Foot Stomping Experiment

[Sean Dockery]

I'll preface this by apologizing to Bill if he feels that this post flys in the face of his post earlier today concerning discussions of how to weaken grippers. This experiment was not intended to be a lesson in how to make weak grippers, but rather a demonstration of what exactly "Foot Stomping" will do to a brand new gripper. This is not a personal attack directed towards anyone. I assumed people used this method because they were ignorant of what was occuring, I hope that they will be educated by the following and make an educated decision.

Here's what went down....

I bought a brand new Supermaster from Warren. I measured the spread at 2.75", the mounting is about 1/16". The coils bound pretty bad. I closed it maybe 5 times in my usual no set style before I took it with me to Chris's on Saturday. We put it in the Redneck Calibrator, it came out to 138 pounds which is the highest rating of a Supermaster that has gone thru the RC (9 Supermaster's have been measured).

We wanted to try the most "legit" manner of foot seasoning we could think of so, we took the gripper and ran a piece of 3/4" CRR thru the spring coil to steady the gripper and gave it 200 foot stomps. These closes were at a medium pace, and each cycle was clicked shut, no cycles were done with the handles "passing each other", and the spring coil at no point bound on the steel rod. We put the gripper back in the RC and it measured 126.35. A loss of 11.65 pounds, making it now the easiest Supermaster measured. The gripper did not lose any spread at this point.

To continue the experiment, we tried foot stomping as above, but we pushed the handles "past each other" for 200 cycles. The gripper lost an additional 1.35 pounds in the RC. Again the spread remained unchanged.

The next experiment was to see what happened when the coil bound against the rod. We inserted a 7/8" steel rod in the coil to steady the gripper and gave it one stomp to get it to shut. The spread was now 1.77", the "dogleg" was gone and the gripper was laughably easy. The RC showed 87.4 pounds. About the rating for a #1.

Now to see what happens if the spread is opened back up....We put the gripper in a vise and using a piece of pipe opened the handles up until the spread once more measured 2.75. In the RC, the mangled Supermaster now showed 115.3 (a stiff #2 range). The dogleg returned and it appears outwardly just as it did fresh from the package.

I came to 4 conclusions as a result of this experiment.

1) Foot stomping artificially increases the "seasoning" effect. Even if you are not trying to weaken the gripper....if you choose to season your grippers in this manner that is your choice, but you've now seen exactly what happens. A gripper that was a good, hard SM was turned into a wimpy SM....before we "tried" to weaken it. I don't feel like spending $$$ to run this experiment several more times, but I'll make a wild guess that this experiment will show repeatable results. Go ahead, try it. You'll be surprised

2) If anyone posts a video of a gripper close, I will doubt their ability until they either climb the MM ladder, cert with IM under the new rules, perform in a competition, close said gripper in front of me after I've inspected the gripper, or has earned my trust.

3) Some of you folks have too much free time. Foot stomping grippers is boring, even more so than training grippers. I can't imagine how boring it would be to "season" every gripper I bought like this.

4) The safest way to maintain the integrity of your grippers and your word is to just train with the darn things, and let the seasoning process take care of itself.

[dubthewonderscot]

Well said Doc, Well Said!!

[John Eaton]

Sean, thanks for doing this experiment and posting it for us.

[Sybersnott]

Thank you Sean for clearing that up. I have never "foot stomped" a gripper to season it, BUT I do have a seasoning press that I have created and used for experimential purposes. IMO, seasoning a gripper does have merit; I do recall a certain company not too long ago offered a service in which many members of this forum (myself included) took advantage of. And the results of those tests revealed a lot!

[StalwartSentinel]

I'll preface this by apologizing to Bill if he feels that this post flys in the face of his post earlier today concerning discussions of how to weaken grippers. This experiment was not intended to be a lesson in how to make weak grippers, but rather a demonstration of what exactly "Foot Stomping" will do to a brand new gripper. This is not a personal attack directed towards anyone. I assumed people used this method because they were ignorant of what was occuring, I hope that they will be educated by the following and make an educated decision.

Here's what went down....

I bought a brand new Supermaster from Warren. I measured the spread at 2.75", the mounting is about 1/16". The coils bound pretty bad. I closed it maybe 5 times in my usual no set style before I took it with me to Chris's on Saturday. We put it in the Redneck Calibrator, it came out to 138 pounds which is the highest rating of a Supermaster that has gone thru the RC (9 Supermaster's have been measured).

