Seasonong Of Grippers

[Old Dax]

Hi Matt,

I note that the rating service includes 30 closes before the reading is taken, have you ever checked what the drop off (if there is one) actually is? Is it repeatable; one reason I ask is to give an indication of how much harder a CoC straight out of the packet would be expected to be? according to your chart your ratings for a #3 average at 148lb (ranging from 139-156lb) so would straight out of the pack be a large enough shift to impact?

[Old Dax]

SEASONING! (clumsy typing!)

[gerryg]

I can't currently find the topic but I remember reading about RICHAZ rating his GHPs and re-rating them after x amount of closes, if my memory is correct the numbers stayed pretty close.

[climber511]

If Matt chest crushes all the grippers he rates - he should have pecs like a porn star by now

[Electron]

GHPs are already seasoned and pulled when they're packaged. That's not an accurate set of data, because you're comparing seasoned grippers with slightly more seasoned grippers.

[Cannon]

Good question Old Dax.

Here are a few things that I would call "observations."

If the gripper is going to lose any spread, that seems to happen literally on the first rep or in the first couple reps.

After there are about 10-15 reps on a gripper, I can't remember a time where the rating was affected by more reps until the reps get into the hundreds and hundreds. So we picked 30+ to safely get into a working range and also get the oil coverage nice. As the spring opens on each rep the oil can really get in there deep.

Regarding a new versus used gripper, the biggest difference is oil. Getting the spring nice and cleaned and oiled is probably the most important part about the seasoning process we do. You can usually get back to a "cleaned and oiled" state and therefore hope for a comparable rating. If you're going to let a gripper sit around and get grungy, or rate the gripper in that condition, there's almost no point in taking the rating. Most new grippers, even GHPs, have fairly dry springs.

Finally, I do feel like grippers get weaker over time with hundreds and hundreds of reps. I wish I had a better number to ballpark that but I'm just working from observation that any gripper I've ever had that I rated, then used extensively, then rated again was lower. This held true once we started the Rate and Return program. We got a chance to re-rate grippers that people had bought new from CPW. They were always a few pounds lower.

[Old Dax]

Thanks Matt,

so your saying it's going to be, say, around 5lb difference? not really enough to be of concern for someone hoping to cert on a #3?

Dave

[climber511]

I never found much change until I left some of mine in chokers for a couple years - when I rerated them they were weaker - I don't remember numbers but weaker.

[Cannon]

Thanks Matt,

so your saying it's going to be, say, around 5lb difference? not really enough to be of concern for someone hoping to cert on a #3?

Dave

If I were going for a #3 cert, I would want to oil the spring (which I believe IronMind confirmed is allowed) and close the gripper a couple times in the off hand or chest crush. I do think it could make a difference of 5 lbs depending on the gripper. That's something you can definitely feel in the hand.

[Mohamed Diab]

Good question Old Dax.

Here are a few things that I would call "observations."

If the gripper is going to lose any spread, that seems to happen literally on the first rep or in the first couple reps.

After there are about 10-15 reps on a gripper, I can't remember a time where the rating was affected by more reps until the reps get into the hundreds and hundreds. So we picked 30+ to safely get into a working range and also get the oil coverage nice. As the spring opens on each rep the oil can really get in there deep.

Regarding a new versus used gripper, the biggest difference is oil. Getting the spring nice and cleaned and oiled is probably the most important part about the seasoning process we do. You can usually get back to a "cleaned and oiled" state and therefore hope for a comparable rating. If you're going to let a gripper sit around and get grungy, or rate the gripper in that condition, there's almost no point in taking the rating. Most new grippers, even GHPs, have fairly dry springs.

Finally, I do feel like grippers get weaker over time with hundreds and hundreds of reps. I wish I had a better number to ballpark that but I'm just working from observation that any gripper I've ever had that I rated, then used extensively, then rated again was lower. This held true once we started the Rate and Return program. We got a chance to re-rate grippers that people had bought new from CPW. They were always a few pounds lower.

How about the dog leg , did you try to rate a gripper by placing the weights on both handles and see if there is a difference ?

[slazbob]

Thanks Matt,

so your saying it's going to be, say, around 5lb difference? not really enough to be of concern for someone hoping to cert on a #3?

Dave

If I were going for a #3 cert, I would want to oil the spring (which I believe IronMind confirmed is allowed) and close the gripper a couple times in the off hand or chest crush. I do think it could make a difference of 5 lbs depending on the gripper. That's something you can definitely feel in the hand.

Matt-

If you mean oil the spring after you open it, for your cert, I think Randall said that wasn't allowed.

Loan was saying that if he was allowed to oil his no.4 he could close it...but he wasn't allowed.

