#4 Found

[Roark]

It has long been asserted here that with the wide range of

variances of the grippers (regardless of manufacturer) the

fair test to compare strength would be for each competitor to

try his hand at the same gripper, or same several grippers.

How wonderful that Kinney's #4 is again on the radar screen.

I for one think Heath could close it later this morning if he had

access to it. Perhaps Horne could too, and others?

There is one way to find out.

[Arthur Antonopoulos]

Ok Joe, are you saying Kinney's stolen #4 has been found or am I missing something here?

If that is the case I am surprised at the lack of interest this thread has aroused.

Arthur

[Roark]

Arthur,

It is mentioned in the newest Ironmind catalog, as a heading to the photo [of it], that,

"We had heard a rumor that the No.4 Captains of Crush gripper that Joe Kinney closed in his video a) didn't exist b) had been tampered with, c) was unusually weak, and d) all of the above."

Then a 'here it is', and b it is well used and in fine health and c 'when we recently retested it, it came in at full strength' [no numbers of gauge offered, just 'full strength'] and d 'anyone who says anything to the contrary is misinformed or has an axe to grind'.

Joe himself told me his first #4 was missing and indicated it had been

stolen. Therefore, the #4 he closed was the one shown in the photo,

[i assume]which he had loaned to a friend, he told me. Apparently the gripper has been returned to him.

Not sure why the lack of response to my first post about this. It surprises me to hear that anyone did not think it existed, but given the

mystery about the situation, some data about 'c' would be helpful, but

the best test would be for those who are close to closing other 4's to

have a shot a Joe's 4. Perhaps Joe would allow this, but no mention was made of such an offer.

[KJM]

Joe,

I may be asking a question to which you do not have the answer but, how did Ironmind get ahold of that gripper?

[Tom Black]

I don't think they did, it probably is in Kinney's possesion. I thought it probably was a picture that Kinney took and sent in, but when I looked at the caption just now the photo was taken by Dr. Strossen. Hmm, maybe he finally paid Mr. Kinney a visit, doesn't Kinney have a wood pile? Look for an upcoming article.

[KJM]

Sorry Tom, I do not have either the new Milo or catalog yet (always get them late) but was going on what I've read here. Strossen may have the rights to the pictures that Kinney took and posted them accordingly.

[Bearcat 74]

Or, Kinney could've sent him his gripper.

[Patrik_F]

What was the story about Kinney first losing his gripper that he "certified" with and then buying another #4 and closing that one too?

I heard something like that for some time ago.

I am getting confused here , so now he has found the first gripper? Or is the one in the Ironmind catalouge the second one? Is there a second one at all?!?

[Arthur Antonopoulos]

Thanks for the clear up Joe. I saw the pic in the latest MILO catalogue but really didn't read anything past the first few lines as I assumed that it was just an old photo of the #4 he closed. From memory it looked pretty well used.

It does certainly seem that someone is following the trends of thought on the Gripboard regarding the Kinney closure of the #4. I see this a positive thing, especially if it has resulted in the original gripper been rediscovered. I don't know about point a) but point b) and c) have been discussed here numerous times and I'd be confident enough to say that I don't think such broad discussions on the issue are discussed elsewhere.

Passing the gripper to people who have experience with training with the #4 would be nice, just to see how it compares to others. I hesitate to make assumptions, but being an older model #4 I'd say it would most probably be a stronger rather than weaker one, but that remains to be seen by people who could quantify it. Whether this would be allowed remains to be seen.

It is sad in a way that such a tremendous feat had to be questioned so extensively, but in the end whether people judge Kinney's #4 or not, questions will still arise regarding his close. I also doubt the sceptics will ever be satisfied until Kinney reproduces his feat again in front of people who they deem to be suitable to evaluate the feat and certify it. And from what I hear, that is most likely not going to happen.

I can't pass judgement on the feat, but I do believe that the #4 can be closed and that it will be closed again sometime soon.

Arthur

[The Gripster]

From reading the old posts from the old board and seeing Heath Sexton's progress, I really believe he will be the next one to close it.

[amaury]

Gripster,

I think both Heath Sexton and Nathan (or even Craig?) Holle seem to be on their way to close the #4 soon.

Better still: they are members of the board so we are going to have a grandstand view of it !

