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MalachiMcMullen

Rgc Ratings

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Magnus

Did some calibrating tonight:

Hammy's HG300 (unoiled) - 156.05lb

Hammy mutant HG350 (unoiled) - 185.55lb

My hard SE at MM3 specs - 188.8lb

Got cut short, so I'm gonna do a few more tomorrow. I started working on my #3.5, and it's not even 172. I'm guessing it's going to be about 169.

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DannyGrip

Is everyone using the same machine to calibrate or each person got their own machine?

Because if something rates 3.42 on one person's machine, then someone else calibrates theirs and it rates 3.61 for example, how accurate is it if there are two seperate machines doing the calibration?

Best way to tell if these machines are actually accurate is to get someone rate the same gripper on five different machines, then when the #'s come out different on each machine - is it the gripper that varies or the machines?

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Autolupus
Is everyone using the same machine to calibrate or each person got their own machine?

Because if something rates 3.42 on one person's machine, then someone else calibrates theirs and it rates 3.61 for example, how accurate is it if there are two seperate machines doing the calibration?

Best way to tell if these machines are actually accurate is to get someone rate the same gripper on five different machines, then when the #'s come out different on each machine - is it the gripper that varies or the machines?

If you understood the concept of gravity then maybe you wouldn't be asking such silly questions! ;)

...or maybe there's a slightly stronger or weaker pull beneath each RGC, thus throwing a long held constant into somewhat disrepute! ;):laugh

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Force
Is everyone using the same machine to calibrate or each person got their own machine?

Because if something rates 3.42 on one person's machine, then someone else calibrates theirs and it rates 3.61 for example, how accurate is it if there are two seperate machines doing the calibration?

Best way to tell if these machines are actually accurate is to get someone rate the same gripper on five different machines, then when the #'s come out different on each machine - is it the gripper that varies or the machines?

If you understood the concept of gravity then maybe you wouldn't be asking such silly questions! ;)

...or maybe there's a slightly stronger or weaker pull beneath each RGC, thus throwing a long held constant into somewhat disrepute! ;):laugh

One thing that affects calibration results, is the place of the strap on the gripper handle. Let's say you are calibratimg #1.5 and it was 100lbs. Then you move the strap 0,1" nearer to the spring. And lets say that the center of the mass moves from 3,94" to 3,84" away from the spring. You would have to put 102,6 lbs to get the handles touch. Rating changes from 1.62 to 1.72.

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Force

But as long as everyone uses 1" wide strap and put's the end of the strap at the end of the gripper very accurately, it's precice enough. And it is desirable that the dog leg is very accurately parallel to the ground. Spirit level is needed. If the gripper is not parallel to ground the center of mass changes.

Edited by Force

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Force
If the gripper is not parallel to ground the center of mass changes.

Actually this in not the main reason why gripper should be always at the same angle.

This if going to be bad english, hope you can understand;

The thing that matters is that if the angle of the gripper is different, the force component of the circles tangent will be different. And that's the force that works to shut the gripper.

Bottom line:

If everyone uses same kind of 1" straps and place it accurately at the end of the gripper and keeps the gripper accurately parallel to the ground, the calibration will be precise enough.

Edited by Force

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Autolupus
If the gripper is not parallel to ground the center of mass changes.

Actually this in not the main reason why gripper should be always at the same angle.

This if going to be bad english, hope you can understand;

The thing that matters is that if the angle of the gripper is different, the force component of the circles tangent will be different. And that's the force that works to shut the gripper.

Bottom line:

If everyone uses same kind of 1" straps and place it accurately at the end of the gripper and keeps the gripper accurately parallel to the ground, the calibration will be precise enough.

There's nothing quite like a good argument with yourself! ;):laugh

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Cannon
Is everyone using the same machine to calibrate or each person got their own machine?

Because if something rates 3.42 on one person's machine, then someone else calibrates theirs and it rates 3.61 for example, how accurate is it if there are two seperate machines doing the calibration?

Best way to tell if these machines are actually accurate is to get someone rate the same gripper on five different machines, then when the #'s come out different on each machine - is it the gripper that varies or the machines?

