Mikael Siversson Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 What records besides the Europinch would you like to see record lists of? If we include grippers I suggest we limit the width range to, say, 65-75mm or thereabouts. I am happy to add Redneck Calibrated gripper data (eg TNS, 20mm block etc.) if there is interest. Same with vbars (LGC 25, 50mm, FBBC 1'', 2'') and perhaps Apollon's Axle (as long as the weights are properly calibrated). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdfk20 Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 Rolling Thunder, Rim Lift, Plateau Buster (don't own one of these yet, but looks like a nifty bit of kit) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cannon Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Grippers, Axle, 2" vbar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 (edited) Yes I think those are good choices Matt as long as we stick to one standardised axle (eg Ironminds). The big problem with the RT Pete, is that the handles not only vary a lot when new but they degrade very rapidly with usage. It is almost pointless using calibrated weights for RT records. When it comes to DH's griptopz we have the issue of dilution of the significance of a WR. He is likely to produce new products perhaps on a yearly basis and we may end up with a very large number of grip WR, each of moderate significance. I am happy to go with the flow though if the rest of you want to include them. They are already recorded though on World of Grip. For the axle I suggest that we adhere to strict PL deadlift rules rather than allowing the lifter to return the bar immediately to the floor. There is a video clip of Janne Virtanen performing a very heavy and very strict DO axle deadlift. I am happy to include grippers but I suggest that we limit the handle width range; what about 65-75mm? Grippers, Axle, 2" vbar. Edited July 21, 2011 by Mikael Siversson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odin Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Grippers/Vulcan 2HP 1HP DO Axle DL One-Hand Axle DL One-Hand Olympic bar DL-no hook grip (perhaps only certain brands of bars such as Leoko and Eleiko) 2" vbar RT (may need both "brand new" & "seasoned" lists ) Thumbless RT (used as wrist event in Europe) Wrist Developer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cannon Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I am happy to include grippers but I suggest that we limit the handle width range; what about 65-75mm? Grippers, Axle, 2" vbar. I wasn't sure what you meant by handle width range. You mean 65-75mm spread, nothing about set width? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 (edited) Spread yes. We could include TNS and perhaps various block widths (easier to judge, I can imagine, than MM set). I am happy to include grippers but I suggest that we limit the handle width range; what about 65-75mm? Grippers, Axle, 2" vbar. I wasn't sure what you meant by handle width range. You mean 65-75mm spread, nothing about set width? Edited July 21, 2011 by Mikael Siversson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cannon Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Spread yes. Why limit the spread if a set is allowed? If anything I think the set should be limited. MMS or wider (or whatever). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 The spread is important. For example, if we used a 20mm block it is harder to close a 150lb gripper with a 3'' spread than it is to close a 150lb gripper with a 2 3/4'' spread. Spread yes. Why limit the spread if a set is allowed? If anything I think the set should be limited. MMS or wider (or whatever). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdfk20 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Has anyone tried the V2 yet? Its a bit wider and with my small hands, I can't achieve my normal set technique. If this gripper is implemented in competition, I will be in trouble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cannon Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Has anyone tried the V2 yet? Its a bit wider and with my small hands, I can't achieve my normal set technique. If this gripper is implemented in competition, I will be in trouble We'll be sailing in that boat together! I already have loads of problems with the existing Vulcan. Oh well. It's my Achilles' Heel! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Lipinski Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 I don't think gripper spread should matter. Only body weight matters in grip events, so lighter guys should have no problem with wide grippers compared to each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdfk20 Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 I don't think gripper spread should matter. Only body weight matters in grip events, so lighter guys should have no problem with wide grippers compared to each other. Spread is more to do with hand length, or rather the distance from the thumb to the second metacarpal of the index finger. That is if you use the technique where you clamp down on the gripper as you hook the front handle with the index finger. With the V2 the spread is further than I can reach with my index finger, whilst keeping my thumb clamped on the rear handle. I therefore can't generate any power in setting this gripper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted July 22, 2011 Author Share Posted July 22, 2011 Bob, I knew you would not be able to resist having a sneak peak. You can join us too if you cut back on the dessert. I don't think gripper spread should matter. Only body weight