Sledgehammer Leverage Judging Standards

[Bob Lipinski]

I was looking at the photos for my contest, and I saw that the sledgehammer judging standards were inconsistent (thanks Chris and others for their suggestions, much of the following is from them).

My rule was to have the sledge pass the plane of the head. However, due to head lean, some people went really, really deep.

Should that be the way we do things, or should we have a bar set up so that the ROM is 45 degrees or so, like at the Tarheel contest?

Not taking sides here, I am just curious what everyone else thinks. I am more for a 45 degree ROM, but I will of course go with the consensus.

This event is in its infancy, and I think some measure of consistenct can still be hammered out.

[moser1972]

Thanks for this Topic Bob!!!!!!

It's very interesting to get to know whether we can find a standard. Also very important for the next upcoming events with Sledge as a discipline!!

It would be very helpful!

[Scott Styles]

I don't know what the "right" angle is, but I think something like they had at the Tarheels contest may make it possible to standardize the event.

My understanding of what they had, correct me if I'm wrong:

1. When the competitor sets up for the lever, the hand is placed such that the bottom of the sledge hammer is in the center of a target.

2. The competitor's arm is set on a platform at a height such that it is parallel to the floor. The upper and lower arm must maintain contact with the platform for the entire lift.

3. A U shaped piece of metal is stood over the competitors arm/shoulder at a set distance from the center of the target.

4. The competitor brings the sledge down until the handle touches the piece of metal, then takes it back up to vertical. The lift is over when the sledge reaches vertical.

Problems I see with this setup:

1. The fulcrum the hammer moves from is at a different height depending upon the hand / forearm size of the individual. This setup favors someone with small hands / forearms that can keep the pivot point low to the barrel.

This is probably a non-issue as the lower pivot point will also be lower on the sledge handle, making the lift harder in another way. It is still possible that having big forearms mean someone needs to go down a little farther. I think this difference would be minor among people competing for similar placings, however.

2. Individuals may attempt to bounce the hammer off the height marker. I think you work around this by making the height marker only moderately stable and disqualifying a lift if the marker is knocked over when touched by the sledge.

The other points of contention I see around standardizing a sledge lever:

1. Consistent handle length. I think this has already been settled on.

2. Consistent handle wrapping. Athletic tape?

3. Does the plane the hammer head moves in need to remain parallel to the ground the entire time? Might not matter since deviating from this plane should make the lift harder.

[Jedd Johnson]

Does the bar that was used at the tarheels contest cause a change in range of motion for some athletes? If not, then it sounds like a good idea.

-Jedd-

[climber511]

The setup used at the Tarheels has been my favorite setup I've used so far. We set up with your wrist just over the end of the board so the front was the same for everyone. Then the rod you lowered to gave the same angle no matter how long the guys arms were. It didn't matter how high the guys head was, the angle was always the same. I suppose you could get some small degree of bounce but that would be real easy to fix with the use of a a non rigid bar setup.

[AP]

I think a problem with the non-rigid bar setup is that when bringing down a heavy sledge (especially newer competitors) you don't have alot of fine motor skills at that point. The sledge can come down in "steps", like you try to lower it a bit and then it drops like 3", which could cause the judging bar to fall. This is such a tough event to figure out just because there are so many variables. I'm sure I was one of the ones that lowered the bar much farther than it needed to go, but I also had a heck of a time keeping my upper arm down - so how do you balance the two?

I'm wondering if just for judging simplicity, you could start the sledge already on the judging bar, already at 45 degrees or whatever and then have the competitor raise it from the bottom? Combine this with strapping the arm down and you have a very fair and consistant lift - though it definitely wouldn't help it more exciting from a spectator point of view...

[Scott Styles]

As someone with limited experience with the lift, I find it much easier to bring the sledge down and come back up then to start at the bottom. I think that would be a down side.

The judge could always call the competitor on it if they are using the rigid bar to bounce the sledge.

[EmEx]

only 45 degrees? i useally about do it 80 degrees im only 7/8 down the handle of an 8 pounder by going only 45degrees i probably can do an 8 pounder already

[Jedd Johnson]

Bob,

It sounds like the set-up they used in NC was pretty convenient and made it easy for judging consistently. Are there any pictures of it on the Gripboard?

-Jedd-

[Bob Lipinski]

Not that I have seen! I think I have a good idea how to implement something similar.

Do you think 45 degrees is a good enough standard Jedd? I figure taping wooden rods like a goal post might do the trick, as a sturdier setup would allow rebound off the bottom.

Jeff- It is way too much fun to move the heavier weight!

[Bob Lipinski]

Allright, brainstorming here- I bet that a bungie cord in between the pins of a power rack would work just fine.

[climber511]

http://www.gripboard.com/index.php?act=mod...cmd=si&img=3940

Here's a short movie clip showing it. It's very easy to adjust up and down for different heights of people. And if an angle concesus is reached - it would be easy to set the height of the bar as desired. It would of course be possible to make the top not rigid to eliminate the possibility of "bouncing" the hammer off of it.

[stew2]

Bob,

It sounds like the set-up they used in NC was pretty convenient and made it easy for judging consistently. Are there any pictures of it on the Gripboard?

-Jedd-

There were some picks up I believe the week before last either my bother had them up or might of been Anson I forget. I'd have to look. But looked like a good begining at a standard from what I've heard and seen.

Never mind Chris beat me to it like usual

[underdawg]

The angle used was actually 40 degrees. For most people this brought the sledge head down to a point just a couple of inches shy of touching their forehead. There really wasn't a problem that I noticed with people bouncing the hammer off the bar. If someone blatantly tried to bounce the hammer the lift would not be counted. Of course, I understand the desire to remove any chance of this. I had thought about using a bungee cord as the cross-piece, but I was afraid this would be too easy to gain assistance from. I'd be more than happy to implement any changes we can come up with into next year's contest to form a standard.

[nickr104]

Bob,

It sounds like the set-up they used in NC was pretty convenient and made it easy for judging consistently. Are there any pictures of it on the Gripboard?

-Jedd-

The video was up in CHris's gallery. levering at NC comp

[climber511]

I've been playing around and I'm not sure if setting up slightly higher or lower than level is an advantage or not - it seems to be a matter of movement more than angle as long as you set up close to level. With practice - either way seems to come out the same for me.

[DAN PRAYDIS]

I've been playing around and I'm not sure if setting up slightly higher or lower than level is an advantage or not - it seems to be a matter of movement more than angle as long as you set up close to level. With practice - either way seems to come out the same for me.

im casting my vote that the lower you hold your arm the easer it should be to do the lift because of the angle and how much the wrist has to bend back just my 2 cents