Just going off memory...

Edited December 5, 2014 by slazbob

[climber511]

Thanks Matt,

so your saying it's going to be, say, around 5lb difference? not really enough to be of concern for someone hoping to cert on a #3?

Dave

If I were going for a #3 cert, I would want to oil the spring (which I believe IronMind confirmed is allowed) and close the gripper a couple times in the off hand or chest crush. I do think it could make a difference of 5 lbs depending on the gripper. That's something you can definitely feel in the hand.

Matt-

If you mean oil the spring after you open it, for your cert, I think Randall said that wasn't allowed.

Loan was saying that if he was allowed to oil his no.4 he could close it...but he wasn't allowed.

Just going off memory...

I thought Randal said it was OK to put a drop of oil on the spring and give it a few chest crushes before a cert attempt - but my memory isn't known for its accuracy . Should probably ask again.

[acorn]

Thanks Matt,

so your saying it's going to be, say, around 5lb difference? not really enough to be of concern for someone hoping to cert on a #3?

Dave

If I were going for a #3 cert, I would want to oil the spring (which I believe IronMind confirmed is allowed) and close the gripper a couple times in the off hand or chest crush. I do think it could make a difference of 5 lbs depending on the gripper. That's something you can definitely feel in the hand.

Matt-

If you mean oil the spring after you open it, for your cert, I think Randall said that wasn't allowed.

Loan was saying that if he was allowed to oil his no.4 he could close it...but he wasn't allowed.

Just going off memory...

I thought Randal said it was OK to put a drop of oil on the spring and give it a few chest crushes before a cert attempt - but my memory isn't known for its accuracy . Should probably ask again.

That's what I remember too. But if is not in writing the judges may not be aware of this. Or Randall may have changed his mind since saying this.

- Aaron

[slazbob]

I believe I read that as well, but changed it because the factory gripper is oiled, not a bunch, but oiled with a finish.

[slazbob]

He just commented over on the IronMind forum.

In principle, it IS allowed.

[Cannon]

Good question Old Dax.

Here are a few things that I would call "observations."

If the gripper is going to lose any spread, that seems to happen literally on the first rep or in the first couple reps.

After there are about 10-15 reps on a gripper, I can't remember a time where the rating was affected by more reps until the reps get into the hundreds and hundreds. So we picked 30+ to safely get into a working range and also get the oil coverage nice. As the spring opens on each rep the oil can really get in there deep.

Regarding a new versus used gripper, the biggest difference is oil. Getting the spring nice and cleaned and oiled is probably the most important part about the seasoning process we do. You can usually get back to a "cleaned and oiled" state and therefore hope for a comparable rating. If you're going to let a gripper sit around and get grungy, or rate the gripper in that condition, there's almost no point in taking the rating. Most new grippers, even GHPs, have fairly dry springs.

Finally, I do feel like grippers get weaker over time with hundreds and hundreds of reps. I wish I had a better number to ballpark that but I'm just working from observation that any gripper I've ever had that I rated, then used extensively, then rated again was lower. This held true once we started the Rate and Return program. We got a chance to re-rate grippers that people had bought new from CPW. They were always a few pounds lower.

How about the dog leg , did you try to rate a gripper by placing the weights on both handles and see if there is a difference ?

I've experimented with that extensively. There is no difference.

[Old Dax]

I wouldn't have expected a difference on the dogleg side on the test rig, however it may feel different. I guess if the natural inclination of a gripper is to twist a little (in the hand) testing in a rig would not reproduce it. As a consequence I would GUESS (and its only a guess) that two grippers of the same rating would feel different in L or R hand if one was Righty and the other Lefty.

Of course 'feel' could also be affected by how the closing force changes with degree of closure, i.e. two grippers with the same RGC rating (i.e. at the closed position) might feel different if the difficulty ramped up differently.

[richcottrell]

Could you take a new gripper and if it were to rate higher then you wanted, do you think you could take that new gripper and make it "weaker" by using the RGC rating device as a tool?

For example:

Say the new gripper initially rates at 110 (after the normal oil and first 30 reps in the RGC rig). You then slide the webbing up on the handle so the weight is more in the middle of the top handle instead of on the end. You add enough weight so the handles will touch again, and then you toss on extra weight and give the gripper a small beating.

Maybe you could even leave the gripper closed in the RGC with the weight hanging for a longer amount of time.

Because the webbing is in the middle on the handle, even with the handles touching, would the extra weight continue to compress the spring past its normal range?

And could this extra stress "detune" the spring enough to lower the original 110 rating of the gripper in the example?

[mobsterone]

At a guess logic suggest your ideas works if the handles bend. They don't.