Table No Set

[xrated618]

Ok, so I needed some advice. I almost always use a TNS when I train with my grippers. I throw in some CCS and MMS, but I feel like TNS would give the best workout and although it is harder and I can not close as much using a TNS, but I feel as though it gives a better workout... not sure if this is clear of if there is an exact question, but how do you guys train and what do you think?

Thanks,

Jason

[bencrush]

I voted all 3. And this is coming from a guy who used to train exclusively TNS. Including all 3 isn't really that hard. Even if it's just mixing the sets on the warmup, that'd be better than nothing. I firmly believe you'll get the best bang for your buck with MMS though. I still like TNS and it's useful. But if you're held to only using 1 set I'd recommend the MMS. You can close harder grippers and that translates a little to the no set work, but the opposite is not always true.

[jad]

If you're only going to pick one I'd go with MMS. Training all of them would be the best but I just don't have that kind of time. That said, train for whatever your goal is (MM cert vs. IM cert).

[PowerHouse]

I just use sets that are comfortable for ME, not really concerning myself on what other people think is the RIGHT way to close one. I hear that a lot lately how closing a gripper like 'this' is the RIGHT way. What works for others isn't something that might work for you.

[climber511]

You guys actually train grippers - maybe I should try that sometime.

[CoC#3]

If i had to choose i would do parallel set work only. I enjoy TNS work aswell though.

[Jedd Johnson]

Like Josh said, train toward your goal.

I put all three because my focus is grip contests where all of the different techniques are employed from time to time.

[Autolupus]

I voted all three. It all works!

[Chris Mathison]

Hands down all 3. But, if you had to pick one, A MM set would yield the highest strength gains. Plus you can certify with that set. But seriously you dont have to pick one. Do all 3. MMS your goal gripper, CCS the last goal gripper you achieved and TNS anything you can.

[egg_uk]

i train grippers twice a week, once using ccs and the other just mms. cant get my little finger on the handle for tns.

[bigmatt]

All three. Now I have to get back in to it!!

[superfeemiman]

All three. Variety is the spice of crush training, and most training in general. In the end I don't think it will matter too much what you choose.

[crackyflipside]

Ok, what do the abbreviations mean; I know CCS is credit card shut and what TNS is now, what is MMS?

[Bob Lipinski]

If you want to be an all around grip guy, in my experience MMS is the best if you are only doing one. But like others said, train what you need, although neglecting MMS training will reduce your strength regardless of your goal, in my experience.

[Autolupus]

Ok, what do the abbreviations mean; I know CCS is credit card shut and what TNS is now, what is MMS?

http://www.gripboard.com/index.php?showtopic=5420

[Chris Mathison]

Ok, what do the abbreviations mean; I know CCS is credit card shut and what TNS is now, what is MMS?

CCS is credit card set. MMS is Mach Monster Set (check the Mash Monster threads for good explanations). and TNS is Table No Set (pick the gripper off a table and close it without using a set)

[lloyd80s]

For me it has to be TNS, if you can TNS any gripper then you can close it any other way. I do however also train with a set as I'm nowhere near strong enough to TNS a #3

[xrated618]

For me it has to be TNS, if you can TNS any gripper then you can close it any other way.

That was my thinking, but the posts in this tread seem to disagree

[superfeemiman]

For me it has to be TNS, if you can TNS any gripper then you can close it any other way.

That was my thinking, but the posts in this tread seem to disagree

I could've missed it but I don't think anyone really disagreed with that. There are many reasons why people prefer other sets, like more consistency, better gains, larger sets are too unwieldy, or like bencrush said, more bang for you buck (meaning a combination of having the best carry over to all sets plus having the best gains), and others. Some of them might be argued against, but there still there.

[Chris Mathison]

For me it has to be TNS, if you can TNS any gripper then you can close it any other way.