We wanted to try the most "legit" manner of foot seasoning we could think of so, we took the gripper and ran a piece of 3/4" CRR thru the spring coil to steady the gripper and gave it 200 foot stomps. These closes were at a medium pace, and each cycle was clicked shut, no cycles were done with the handles "passing each other", and the spring coil at no point bound on the steel rod. We put the gripper back in the RC and it measured 126.35. A loss of 11.65 pounds, making it now the easiest Supermaster measured. The gripper did not lose any spread at this point.

To continue the experiment, we tried foot stomping as above, but we pushed the handles "past each other" for 200 cycles. The gripper lost an additional 1.35 pounds in the RC. Again the spread remained unchanged.

The next experiment was to see what happened when the coil bound against the rod. We inserted a 7/8" steel rod in the coil to steady the gripper and gave it one stomp to get it to shut. The spread was now 1.77", the "dogleg" was gone and the gripper was laughably easy. The RC showed 87.4 pounds. About the rating for a #1.

Now to see what happens if the spread is opened back up....We put the gripper in a vise and using a piece of pipe opened the handles up until the spread once more measured 2.75. In the RC, the mangled Supermaster now showed 115.3 (a stiff #2 range). The dogleg returned and it appears outwardly just as it did fresh from the package.

I came to 4 conclusions as a result of this experiment.

1) Foot stomping artificially increases the "seasoning" effect. Even if you are not trying to weaken the gripper....if you choose to season your grippers in this manner that is your choice, but you've now seen exactly what happens. A gripper that was a good, hard SM was turned into a wimpy SM....before we "tried" to weaken it. I don't feel like spending $$$ to run this experiment several more times, but I'll make a wild guess that this experiment will show repeatable results. Go ahead, try it. You'll be surprised

2) If anyone posts a video of a gripper close, I will doubt their ability until they either climb the MM ladder, cert with IM under the new rules, perform in a competition, close said gripper in front of me after I've inspected the gripper, or has earned my trust.

3) Some of you folks have too much free time. Foot stomping grippers is boring, even more so than training grippers. I can't imagine how boring it would be to "season" every gripper I bought like this.

4) The safest way to maintain the integrity of your grippers and your word is to just train with the darn things, and let the seasoning process take care of itself.

Great post. That was exactly how my original BBSE lost its dogleg. Never again. It's a waste of a good gripper and $35 (Canadian with shipping and duty).

[Sean Dockery]

To clarify. The SM went from stout to wimp BEFORE we tried removing the dogleg.

[PowerHouse]

That was awesome thanks for the info.

What exactly is going on that causes footstomping to weaken a gripper? I am by know meens questioning that it doesn't weaken a gripper, nor have I ever footstomped a gripper in my life, just wanted to know what footstomping does to cause a gripper to become weaker.

If it wasn't for Heath and Teemu I still would have my hose clamp on my gripper since I had no clue it could weaken a gripper. Luckily it didn't do any damage to my gripper.

Again thx for the info.

[Sean Dockery]

Powerhouse, I typed up a pretty lengthy reply, but thought better of it. Long story short, I don't know what in the foot stomping process causes the increase in the seasoning effect.

I'd love for an engineer or research guy, or amateur metallurgist to get on here and explain it.

[StalwartSentinel]

That was awesome thanks for the info.

What exactly is going on that causes footstomping to weaken a gripper? I am by know meens questioning that it doesn't weaken a gripper, nor have I ever footstomped a gripper in my life, just wanted to know what footstomping does to cause a gripper to become weaker.

If it wasn't for Heath and Teemu I still would have my hose clamp on my gripper since I had no clue it could weaken a gripper. Luckily it didn't do any damage to my gripper.

Again thx for the info.

If the handles are only pressed down to just touch each other, it's got to have something to do with speed of closure or high volume of reps, in a short time. Pushing the handles past each other is a definite, as is a tight pipe.

[Sean Dockery]

Actually, our results showed a minimal loss of strength from closing handles past each other (1 more pound than the just touching method), as long as the spring is not binding on the brace rod one's just as bad as the other.

[JoeGrip]

Gee who woulda thunk it...

Thanks for taking the time to do this.

