymore. 

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Joseph Sullivan
1 hour ago, Stephen Anderson said:

I came very close in college at 6’3 320 in my prime i was at 465-bench. Thats the most i had ever gotten. And i was in college there wasnt a ton of focus on it! 

 

That’s awesome! HUGE WEIGHT!!

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Mike Rinderle
5 hours ago, Goran Paulinič said:

You wish. But it doesn't go like that. Men struggle heavily with their bodyweight on first trainning. Men are not trolls. Ofcourse there are some trolls among us obviosly.

My wife, who had never lifted weights in her life, pulled 65kg on a 1.9" pipe axle the first time she ever tried.  I think you are way way way off on 65kg dl for the average man.  Unless you're testing the current population of Wuhan, China.

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Tommy J.
23 hours ago, Stephen Anderson said:

My first time to ever do a deadlift was when i was 15. I was 6’2 250. I managed to pull 450lbs. The first time i ever bench pressed was in the 7th grade i threw up 225. Ive never taken anything in my life. I dont even use protein powder... i agree with what has been said by some. That is that some people are just born gifted with certain abilities or it is passed down through genes. And some just have to work a hell of alot harder..

I believe it. I put a 500lb DL on par with a 315 bench. Most healthy guys can hit that natty without much fuss.

at 6’ and 220 at the time, I hit 405 after only 2 deadlift sessions and a couple workouts throwing standing bent rows in.

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Tommy J.
18 hours ago, WestSlope said:

Igor just touched up Mike's old record.

 

Thank you! Was not aware the record was surpassed. Only took almost 6 years.. 

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Tommy J.
19 hours ago, Climber028 said:

I think if the axle deadlift was popular we would have a 600lb lift shortly, it just doesn't draw enough attention for everybody to chase it. 

I’m not so sure about this.. low 500’s on the axle is still absolutely world class. And one of those guys was a pro strongman. Enhanced. Even if the pool of guys trying were larger, it’s gonna prove super difficult to find more strength talent than a huge enhanced strongman with a blue collar background. Blue collar background=many years using those hands heavily! + huge + podium strongman + enhanced + that focuses on grip is gonna be super rare to find anyone who can outdo his grip by a longshot of say 80lbs.

Edited by Tommy J.
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Tommy J.
18 hours ago, Royz said:

The whole PED thing is so disheartening. Every girl on instagram seems to deadlift 500lbs, every guy 800lbs or more. It's hard to believe all of those people are using PEDs. Maybe I'm a naive romantic but I like to believe there are genetic outliers out there that can do that stuff natural. With the current state of drug testing however we will never know for sure and personally I think that's extremely frustrating because I want to know what is really possible and what is not. I am however completely fed up with all of those people saying 'you just have to put in the hard work'. After training for 25+ years and focusing on the deadlift for the last 10 years I still haven't deadlifted 500lbs, so sadly it seems I'm a complete moron in terms of genetic ability. Well at least I can say I'm a lifetime drug free..

On the topic of the 700lbs bench. I doubt if Strickland will get it, he seems to have stagnated. I do however believe that Maddox will get the 800lbs bench. He still seems to have lot of momentum going despite being at the 750lbs level already.

 

He seems to be borderline refusing to put on any more weight tho.. almost as if he was holding out trying to be the lightest man to bench 700 raw. James hovers around 295-305ish. But now that Johnnie has done it at under 300lbs BW, James needs to just go ahead and put the weight on.

Edited by Tommy J.
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Tommy J.
18 hours ago, Royz said:

The whole PED thing is so disheartening. Every girl on instagram seems to deadlift 500lbs, every guy 800lbs or more. It's hard to believe all of those people are using PEDs. Maybe I'm a naive romantic but I like to believe there are genetic outliers out there that can do that stuff natural. With the current state of drug testing however we will never know for sure and personally I think that's extremely frustrating because I want to know what is really possible and what is not. I am however completely fed up with all of those people saying 'you just have to put in the hard work'. After training for 25+ years and focusing on the deadlift for the last 10 years I still haven't deadlifted 500lbs, so sadly it seems I'm a complete moron in terms of genetic ability. Well at least I can say I'm a lifetime drug free..

On the topic of the 700lbs bench. I doubt if Strickland will get it, he seems to have stagnated. I do however believe that Maddox will get the 800lbs bench. He still seems to have lot of momentum going despite being at the 750lbs level already.