Agreed. The only problem with training a TNS only is its hard to make gains on maximal effort closes. Im talking the hardest part of the gripper the last 1/4" You cant really expose your tendons to the pressure needed to close a #3 if you are only TNS closing a 2 or 2.5. Its just such a big gap that MMSets with a #3 will get those stresses on your hands quicker forcing them to adapt or die. And then, of course, working up to a TNS with every gripper you can as to train the whole spread. In fact I had never done a TNS close of any gripper save one time maybe two before I did it with a #3. Not tooting my own horn but MMS and CCS got me to a #3 and about the third time I TNS with any gripper was with a #3 and it was just to see If I could do it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAwbrel1REE Honestly I dont think TNS is a training tool more of a feat of strength. Wanna get strong crushing??? MMS heavy ass grippers.

sry so winded.

Edited February 21, 2008 by Chris Mathison

[Bob Lipinski]

Yup, for smaller handed guys, TNS is more of a juggling act than anything else. If you get some smaller grippers then TNS can be fun.

On a narrow gripper, I have been able to TNS something around the strength of an easy #3. If the gripper is wide enough, I can barely do a #2.

[lloyd80s]

True strength is reflected in a TNS close, if your closing a gripper with any kind of set then you're incorporating technique and strength combined. A TNS close requires pure strength and explosive power. I've seen sets so deep that the gripper may as well have been closed with two hands. Still i've got full respect for anybody closing big grippers whatever way they close it. I don't think a TNS #4 will ever happen, some kind of set will always be needed on some grippers.

Of course there is a time and place for all kinds of sets, I use sets like most of the others here but I only feel I truly "own" a gripper when I can TNS it.

Can anybody here say they can dominate a gripper before they are TNS closing it?

[Teemu I]

True strength is reflected in a TNS close, if your closing a gripper with any kind of set then you're incorporating technique and strength combined. A TNS close requires pure strength and explosive power. I've seen sets so deep that the gripper may as well have been closed with two hands. Still i've got full respect for anybody closing big grippers whatever way they close it. I don't think a TNS #4 will ever happen, some kind of set will always be needed on some grippers.

Of course there is a time and place for all kinds of sets, I use sets like most of the others here but I only feel I truly "own" a gripper when I can TNS it.

Can anybody here say they can dominate a gripper before they are TNS closing it?

I have to say I have different views on some parts. TRUE max TNS close requires a lot of technique. As well as the CCS. There's a lot of things going on that you might not even think about. But when you fine tune your technique on the wide sets you'll realize that there's as much technique involved, maybe even more so than on the deep sets. That becomes more crucial as the hand size gets smaller. Juggling the fingers optimally on the handles is largely a matter of skill. Also you can never totally separete skill from strength.

My view on the original question. Strength is largely a context dependent, specific thing. You can't expect to develop your ability to close the biggest possible grippers for you if you religiously stick to one set and favour that above all. That seems to be a matter of personal preference to many. Which it shouldn't be. Strength training should be a matter of objectively choosing the appropriate means in the given situation for the given individual. You need to look at the bigger picture. That is why I choose to apply a wide range of strength training means to my grip (and gripper) training. I have also been favouring some things over others in my training, but careful retrospective analysis points out the flaws in that kind of training.

There is no one set-width above all that brings the best possible results in the long run if it is applied exclusively. If you restrict your training to no sets, you are missing out: your ability to actually get the handles to touch will be restricted by that approach. If you restrict your training to deep sets, you are also missing out: you are not training for the best possible result regarding the full ROM. I think it is best to work on all sets that are reasonable to your hand size. I know there must be some small handed individuals who find TNS to be next to impossible. Their alternative for TNS would then be the widest equivalent that doesn't feel ridiculous. Other than that case, the choice of set width shouldn't be guided too much by the hand size or whatever reasons you may have that are largely based on feel, not on carefully analyzing your strengths and weaknesses. Aim to work all widths that have been mentioned, but adjust the ROM on the widest sets to your handsize. Training should also be targeted towards fixing the weaknesses. Which are different for each individual.

Edited February 25, 2008 by Teemu I

[Teemu I]

Sorry, I tried to edit my post but I guess the time limit for that was reached and resulted in a double post.

Edited February 25, 2008 by Teemu I

[Bob Lipinski]

When I trained for TNS stuff, I found a little bit of practice, my normal MMS stuff, plus hard full range negatives worked best for me.

When I did lots of TNS only training, my MMS strength just went to crap and I stalled hard on the TNS stuff. Also, trying to set a gripper much harder than you can close (which is typically involved with negatives for me) helps.