Foreram Rotation Vs Forearm Curling

[fightertrainer]

Which one do you think is more important? IMO rotation as in supination and pronation is more important, what your take on that?

[blueviper42]

Wouldn't it tend to be on your particular style? For example rotation would be more beneficial for a toproller, while curling would be more beneficial for a hooker.

[fightertrainer]

Wouldn't it tend to be on your particular style? For example rotation would be more beneficial for a toproller, while curling would be more beneficial for a hooker.

At first it seems to be the way you said it. But upon further study, I've seen Brzenk go from toproll to hook/press/supination vs Andrey Pushka. Recently I saw Devon expain his hook, there he said using your rotation (supination) in his style of hook as well. Toproll winner is alway in pronation way. Hook press with shoulder w/o supination you must use more of your weight. With supination alone you can get extra 1"-2" (the thickness of your wrist) of downward movement. IMO , it gives you the extra OOm! to finish, sciencetificly speaking. I beat this amateur guy as he flopped his wrist to stall me, immediately I used hook press on top of supination and boom it went down. My hand was in toproll position as he flopped it. I can bid my time by sitting there and go out to the finger, but I 've chosen my hook press because I felt my hook press is much better and faster. I learn this move from Brzenk's match vs Pushka.

Edited December 11, 2008 by fightertrainer

[bicio]

Wouldn't it tend to be on your particular style? For example rotation would be more beneficial for a toproller, while curling would be more beneficial for a hooker.

At first it seems to be the way you said it. But upon further study, I've seen Brzenk go from toproll to hook/press/supination vs Andrey Pushka. Recently I saw Devon expain his hook, there he said using your rotation (supination) in his style of hook as well. Toproll winner is alway in pronation way. Hook press with shoulder w/o supination you must use more of your weight. With supination alone you can get extra 1"-2" (the thickness of your wrist) of downward movement. IMO , it gives you the extra OOm! to finish, sciencetificly speaking. I beat this amateur guy as he flopped his wrist to stall me, immediately I used hook press on top of supination and boom it went down. My hand was in toproll position as he flopped it. I can bid my time by sitting there and go out to the finger, but I 've chosen my hook press because I felt my hook press is much better and faster. I learn this move from Brzenk's match vs Pushka.

I think is the way Walrus wrote.... but only at first.... at the eye of beginners is all separated, all movements are for a specific type of pull...

After some table work the reality is that you need ALL of those strength to be able to pull in all ways.

I think the traction/backpressure is a constant during a pull to prevent any changes in the opponent pull

A pull sometime I see is a Toproll at first time and a quick change to a Hook/press.... to do that you need ALL

First of all i must say that such changes of pull can be done only by a real good Armwrestler like John is...

During training a beginner can try to do that but in real matches my suggestion is to focus the weakest point of the opponent and pull in that way

CONCLUSION.

Train hard EVERYTHING in your forearm and remember that without your hand the forearm is nothing....

naturally IMHO

[fightertrainer]

Toprolling someone requires your forearm to pronate. Hooking someone requires curling of wrist with or w/o supination of forearm. As with shoulder press can be done with or w/o supination. Jerry Carodette has no supination with his flopped wrist. The matches of John vs Farid in Las Vegas or Vs Seremenko at Sloty if you can recall it. There you'll see John in a defensive hook with maximum supination (shoulder leaned to outside of his right, forearm/hand almost turned outward too, elbow digged deep inside). he waited until both of them exhausted then went on offensive mode. From this supination of hook he then pronated the forearm while coming back up: In losing position for defense = supination, recover for offense = pronation. Sure you can recover w/o supination but it's gonna be super hard. Using pronation like that is just way to add more muscles to the movement. Whether you're awared of it is entirely up to you.

Conclusion IMO, rotation of forearm is a must have for AW training. It is used in both toproll and hook therefore very important. Hand issue is another topic please.

[mithras]

So to clear this up as I've always been slightly confused

PRONATION: turning your hand and forearm so the back of your hand faces the ceiling (like when you execute a toproll)

SUPINATION: turning your hand and forearm so the palm of your hand faces the ceiling (which you can use in a hook position should you wish)

I saw Devons video about the hook where one of his key points is to supinate his opponents hand, it's quite hard to do it in practice!

With this in mind, what exercises can you use specifically (apart from table time) to train both these movements?

[bicio]

So to clear this up as I've always been slightly confused

PRONATION: turning your hand and forearm so the back of your hand faces the ceiling (like when you execute a toproll)

SUPINATION: turning your hand and forearm so the palm of your hand faces the ceiling (which you can use in a hook position should you wish)

I saw Devons video about the hook where one of his key points is to supinate his opponents hand, it's quite hard to do it in practice!

With this in mind, what exercises can you use specifically (apart from table time) to train both these movements?

Must be careful to pick as example Devon.... he has such long fingers so he can wrap your hand very well

even if his grip is too high so the twist is easier.

A List of specific exercises to improve the "twist strengh" (all ways naturally) would be appreciate

[mithras]

Must be careful to pick as example Devon.... he has such long fingers so he can wrap your hand very well

even if his grip is too high so the twist is easier.

A List of specific exercises to improve the "twist strengh" (all ways naturally) would be appreciate

Good point, his fingers are very long, mine are VERY short, haha.

[fightertrainer]

So to clear this up as I've always been slightly confused

PRONATION: turning your hand and forearm so the back of your hand faces the ceiling (like when you execute a toproll)

SUPINATION: turning your hand and forearm so the palm of your hand faces the ceiling (which you can use in a hook position should you wish)

I saw Devons video about the hook where one of his key points is to supinate his opponents hand, it's quite hard to do it in practice!

With this in mind, what exercises can you use specifically (apart from table time) to train both these movements?

YOu got it! Some people use staggered dumbell for this twisting action (one side is heavier) but i hurt myself with it for years: NO! I think strap or band is better. Apply strap to cable machine instead of handle. Pronation with strap means it would wrap around the back of your hand as you move the weight up. The pull should feel on the part near your thumb and index finger. Supination means the pull is now at the karate chop edge of your hand. I do this at 3 pulley angles " low , mid and high" Particularly the high puplley i use it for tricep press, rotation here work amazingly for pressing action.

Cheers