[bender]

I'm pretty sure I figured it all out:

IronMind stole Kinney's Gripper!!!

[Roark]

When only the original Inch 172 existed very few people had access to it, and it wasn't exactly something to be linked onto a watch fob and carried hither and yon. So if you wanted a shot at it, you waited until

it was on hand at a public show, or you visited the owner.

Probably, the quantity of Inch replicas is the same as the quantity of

#4s (guess on my part). The #4 is transportable, but it is not likely,

nor should it be likely, that Joe Kinney be required to travel to every

town where itchy fingers cry out for a try.

Perhaps, those of you interested, could speak to him about making

it available at a show near him, or you could travel to him, if he agrees.

Otherwise, the discussion will drag on more than a caveman bringing

home a new date.

If he agrees to one of those scenarios, we can determine if his #4 is

closer to Heath's or to mine, which Heath determined was 'two tons'

harder than his, or whether it is easier or harder. If he does not agree, then the market-driving mystery continues.

The 172 replicas weigh about 172, very close tolerance in most cases.

The same, apparently, canot be said of the resistance levels of the

#4s.

[Sybersnott]

Here's the REAL story folks:

It seems that when Kinney allegedly closed the #4, there were many witnesses present - some of them took pictures, and one of them - Zapruder had the most incredible video of it all.

It clearly shows Kinney walking past the woodpile, when suddenly... from the grassy knoll Sybersnott took aim and klonked Kinney with a well placed gripper! The #4 that was in Kinney's hand was then stolen by Sybersnott, and Kinney, who was now unconcious... did not know what happened to the gripper (this gripper will now be known as the "magic gripper"). Kinney was rushed to the hospital barely alive babbling that he HAD in fact closed the #4. But where was it? The Warren (Tetting) Comission had determined that Strossen was the umbrella man, and had all the dastardly goods on Sybersnott... and if Sybersnott didn't turn over the gripper he would be banned forever from purchasing any products by Ironmind. Sybersnott buckled, and turned over the gripper which was locked in a secret bank safe deposit box for the past few years.

And now you know the TRUTH, the whole truth... and nothing but the truth!

[mobsterone]

The commision may well be satisfied with your answers but I suggest retiring to the NCB shelter in the garden and preparing for gods own pedants questions.

All joking aside...

There will be, as has been said, a small faction of, for the most part made up of those who wish they could but cannot, people who will question every feat of strength. With the exception of Roark and his penchant (and therefore usefullness) for historical accuracy, most are of the type who will been seen in gyms riding the bike for an hour (meaning to warmup), training half heartidly (and wondering why they don't grow or get strong) and raising an eyebrow when some 250 lb behemoth lifts a huge weight with something less than perfect form (as described in an ancient book by their pre-historical hero). This is why we (I say we as I will try not to but occasionally find myself being pulled in - join us they whisper) have the long winded and drawn out discussions on bar length blah, blah.

That said (my attempt at pedentry) I suspect Randalls reasons are, get this, financial. Ta da!! Quell surpris'e! Imagine him admitting in the brochure he pays for and in which he is trying to sell items that he was wrong. I can do that here and in my mg because neither affect my income, pay the bills etc. But Randall - I suspect it is his main source of income and like Inch (who made a living from his lies) he will have no wish to shut the door on that souce.

Would it make a difference which CoC 4 Joe has shut? Not really as no one has shut any of those that are available.

[Roark]

Steve,

Right, Joe is the only one who has closed a 4. Would it make a

difference if he closed one of the easier or harder ones? Only if

the 4's that have not been closed are all harder than his, and he

therefore has closed the easiest 4 in existance. I don't have a

clue if that is the case.

[mobsterone]

So, as per my suggestion of many months ago, work to shut what yer got and not to worry about anyone else. To the best of my knowledge and now ready to be corrected at the drop of a hat, Joe concentrated on one thing - the CoC 4. I and others, I suspect, do not.

Other than historical accuracy how much does it matter? I'd hate to see the many minds here wasted worrying about it when they would be better served using their mental energy focusing on becoming better grip masters.

We know its almost possible as so many here (4-5) are so very close with 4-5mm (Baraban Roberts), Heath Sexton, one of the Holle brothers?, David Horne and myself all within 3/4 to 1/2 inch. So serve yourself better by guessimating when as opposed to if ever!