 

And I somewhat agree here. I challenge anyone to go out and try to find a reliable source that sells it. And that also has his or her own strength accolades to even ensure they are selling real stuff. You’ll find that it’s not all that easy... Your better off trying to score pure PCP from a soccer mom or something. Every time I catch wind of a guy holding, I ask who they are. What lifts have they done. Are they an elite arm wrestler, PL’er, or do they have any kind of elite level sports background. The answer is always no. Mainly the “bros” holding are the sort of jacked gym rat that’s pushing 40 that can barely bench 315 or close a #2. So I’ll hold my money!

because if I’m gonna risk my health, it better be for something that brings SUBSTANTIAL strength gains. Not just some bro pecs or some veins.

Edited by Tommy J.
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Tommy J.
17 hours ago, Joseph Sullivan said:

I know a guy around my way. His name is Wyatt “Juggernaut”  Lozano. He is just over a 500 pound bench press, claims life time natural. Lifts in USAPL.  I believe he is  natural as bench is all he really does and he was around 400 pounds the whole time he’s been lifting. He is very vocal against roids and goes to schools to talk to kids about it. I know that means nothing to many , but I believe  he is natural. He is just a big dude, strong dude that’s been benching for many many years. 

Here he is at 22 doing 500 in comp.

And here he is today still around  the same weight of 505  7 years later... he has remained consistent and not benching 600 or 700. This is why I believe it. Total stagnation, but maintaining. Not like these Instagram tools that go from 150 bench to 500 in a few months we see so often. It ain’t happening. 

 

Dude benches exactly like Julius

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Tommy J.
16 hours ago, Mike Rinderle said:

I'm going to be completely honest here.  If I was that size and benching over 500 at age 22, there is no way I wouldn't use "supplements" and go after the world record.  I'd have to try.  I give him a lot of props for resisting the temptation.  If I had the potential to be the all time greatest at something like the bench press, I doubt very much I would stay natty. 

Based on the fact that I have middle of the road genetics in strength sports, my late entry into lifting, along with high BP, it hasn't been super tough to resist TRENing to someday reach the 14,000th highest bench press in history. 🤣

I have to agree here

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Tommy J.
16 hours ago, Stephen Anderson said:

100% agree and also find it very amusing! Most of the ones that say its not JUST genetic ability Are the same ones that weren’t blessed with any genetics... there are monsters in our midst but most are underground and dont like the publicity. 

Got one in my family like this, if he would get off the dope.. 

although given his past substance abuse I doubt he’d make a run at PL natty. 😔

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Tommy J.

Okay so with great benchers I see a bit of a trend with natural builds... either a huge watery looking gorilla, or a lean’ish 200lb or under guy, or a contortionist.

does this seem to be what everyone else is seeing also with the natty benchers that move big weight?

 

In my old bench thread I pointed out a factor on bench that I believe is hands down the best way to determine an elite bencher... and that is a double BW bench. It seems to me the only way to classify an elite bencher and spare any kind of lengthy debate at the same time. Way too many opinions on what weight is feasible for a natty bench. So calling a double BW bench elite sort of doesn’t open the natty/geared debate up. Because regardless of if natty or enhanced, it is FOR SURE still an elite bench. So I’m sticking to that.

 

so far, the mods have been overly loose with us in letting this go. And to that i say thank you (mods) for letting the thread run it’s course!

 

now that everyones .02 is in, let’s move on from the PED talk. If for nothing more than a show of gratitude to the mods. (Yeah I think for the first time ever I just sympathized with the mods..)

 

at some point I intend to make a bench thread of EVERY man who has done 700+ raw, either officially or unofficially. Including full details of meets/dates/locations/etc. And in it I may even add all the guys who have done it geared (geared as in equipment/not raw). I find it difficult when searching online to find that info in 1 place. Probably because it would be quite time consuming to put together.. but regardless, I think it would be really cool bench info to have here on the board. Hell, I may even get super bored at some point and even post all the official double BW benches.. 🤷🏼‍♂️

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Joseph Sullivan
2 hours ago, Tommy J. said:

Dude benches exactly like Julius

I noticed that as well. 

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Mike Rinderle
2 hours ago, Tommy J. said:

I have to agree here

I watched Westside vs. The World again last night.  The absolute hell those guys put themselves through just to get their name on the chalk board was very relatable. Say what you want about their methods or equipped vs raw, the guys at that gym were a testament to just how far someone is willing to go to be the best at something that 99% of the population couldn't give a crap about.  The human being that is motivated will go to great lengths to be number 1 at whatever they think is important (from pl, to grip, to science, to playing some video game in mom's basement). I think it is why we progress as a species.  There are those crazy humans out there always pushing the limits, often at great harm to themselves.