matters in grip events, so lighter guys should have no problem with wide grippers compared to each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted July 22, 2011 Author Share Posted July 22, 2011 (edited) Pete, I will you a more extreme example that explains why the spread matters with a set. Imagine we have two grippers, both measured at 150lb. We are using a 30mm block set. One of the grippers has a 75mm set whereas the other one has only a 31mm set. Imagine how easy it would be setting the latter gripper. This is why, all other things being equal, it is harder to set (and therefore close) a gripper with a wider spread at a given rating. Setting a gripper with a 31mm spread to 30mm would require minimal force. I don't think gripper spread should matter. Only body weight matters in grip events, so lighter guys should have no problem with wide grippers compared to each other. Spread is more to do with hand length, or rather the distance from the thumb to the second metacarpal of the index finger. That is if you use the technique where you clamp down on the gripper as you hook the front handle with the index finger. With the V2 the spread is further than I can reach with my index finger, whilst keeping my thumb clamped on the rear handle. I therefore can't generate any power in setting this gripper. Edited July 22, 2011 by Mikael Siversson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cannon Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 I don't think gripper spread should matter. Only body weight matters in grip events, so lighter guys should have no problem with wide grippers compared to each other. My line of thinking as well. Pete, I will you a more extreme example that explains why the spread matters with a set. Imagine we have two grippers, both measured at 150lb. We are using a 30mm block set. One of the grippers has a 75mm set whereas the other one has only a 31mm set. Imagine how easy it would be setting the latter gripper. This is why, all other things being equal, it is harder to set (and therefore close) a gripper with a wider spread at a given rating. Setting a gripper with a 31mm spread to 30mm would require minimal force. I thought you were saying there should be a MAX spread limit, but this sounds like you're saying there should be a MIN spread limit which I agree with. No narrow grippers allowed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted July 22, 2011 Author Share Posted July 22, 2011 (edited) There should be a MAX and MIN limit. Grippers average around 70mm or thereabouts so we could e.g., have a 65-75mm range (the narrower range the better but we have to be practical about it). It is typically much harder to set (down to a predetermined set such as 20mm) a 150lb gripper with a 3'' spread than it is to set a 150lb gripper with a 2 1/2'' spread. Percentage wise you are closer to the max resistance with the 3'' spread gripper at 20mm than you are with the 2 1/2'' gripper. I don't think gripper spread should matter. Only body weight matters in grip events, so lighter guys should have no problem with wide grippers compared to each other. My line of thinking as well. Pete, I will you a more extreme example that explains why the spread matters with a set. Imagine we have two grippers, both measured at 150lb. We are using a 30mm block set. One of the grippers has a 75mm set whereas the other one has only a 31mm set. Imagine how easy it would be setting the latter gripper. This is why, all other things being equal, it is harder to set (and therefore close) a gripper with a wider spread at a given rating. Setting a gripper with a 31mm spread to 30mm would require minimal force. I thought you were saying there should be a MAX spread limit, but this sounds like you're saying there should be a MIN spread limit which I agree with. No narrow grippers allowed. Edited July 22, 2011 by Mikael Siversson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted July 22, 2011 Author Share Posted July 22, 2011 (edited) Matt do you have the data (brand and spread) for the hardest gripper with a normal spread (i.e., 65-75mm) that you closed at the Nationals? The GM2 is a narrow spread gripper (62mm). I will also add Daniel's 154.1 gripper when he provides me with the spread data for that gripper. From experience I know that it will be too much work if I have to track down all the data myself for all records we may end up keeping keep track of. Edited July 22, 2011 by Mikael Siversson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdfk20 Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 (edited) Thanks Mikael, I wasn't born yesterday , I do understand and agree with you that there should be a minimum set, and that wider grippers are of course harder to set. I was just alighting (perhaps not clear enough) to the fact that once a gripper becomes too wide, I don't stand a chance of setting it at all (due to hand size and the distance between thumb and index). On my one go with the V2 last week, this looked to be the case, the spread crosses some critical wideness whereby I'm unable to set it due to hand size. Most grippers are around the 3" wideness, the V2 is 3.6". I absolutely agree that there should be a min. wideness, and my setting ability is pretty good in the normal range, as Iv practiced it over the years(can set a #4 to parallel for an extreme neg. ) This probably sounds whiny, and I will have to find a way to modify my set technique to cope with these super wide grippers. But It would be fairer to the guys with smaller hands if spread was consistent. Edited July 22, 2011 by Pete1006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted July 22, 2011 Author Share Posted July 22, 2011 That's why we should have an upper limit as well (I suggest 75mm). I was just alighting (perhaps not clear enough) to the fact that once a gripper becomes too wide, I don't stand a chance of setting it at all (due to hand size and the distance between thumb and index). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cannon Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 Matt do you have the data (brand and spread) for the hardest gripper with a normal spread (i.e., 65-75mm) that you closed at the Nationals? The GM2 is a narrow spread gripper (62mm). No, I have no idea what it was at all. It was practically a warm up and then I totally botched my other attempts. My best gripper close in competition was #3, 149lbs, normal spread at Adam's decathlon in May. If you really need the exact spread, Adam would probably measure it if I asked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted July 22, 2011 Author Share Posted July 22, 2011 (edited) I will only include results from competitions where the competitors were weighed on a calibrated scale (even though it may be obvious that they weigh below 82.5k). I assume your weight was not checked by Adam on the day using a calibrated scale. In the past I have performed all sorts of grip feats at below 82.5k in competition, including above bodyweight RT pulls, 140k+ 25mm LGC vbar lifts etc. but I am certainly not including any of those as I was not weighed on a calibrated scale. We are only including results performed after DH introduced the 82.5k class and where the competitors were weighed on a calibrated scale. Matt do you have the data (brand and spread) for the hardest gripper with a normal spread (i.e., 65-75mm) that you closed at the Nationals? The GM2 is a narrow spread gripper (62mm). No, I have no idea what it was at all. It was practically a warm up and then I totally botched my other attempts. My best gripper close in competition was #3, 149lbs, normal spread at Adam's decathlon in May. If you really need the exact spread, Adam would probably measure it if I asked. Edited July 22, 2011 by Mikael Siversson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cannon Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 I will only include results from competitions where the competitors were weighed on a calibrated scale (even though it may be obvious that they weigh below 82.5k). I assume your weight was not checked by Adam on the day using a calibrated scale. In the past I have performed all sorts of grip feats at below 82.5k in competition, including above bodyweight RT pulls, 140k+ 25mm LGC vbar lifts etc. but I am certainly not including any of those as I was not weighed on a calibrated scale. We are only including results performed after DH introduced the 82.5k class and where the competitors were weighed on a calibrated scale. Matt do you have the data (brand and spread) for the hardest gripper with a normal spread (i.e., 65-75mm) that you closed at the Nationals? The GM2 is a narrow spread gripper (62mm). No, I have no idea what it was at all. It was practically a warm up and then I totally botched my other attempts. My best gripper close in competition was #3, 149lbs, normal spread at Adam's decathlon in May. If you really need the exact spread, Adam would probably measure it if I asked. I was weighed on a scale that day. And I believe that Adam has stated in other threads that it's calibrated. But the challenge would be finding the number. I think it was 161 but I definitely didn't note any decimal. I think it's a lost cause and I'll track things properly for the four contests Adam has remaining this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted July 23, 2011 Author Share Posted July 23, 2011 The weight itself is not important as long as it was 82.5k or less. The scale must be calibrated. I will ask Adam. I will only include results from competitions where the competitors were weighed on a calibrated scale (even though it may be obvious that they weigh below 82.5k). I assume your weight was not checked by Adam on the day using a calibrated scale. In the past I have performed all sorts of grip feats at below 82.5k in competition, including above bodyweight RT pulls, 140k+ 25mm LGC vbar lifts etc. but I am certainly not including any of those as I was not weighed on a calibrated scale. We are only including results performed after DH introduced the 82.5k class and where the competitors were weighed on a calibrated scale. Matt do you have the data (brand and spread) for the hardest gripper with a normal spread (i.e., 65-75mm) that you closed at the Nationals? The GM2 is a narrow spread gripper (62mm). No, I have no idea what it was at all. It was practically a warm up and then I totally botched my other attempts. My best gripper close in competition was #3, 149lbs, normal spread at Adam's decathlon in May. If you really need the exact spread, Adam would probably measure it if I asked. I was weighed on a scale that day. And I believe that Adam has stated in other threads that it's calibrated. But the challenge would be finding the number. I think it was 161 but I definitely didn't note any decimal. I think it's a lost cause and I'll track things properly for the four contests Adam has remaining this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Lipinski Posted July 23, 2011 Share Posted July 23, 2011 No way I can hit 181 and keep any strength! I have been too fat too long. I will play along though, and calibrate a scale at WSH if anyone within range shows up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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