Adam Black Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Steroids are an admission and a revelation of manly weakness. Here's a pretty darn good example... BC. That is just nasty! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Black Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Vassily?are you still there......? "I apologize for calling wife bloated warthog and I bid you good day." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bseedot Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Sorry, duplicated post somehow. BC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2strong Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 That's Greg "Valvolino" Valentino ( I think it's implants, and not synthol in those arms ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat 74 Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Whatever it is is damn sick! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Mobster, You mentioned the #4 as those I had referred to it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amaury Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Brian i think that this here is a better still example PS: soory for the trolling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Piche Posted April 18, 2003 Author Share Posted April 18, 2003 It's unfortunate that this thread was started, but since it was I will weigh in. If steriods are an indication of moral or mental weakness then I ask you, what is it a sign of when you acuse someone that has beaten you when you really don't know? People are quick to make broad sweeping statements about top weightlifters, powerlifters, and strongman competitors, but on what do you base your statements? How do you even have an idea who is on and who is not? This is a slippery slope folks - I would hate to see the grip world pulled down in the same stinking pit of s@#t that the rest of the strength sports have been pulled into. It starts with an inocent discussion, then mud slinging, and eventually will end up in tested grip contests vs. open grip contests, tested records vs. open records, etc.. I have been around strength sports at every level for 15 years - I know a lot of the top guys personally that I know are on, some I suspect are on, and some that I just can't figure out. The one thing I know is I will never know, and because of that I have stopped asking the question. I have been around the Iron Game for over 20 years and I suspect Wade that you have a pretty good idea who is "on" versus "off" based on experience of observation. If they deny it, it's obviously still a guess. But, if you have been paying attention over the 15 years, I bet your guess will be pretty darn educated. I am relating this to my own experience. IMO, it's not that hard to pick out who is using and who is not with a pretty high accuracy. No, you can't do it by a picture, etc. It has to be done in person, and observing a training session, competition, etc....maybe multiple times is needed at least. I also don't think that grip will go into the current disarray of powerlifting, etc. I started competing in powerlifting in non-tested events and actually relished in the fact that I could compete with those on drugs to some degree. No, I did not have sour grapes when I got beat. I kept my mouth shut. No excuses. It was my choice not to use and we all know roids do not automatically make you a champion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amaury Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 we all know roids do not automatically make you a champion. That's why i don't see any reason why only those among the top 10 competitors in each sport would be on juice. You can use and still be last in a comp, sad but true. Just common sense IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobsterone Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Steroids, and other performance enhancing agents, diminish the accomplishments of natural athletes. To most people, it isn't so odvious who's natural or not. If anything it makes what a 'natural' athlete can do better not worse. Esp if, as pre Rick, they beat them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnimalCage Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 [begin Dream Sequence] Alan Valentino [End Nightmare Sequence] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobsterone Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Mobster,You mentioned the #4 as those I had referred to it? Tha question doesn't actually make any sense but I think your earlier statement asked for those that had 'used' to stand and be counted. As the original post refered to a CoC 4 close and not wanting the subject to go too far off course I pointed out that any admittance would need to follow the closure first!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Piche Posted April 18, 2003 Author Share Posted April 18, 2003 [begin Dream Sequence]Alan Valentino [End Nightmare Sequence] Is this the exorcist? The head is on backwards! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnimalCage Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 I know, I know. I couldn't find a good frontal shot. New emoticon needed - :talktothehand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mjoynt Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Steroids, and other performance enhancing agents, diminish the accomplishments of natural athletes. To most people, it isn't so odvious who's natural or not. If anything it makes what a 'natural' athlete can do better not worse. Esp if, as pre Rick, they beat them. Mobster, I agree. But, as far as records go, most natural athletes feats are viewed as mediocre compared to the artificially boosted records held by the "druggers". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobsterone Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 By those who live in ignorance. The reference point was the individual - ie Rick et al. Plus I don't think there will be that much of a difference, if any, in grip (IMO). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom of Iowa2 Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Trivia corner:I read an old article on this guy Valentino.It was published in Muscle Mag International.The article indicated that he injected oil base st*@!s directly into the muscle belly of the bicep and the tricep?ouch! .And then would fo dozens of sets with a light weight to cause the growth. In the article he indicated that it angered him that people thought that he had injected oil into them... as if THAT was cheating? (paraphrazing)'I wouldn't ever use oil'I believe he later retracted most of his statements as it was admitting to something that-as a citizen of the united states....could lead to federal 'problem'. I was watching a comedy 'news'bit on the E network and it showed a clip of him being led away in handcuffs and the joke was "what was this guy arrested for"....where I'm going with this is some of my buddies were laughing...'there goes Tom'.....so at times people do jump to the wrong conclusions even if you are just a little bit stronger than average-or just a little bigger than the 'curve'.... so i'm sure over the years-at least at times-some people have been mislabled as drug users for actually just having the "right"Ma & Pa(genetics)--on the other hand if i guys lifts are going up and down like a yo-yo,or when someone has added the bodyweight a little too quickly?and they are still at 7.5% body fat...well??? I also think-that despite the controversial nature of this thread-that everybody has been pretty careful about nameing names or accusing individuals...other than this Valentino? guy and my joke about Vassily...???and from what i have read about the 'old days' it was pretty common knowledge that the eastern bloc countries of the 60's,70's and 80's were utilizing some form of performance enhanceing substances? And again..in that era..Americans could apparently get a script from a sympathetic doctor(who may have also been an overzealous fan)and pick it up...or just go down to their veterinarians office Just wanted to clarify that not throwing rocks at other countries..and that i don't think that the 'old timers'were angels Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Walker Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Let me add an example to what I said: The IPA Men's 198 pro (non drug tested) deadlift record is 730. In November I will challenge that number at 198 and 100% drug free. This is what I mean. If you are going to use-atleast be good at it Rick Walker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobsterone Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Let me add an example to what I said:The IPA Men's 198 pro (non drug tested) deadlift record is 730. In November I will challenge that number at 198 and 100% drug free. This is what I mean. If you are going to use-atleast be good at it Rick Walker Indeed. You validate my example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGuy Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 If David Horne believes as I do that steroids will strengthen the grip muscles providing you train them, it is good enough for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Those who choose to use drugs may argue they do not help in grip. They help only in non-grip activities. Let's see, I, uh, I choose, pecs- drugs don't help build pecs. Which muscle do you choose? Puhleez! One way to know is to ascertain your strength levels if you are using, stop using for a couple years, but continue training. Are your strength levels the same? We may have some religious monks here because I sense some self-denial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobsterone Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Exactly what you say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobsterone Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 One way to know is to ascertain your strength levels if you are using, stop using for a couple years, but continue training. Are your strength levels the same? Exactly what you say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGuy Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 I myself have many times been accused of drug use, even by Doctors. I took it as a compliment. It hasn't happened in a while. I must not have it anymore! If I was, or had been a user I would admit to it. I have no secrets at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Walker Posted April 18, 2003 Share Posted April 18, 2003 Another funny, but sadly true story. I worked out at a (cough ) facility when I was getting my degree. It was then run by a guy (who is now in prison for trafficing ecstasy ) who was jacked to the gills on the juice-he had AquaFina bottles full of GH in his house. He weighed about 280. Anyway-he was big on loading the ole' leg press up to like 1700 and doing 20 reps-making sure to scream and shout and make an ass of himself. One day he was deadlifitng and he couldnt quite get his form right. He knew I was a powerlifter so he asked my advice. 405 was on the bar and he struggled-and I mean busted a nut-trying to get it for 1 rep. I walk over and he starts unloading the bar so I can show him what to do. I tell him to leave it at 405-then proceed to pull it 8 times-slowly and under control-explaining the mechanics of the deadlift as I did it. No belt-no warmup. I finish and ask him if he understands and he stares at me-next words out of his mouth? "What are you on?" Rick Walker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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