Strap Holds

[Maverik]

Hi guys,

Sorry to change the topic, but since this is the forum for Crushing grip posts, I have a question concerning Strap Holds, and one concerning negatives.

My question about strap holds is; what is a good material to use to make straps. I was at the gym today and tried using an ankle harness (the kind you attach to a pully tower). I put the part of the strap that would usually go around the ankle through the hole in the center of the plate, closed the strap and then used the excess strap to attempt to hold between the closed ends of my #1 (key word here is "attempted" ).

Does this sound like a viable set up? I am going to have to reduce the weight that I try to hold (in fact I will probably just use the strap itself until I can hold it easily). Also, with strap holds, are you supposed to try to close the gripper onto the strap and then hold it, or cheat it closed and try to hold it?

Now, as far as negatives are concerned, I was really inspired after reading the article by "Gorilla Hands" in which the author strongly advocated the use of negatives. I have however heard several different opinions concerning which grippers one should work negatives on. I have heard one opinion that you should work negatives with a gripper 1 level above the highest gripper you can close. I have also however heard an opinion that you should only work negatives with a gripper that you can hold shut. My question is; which is correct?

I can currently close the #1 with either hand, but cannot hold a #2 shut (even if I cheat it closed, once I remove the assistant hand the gripper opens about 1/2-1/8 inch and I can then control the rest of the negative. So, would you guys suggest that I not work negatives with the #2 until I can hold it shut? Or, should I not worry about not being able to hold it closed, just having faith that with time the hold will come?

Thanks in advance for any advice that you can offer.

Good training,

Maverik

[Scott Styles]

A cork backed metal ruler from an office supply store will work very well for strap holds. Peel the cork off the end of the ruler where you are going to grip it with the gripper handles. It should be 2 or 3 dollars.

Close the gripper onto the strap. A gripper you can do a decent strap hold with will be easy enough that cheating it closed shouldn't be a problem. Be sure the gripper stays perpendicular to the ground when doing the lift. If you get over about ten lbs, it's time to find a thinner, harder strap, or to move up a gripper.

Be careful with the negatives. They are an easy way to injure yourself. Most guys that do them use a gripper one level above what they can close. The goal is to expose your hand to more force than it is used to experiencing. You do not have to hold the gripper shut to do this. Just do the best you can.

[Maverik]

Hi Scott,

Thanks for the advice.

I am a little puzzled however about what you mean by "once you get over 10 lbs it is time to find a harder, thinner strap, or move up a gripper". Am I to be attaching weight to the ruler? If so, what is a good way to fasten the weight to the ruler? If not, then how am I to know if I get over 10 lbs? Sorry if the answer is obvious and I'm just not seeing it.

Also thanks for the advice about negatives. That really helps.

Good training,

Maverik

[dennisb]

What about using a truss stap? They vary in length's and they have holes to put a clip and weight on.Give it a thought.

[mindovermatter]

Does a shoelace have the same affect as using an iron mind strap?

Edited October 27, 2005 by mindovermatter

[Scott Styles]

I used a piece of thick string wrapped through the hole on the ruler and a large washer for about 10 loops. The I just slid the plates over the ruler so they rested on the washer when I picked up the ruler by the other end. Since I was just going up to 10lbs, the string was strong enough. Another thing that helps is to microload with large washers. I have some washers that are approximately 1/2lb each and allow for small increments.

As long as the strap you are using is thin and hard, it doesn't really matter what you use. Be careful to not grab the strap between the flesh of you skin when you pick it up with the gripper handles.

[Wayne]

Maverik, your goal gripper is the coc2? then i would get a coc3 for negatives and just regular attept the 2. a gripper less hard than the 3 like a bbsm or an hg300 would also be good, just as long as its harder than your goal gripper, this is my opinion and is what works for me. as for strap holds i just use a leather belt but this ruler idea seems harder and probly better in the long run so i might try it out.

[Maverik]

Hi Scott,

Thank you for the advice. I will try out your idea.

Wayne,

So, I should be doing negatives with a gripper that is harder than my goal gripper? And I should still be making attempts at closing the #2?

I'm honestly not sure I could even cheat a #3 closed. Is doing negatives with your goal gripper not effective in your experience?

I thought that I should be doing negatives with a gripper one level above the highest gripper that I could close. But, I will take your advice and as soon as I can afford to, get the #3.

Thanks for the advice.

Good training,

Maverik

[Wayne]

Maverik, honestly i've never done negatives with my goal gripper so i dont know the benefits. using a harder gripper than your gpal is how i was told to do it when i started doing them and has worked good for me. i didnt know what negatives were untill i could close the 2 i closed it just by squeezing it everyday(was actually a different brand 195lb. gripper, little harder than my coc2). then i started working on the 3 and discovered all the different workouts. i started doing negatives with a 4 which at the time i could not close even with both hands but i still felt i was getting strength gains. after i started closing the 2 consistantly with no problem i ordered a beef builder super master, grand master, and elite. i closed the super master right out of the box, which according to the gripper poundage chart in the faq section is 265lb. on average. i then started doing my negatives with the elite which was a step down from the 4 but still much harder that a 3. in a couple months i closed my grand master(280 lb.). still haven't got that 3 though its a hard one but i've been about 1/8 from my friends #3. if you do try this method i hope it works out for you.