How fast were the reps and did you really stomp hard or just push it down w/ your foot?

[Sean Dockery]

Just pushed down with my foot. I'd say the pace was about a close a second.

And you're welcome.

Edited December 4, 2006 by Sean Dockery

[Teemu I]

Great post Sean, I hope this keeps atleast some people away from stomping their grippers.

[Bearcat 74]

Excellent work man, thanks for taking the time to do this!

[Dustyy]

Am learning something new everyday on the gripboard...thanks.

[Chrisx9118]

Great post!! Keep your feet on the floor

[climber511]

Like most of us, I don't begin to have the knowledge to try and explain "why" it happened, but it's obvious "what" happened in terms of loss of poundage. I have tried very hard to give people the benefit of the doubt on all claimed feats but I'm now pretty skeptical of some of the things I've read. I regret my loss of innocence - I like believing in people and it's a shame that a very few spoil it for all. I encourage everyone to have your grippers calibrated or do it yourself WITH A WITNESS to the whole process - how's that for paranoid? Or better yet - get out in the world and get with some other people at a contest or get together of some kind. It hard to fool yourself or anyone else standing right out there in front of everyone. Climb the MM cert ladder - it's easy to be the strongest guy in your gym if you're the only one in there.

[stew2]

This was pretty eye opening to watch I couldn't believe the diference in a little time period. I would have to agree with Doc not to offend anyone but someone closing big grippers that hasn't hit a contest or thought of a MM cert can save they're film on gripper closes from me.Also setting around doing this stomping means you have way to much time on your hands.

[GetAGrip87]

Great experiment Sean! Foot Stomping is cruel and unusual punishment for grippers!

[crouton_cc]

Great post!! Keep your feet on the floor

The foot stomping method seasons the grippers fast, but in the end, more so than regular use would. You see, when you go foot crazy, you probably will be apt to go stomping for however many reps you desire. This creates friction inside the coil which is released in the form of heat. To test this, take a wire, bend it till it breaks and touch the end, ouch, hurts doesn't it. Same happens in a gripper. It heats up and looses it temper and memory. The actual steel changes at a moledular level. The carbon that is inside the steel will realign itself with respect to the iron, and causes the steel to loose its temper, and becomes softer (a result of which it also loses its memory, causes the spread to descrease). Better steel resists this more, but when you go stomping, you are nonetheless creating more friction than you would normally be able to with your hand. I Highly doubt you will take your hardest gripper and rip off 100 reps like you foot does, and if you can, why the hell are you seasoning it????

[Pyro]

I can't believe people season their grippers like that, I just closed mine, never done any foot stomping or anything. I don't get why people need to season them "so they know they are getting stronger" If you close it you've gotten stronger, if you can close it unseasoned your stronger then if you can close it seasoned.

[Starkmann]

I'm not a gripper guy but that was really interesting, thanks for posting guys.

I'm curious, if anyone does this, for training or experimentation, would they humor me and measure the width of the coil before and after?

[climber511]

I'm not a gripper guy but that was really interesting, thanks for posting guys.

I'm curious, if anyone does this, for training or experimentation, would they humor me and measure the width of the coil before and after?

Mike - did it - no measurable change with my micrometer is width or diameter. Also I touched the spring during the stomping - it was not particularly warm to the touch.

[stew2]

I don't believe the heat generated is the answer. I work with torsion springs everyday made 4 up today and installed them. Torsion springs work on cycles the spring is designed to be under pressure and realease pressure when the spring is comppressed it elonggates this cuts down on friction. The springs are designed to use the heat(what heat there is) to stretch a person cannot move a gripper fast enough to heat it enough to detemper the spring steel. I'm going to go through the spring books and see if I can find anymore concrete answers. The best I have now is the longer a spring is under pressure it loses tension whether it is moving or not because of the stretch. This cuts back on the cycles I'll see if I can find anymore on it.

[diesel]

thanx for the experiment. i have never foot stomped a gripper, and now i def don't plan on ever doing so.

however, this thread is making me bummed out. no longer will an individual's integrity be assumed as respectable or trustworthy. what's next? someone says they closed the 3 for the first time and everyone exclaims he's a fraud? man, i hope not. but i trust the board to give respect to those individuals who have truly shown determination and perseverance in their training, and to deny the same respect to those individuals which have shown that they deserve none.