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Joseph Sullivan
3 hours ago, Tommy J. said:

I’m not so sure about this.. low 500’s on the axle is still absolutely world class. And one of those guys was a pro strongman. Enhanced. Even if the pool of guys trying were larger, it’s gonna prove super difficult to find more strength talent than a huge enhanced strongman with a blue collar background. Blue collar background=many years using those hands heavily! + huge + podium strongman + enhanced + that focuses on grip is gonna be super rare to find anyone who can outdo his grip by a longshot of say 80lbs.

Totally and 100% times 10 Agree with this statement. No way 600 is happening anytime soon by anyone no matter how many throw their hat in the proverbial grip ring!!!

Edited by Joseph Sullivan

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Climber028
4 hours ago, Tommy J. said:

I’m not so sure about this.. low 500’s on the axle is still absolutely world class. And one of those guys was a pro strongman. Enhanced. Even if the pool of guys trying were larger, it’s gonna prove super difficult to find more strength talent than a huge enhanced strongman with a blue collar background. Blue collar background=many years using those hands heavily! + huge + podium strongman + enhanced + that focuses on grip is gonna be super rare to find anyone who can outdo his grip by a longshot of say 80lbs.

By soon, I meant in a bunch of years if the axle was as popular as the deadlift currently is. I don't for a second think there's somone walking around now that can pull 600, I just think that some human could possibly do it. 

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Joseph Sullivan
33 minutes ago, Climber028 said:

By soon, I meant in a bunch of years if the axle was as popular as the deadlift currently is. I don't for a second think there's somone walking around now that can pull 600, I just think that some human could possibly do it. 

I don’t think we will ever see it.... but who knows. The guy would have to be the size of Andre the Giant with 10 inch hands .

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Tommy J.
1 hour ago, Mike Rinderle said:

I watched Westside vs. The World again last night.  The absolute hell those guys put themselves through just to get their name on the chalk board was very relatable. Say what you want about their methods or equipped vs raw, the guys at that gym were a testament to just how far someone is willing to go to be the best at something that 99% of the population couldn't give a crap about.  The human being that is motivated will go to great lengths to be number 1 at whatever they think is important (from pl, to grip, to science, to playing some video game in mom's basement). I think it is why we progress as a species.  There are those crazy humans out there always pushing the limits, often at great harm to themselves.

Out of likes for the day so I left you hangin’ on that.

i was reluctant to give Westside the time of day before. But after watching that documentary and also listening to first hand accounts of those around that guy, I absolutely cannot refute that LS is on another level with getting people stronger.. that dude can bring a guy benching 400 to benching 600 in less than a year and a half! Crazy!

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Tommy J.
37 minutes ago, Climber028 said:

By soon, I meant in a bunch of years if the axle was as popular as the deadlift currently is. I don't for a second think there's somone walking around now that can pull 600, I just think that some human could possibly do it. 

Ah okay I can agree with that. To add to it, I think 800lb raw bench, and maybe even near a 500k raw DL is possible for some brute out there. In time.

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Tommy J.
46 minutes ago, Climber028 said:

By soon, I meant in a bunch of years if the axle was as popular as the deadlift currently is. I don't for a second think there's somone walking around now that can pull 600, I just think that some human could possibly do it. 

So I think Rich Williams is credited with an unofficial 600lb axle lift?... someone maybe could correct me on that or clarify?

seems odd tho. Considering nothing he’s done officially is anywhere near that.

edit: or has he ever even done an axle officially?

double edit: scratch that. He obviously has. He was previous WR holder on the axle.

Edited by Tommy J.

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Mike Rinderle
6 minutes ago, Tommy J. said:

Out of likes for the day so I left you hangin’ on that.

i was reluctant to give Westside the time of day before. But after watching that documentary and also listening to first hand accounts of those around that guy, I absolutely cannot refute that LS is on another level with getting people stronger.. that dude can bring a guy benching 400 to benching 600 in less than a year and a half! Crazy!

Yea, he gets painted as a multiply coach only.  The simple fact is, that's where powerlifting was in the 80s and 90s when he was coaching the best athletes.  I have no doubt that if raw powerlifting would have been dominant at the time, that he would have found the proper training protocols to still be the strongest gym in the world.  Or died trying.

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Tommy J.
4 minutes ago, Mike Rinderle said:

Yea, he gets painted as a multiply coach only.  The simple fact is, that's where powerlifting was in the 80s and 90s when he was coaching the best athletes.  I have no doubt that if raw powerlifting would have been dominant at the time, that he would have found the proper training protocols to still be the strongest gym in the world.  Or died trying.

No doubt

Westside

”the strongest 800 square feet in the world”

Edited by Tommy J.
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