[stranger]

honestly with strap hold i use a belt . i was thinking about useing a chocker so that putting the strap inbetween the handles would be easier but, i dont have a chocker!

[Maverik]

Hi guys,

Wayne, thanks once again for the advice. The way you closed the #2 sounds very similar to the way I closed the #1. Which is just by trying to close it once an hour, 5-6 days a week. It only took me about 2 weeks to get it closed with my right hand and about another week with my left (going from about a 1/4 inch to go with my right hand and 1/2 inch to go with my left hand).

The person who got me into grip training suggested that I do negatives with the gripper that I was trying to close, the sheer number of different opinions on the subject is what has me somewhat confused at the moment.

However, like I said, I will give your advice a try, just as soon as I can afford to pick up a #3.

Thanks again.

Thanks also to Stranger.

One last question I have is;

I have heard a lot of people praising the effects of eccentric-accentuated training regimenes for developing strength. However, I recently stumbled upon an individual who believes that this type of training can actually be detrimental to achieving maximum strength.

His name is Chad Waterbury and you can find his articles at www.T-Nation.com. Go to the archives a find the article titled Building Your Rep Part II In this article he describes why he believes so. I hope there are no restrictions on posting articles on this forum. If there are, then I apologize in advance.

Let me know what you guys think, as I seriously doubt he's closed a #3 with 3 fingers of anything like that.

Good training,

Maverik

[Wayne]

hey Maverik, i checked out that article.

did i understand it right? this man says negatives are over rated and should be limited? an example he gave went something like this, ''if you go for a max vertical jump you squat and jump quickly, if you held the squat for 5 seconds your jump would be worse''. i dont think he thought that out enough before he wrote it, if you did hold a squat for 5 seconds then jumped as hard as you can you would be putting more stress on the muscles and working them harder, after training like this for a while you may notice your jump has now improved . he says that negatives cause to much soreness and takes time off your training. well what i say to that is if you keep it up you will strengthen and tough'n yourself and the soreness time will go down as your body gets used to being put under that amount of stress.

ultimately i see this as his opinion and how he likes to train, but there is no doubt that negatives work for other people including myself, you gotta experiment and find what your body likes.

[Maverik]

Hi wayne,

Thanks for checking out that article.

Actually, he broke up muscle contractions into four parts: eccentric, the transition between eccentric and concentric when the muscles are fully stretched, concentric, and the transition between the concentric and eccentric when the muscles are fully contracted.

His point in talking about holding the bottom position of a jump for five seconds was to illustrate the elastic capabilities of the connective tissues found in muscles (basically the plyometric effect) and that if one let this stored elastic energy dissapate that one would not be able to produce as much force on the following concentric portion of the exercise (in this case a jump).

In this I am in no disagreement with him (and yes you are correct, doing so would probably make you stronger/a better jumper in the long run). It was his point about negatives being both overrated and, at least in his opinion, detrimental to achieving maximum strength that really caught my attention.

Now, my impression of this theory was that he was really talking about the effects such eccentric contractions have on one's ability to increase frequency of exercise in an attempt to induce hypertrophy. Unfortunately I think that he, like those who he was writing that article for, associates larger muscles with greater strength. And to a certain extent I agree with him. After all a muscle's cross sectional area does have a correlation with it's ability to produce force. If it didn't then hypertrophy would not occur from doing strength related exercises.

However, from my experience one can be extremely strong without looking like Ronnie Coleman. Therefore, while hypertrophy may have an effect on strength, it is not necessary to achieving strength, nor do bigger muscles always equal stronger muscles.

It is here, in the pursuit of pure unadulterated strength, that his theory loses it's effectiveness. Sure, perhaps his program can make guys big, but can it help them close the #3 COC, or better yet the #4? I seriously doubt it, and if it has, then I will personally be the first to start adopting this type of program.

Still, it was his examples of the two Cirque De Soliel brothers that he mentions in one of this articles that really caught my attention, as those guys are really strong. He also mentions Gymnasts in one of this articles (it might be the same one) and they also have incredible amounts of strength. He also brings up the point of "if you want to achieve certain results, then do as those who have achieved them did" (actually he doesn't say this exactly, but if you read into what he is saying, this maxim is present). I wonder what his response would be if someone mentioned say, John Brookfield on that site.

In the least I found his theory intriguing and logical at least to a certain extent. And as I myself try not to fall into the trap of becoming dogmatic in my thinking/training, I find myself more than a little tempted to try out his theory as it would relate to grip training.

After all, if in fact it did work, then hey, why not use it?

Once again thanks for the input.

Good training,

Maverik