RSW Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 I can now consistently bend an Ironmind blue nail, and I can fully bend the 60 pennies I bought from Home Depot (they are almost 6-1/2" long, but seem a little tougher than the blue). Now, aside from progressively tougher brands of 60 penny nails, which nail is the next hardest ? I am currently including bending progressively shorter pieces of 3/8" Aluminum stock, which is tougher than 1/4" HRS but much easier than 5/16" HRS (thanks for the tip, Strongman !). I am not going to go any shorter than 6", because I don't think my technique ("spike bending style") favors it. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terryduty Posted June 25, 2002 Share Posted June 25, 2002 Robert, glad I could help! I'd say that you're ready to try high quality brass (from 5/16" x 3' rods) like the kind usually found at a craft/hobby shop. (I think the 5/16" brass rods found at hardware stores must be a cheaper grade.) A 5/16" x 6" piece of high quality brass tested about 10% tougher than a common 60d nail. Once the brass is no problem, you should be ready to tackle some 6" Grade 5 bolts. Your progress is inspiring! Train smart! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSW Posted June 26, 2002 Author Share Posted June 26, 2002 Thanks Terry, I just read Tom Black's comments on the grade 5 bolts on his web site. They sound like an excellant intermediate goal between the Blue and the Red nail. Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supersqueeze Posted June 26, 2002 Share Posted June 26, 2002 Fellow Benders - I have not yet invested in the Bag-o-Nails and if I understand your post (Robert) I may not need to. Is the blue nail just before the red, or is there one in between? Also, you mentioned that the blue is about equal to, or slightly easier than, a Home Depot 60d - is this true? Are your Home Depot nails silver and shiny or dull and grey? I have both and the shiny ones are much tougher to me. I also agree that the spike bender style doesn't work well on stock much shorter than about 5.5 inches. I hope Terminator sees and answers your question about the technique used for the 4.5 inch bend. That is a stout bend. I know from previous posts that he views bracing as cheating so he probably did it cleanly. I would also like to know which technique was used for the 10 inch spike. That's a HUGE bend!! Terminator? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Black Posted June 26, 2002 Share Posted June 26, 2002 Terminator has a different technique than me, I can't quite describe it but I'm sure he can. Yes, no bracing. I'm not sure what everyone means when they say their style doesn't work well with short bends. Short bends are just tough, I would think any style would work. The 10" spike was, of course, off the top of the thigh and pushing down. As I said a long time ago on this board, doing bends of long thick steel simply cannot be done without bracing. There are so many different 60-penny nails out there its hard to know if we are talking about the same ones, that said, the 60-penny shiny galvanized nail at the Home Depot's near me are tougher than the Ironmind Blue. I tested mine at 290-pounds to bend a mere 1/4", the blues were 260. By the way, I spoke to Dr. Strossen at the Dinner regarding my testing and he said they tested them the same way. He asked me what I thought the Red was and I said I couldn't get enough weight on my standard loading pin to do the test. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSW Posted June 26, 2002 Author Share Posted June 26, 2002 Also, you mentioned that the blue is about equal to, or slightly easier than, a Home Depot 60d - is this true? Are your Home Depot nails silver and shiny or dull and grey? I have both and the shiny ones are much tougher to me.Is the blue nail just before the red, or is there one in between? Mike, the home depot nail I bent was 6-1/4" long and very dull and pitted looking. I think it is a little harder than the blue, but within several pounds of pressure. So far I have only kinked the shinier 60p nails I bought from Metropolitan Lumber. Regarding the Bag of Nails, it might be worth getting for comparison purposes. Still I recommend a pair of bolt cutters and some different diameter HRS for training. The order of nails is:white (6"x3/16", 120lbs to bend), Green (5"x3/16", 160lb), Yellow (7"x1/4", 210 lb.), Blue (6"x1/4", 260lb) and Red (7"x5/16" CRS, 370lb). As you can see the jump between Blue and Red is huge. (data is from Strongman). I'm not sure what everyone means when they say their style doesn't work well with short bends. Short bends are just tough, I would think any style would work. The 10" spike was, of course, off the top of the thigh and pushing down. As I said a long time ago on this board, doing bends of long thick steel simply cannot be done without bracing. Tom, I find that the Slim style works better for me for short bends and the spike bending style for longer ones. I am not sure what the optimum length for me in the spike bending style is but it might well be 10" or more. One of my goals is to bend a large spike unbraced, so I hope that it is indeed possible. How does Slim bend his 100p nails ? Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supersqueeze Posted June 26, 2002 Share Posted June 26, 2002 Tom - Short bends are tough, for sure! But a part of that toughness is a result of the added awkwardness of trying to firmly grasp the shorter object. It seems your own hands are getting in the way at times. I prefer spike bending style on 5+ inches and double overhand (hammerman? ) on shorter than 5 inches. The difference is on shorter pieces I can grasp the object with my two strongest fingers of each hand when using the double overhand method. It's not so much that my method doesn't work on shorter bends as much as it is I prefer a different method. I hope this makes my earlier statement more clear for you. Robert - Thanks for the low down on the B-o-N!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminator Posted June 27, 2002 Share Posted June 27, 2002 My style basically uses the web of the thumb as the fulcrum with index fingers touching. The holding hand points upright and the pulling hand comes back toward the body. I basically experimented with a bunch of styles and found that I like this one (some have commented that it is a very painful style of bending, so maybe I am a little crazy). I think everybody is different, what works for one may not work for another. One of my goals being to bend the Red nail, I wanted to make sure that my style constituted a legal bend. It turns out a legal bend can have no type of bracing, no contact of the hands or lower arms with any part of the body, no gloves or wrist wraps, and the bend must occur above the waist. If I'm not mistaken, the spike bending style comes up under the chin and makes contact, that is why I have not utilized this style. If your goal is to bend stuff, go with what works but if you someday want a "legal" bend of the Red you gotta practice some other style. Supersqueeze, I find a HUGE differential between the blue and red nails, maybe more than the poundages indicate. Tom's right, there are so many kinds of nails it's difficult to predict their difficulty even from lot to lot of the same brand. So far I have found no magic formula, it's just focus and pain tolerance. If you guys stumble onto anything please let us know. I have not done much long bending in the past, but you can bet I'm going to start. Good luck with your bending. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSW Posted June 27, 2002 Author Share Posted June 27, 2002 If I'm not mistaken, the spike bending style comes up under the chin and makes contact, that is why I have not utilized this style. If your goal is to bend stuff, go with what works but if you someday want a "legal" bend of the Red you gotta practice some other style. Maybe I am doing a modified Spike bend. I start near my chin, but not making contact. I then pull down towards my solar plexus. Thanks for the response, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supersqueeze Posted June 27, 2002 Share Posted June 27, 2002 Yes, mine is definately modified too. I actually make the initial bend right in front of my gut (bent over at the waist with elbows moving out and the ends of the metal moving away from me). I then finish it off by pressing the ends together in front of my chest. I hold it like Strongman shows, palms up, pinkies together for the start. The finish is done with both ends of the bent rod pointing toward the ground. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terryduty Posted June 27, 2002 Share Posted June 27, 2002 Terminator, you must have some very tough thumbs from the excellent bends that you're doing! I assume that you bend a little forward when doing your bend - what is the height of your left (holding) hand (i.e. knee height, waist height, chest height, etc.) during your bend? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminator Posted June 28, 2002 Share Posted June 28, 2002 Strongman, no bending at the waist, holding hand about chest height, arms straight out in front. Most of my bends I can perform seated to increase the difficulty. Elbows never touch my body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat 74 Posted June 28, 2002 Share Posted June 28, 2002 Chest high, very strict, no bracing. I've seen it myself. He bent two spiral 60's taped together on Friday before the dinner, and a 6" x 5/16" spiral after, both were seated bends with no bracing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terryduty Posted June 28, 2002 Share Posted June 28, 2002 Thanks much for the reply, Terminator! Very nice bends, indeed! (Hmmm... I may have to try the Terminator Thumb Torture Test technique "T-4" for short! Of course, I'd have to really toughen up my thumb! :crazy I should be ready in a few years!) Train smart! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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