We've done this. Most people calibrating grippers have cross-calibrated with others to confirm accuracy. Up to a 5# variance is common. A 2.5# variance is very common. It's what we've accepted from our imperfect method of calibration.

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Matt Brouse

What are the odds of someone being able to "mass produce" a calibrating device? Like Horney or something...

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Cannon
What are the odds of someone being able to "mass produce" a calibrating device? Like Horney or something...

I don't think there would be a market. They are shockingly easy to make/obtain. I think the people who want them are getting them or making them.

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Guest Bullitt
Is everyone using the same machine to calibrate or each person got their own machine?

Because if something rates 3.42 on one person's machine, then someone else calibrates theirs and it rates 3.61 for example, how accurate is it if there are two seperate machines doing the calibration?

Best way to tell if these machines are actually accurate is to get someone rate the same gripper on five different machines, then when the #'s come out different on each machine - is it the gripper that varies or the machines?

Matti has done over 500 calibrations on the same set up.

http://p2.foorumi.info/rautakoura/viewtopic.php?p=17#17

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DannyGrip
Is everyone using the same machine to calibrate or each person got their own machine?

Because if something rates 3.42 on one person's machine, then someone else calibrates theirs and it rates 3.61 for example, how accurate is it if there are two seperate machines doing the calibration?

Best way to tell if these machines are actually accurate is to get someone rate the same gripper on five different machines, then when the #'s come out different on each machine - is it the gripper that varies or the machines?

We've done this. Most people calibrating grippers have cross-calibrated with others to confirm accuracy. Up to a 5# variance is common. A 2.5# variance is very common. It's what we've accepted from our imperfect method of calibration.

So maybe it's the calibration devices that vary more than CoC's actually vary.

I'm still waiting to feel a #2 that's easy or harder than the industry standards, all I've felt so far have seem to be about the same - even with different factors involved such as time of day, how rested, warmup, etc.

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Magnus
Is everyone using the same machine to calibrate or each person got their own machine?

Because if something rates 3.42 on one person's machine, then someone else calibrates theirs and it rates 3.61 for example, how accurate is it if there are two seperate machines doing the calibration?

Best way to tell if these machines are actually accurate is to get someone rate the same gripper on five different machines, then when the #'s come out different on each machine - is it the gripper that varies or the machines?

We've done this. Most people calibrating grippers have cross-calibrated with others to confirm accuracy. Up to a 5# variance is common. A 2.5# variance is very common. It's what we've accepted from our imperfect method of calibration.

So maybe it's the calibration devices that vary more than CoC's actually vary.

I'm still waiting to feel a #2 that's easy or harder than the industry standards, all I've felt so far have seem to be about the same - even with different factors involved such as time of day, how rested, warmup, etc.

Definitely not. Look at Matti's list. Extreme variations in grippers right across the board with the same plates, on the same device, calibrated by the same person. I've even got my own proof. I've got Luke's 3.5, and my own. They're both about the same age. Luke's is WAY harder (his is 178lb, mine I just did today 169.85). You got guys getting #3s pushing 160, and my own is 149.

CoCs vary, and they can vary plenty. It's just the way it is. Nobodies out to prosecute them for it (I really like CoCs), we're just pointing out that they don't have the military-spec accuracy they're cracked up to

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1stCoC

Danny and Force have some good points . We could easily make them here at Sorinex but as was mentioned there would be a limited amount of requests. If anyone does make an accepted, high quality unit, or would travel to calibrate I would like to buy one or get something going as the hundreds of grippers here would provide a good data base for comparison. I have a number of grippers that I always "wondered" about.In reflection considering my mechanical backround, the location of the strap, how the weight load is applied, (are the test weights calibrated?) along with side friction of the handles on the guide would have a definate influence on the resulting numbers. Anyone out there that can help me? Thanks, RS

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climber511

I have lost count of how many RGCs I have made for people but quite a few - I'll leave quality judgments to others? I have experimented quite a bit with mine. My personal results are repeatable within a couple pounds. The biggest change is between oiled and unoiled grippers - this can amount to fairly large changes in poundage required (as much as 20+# on one #4 I did) - I oil all grippers prior to calibration unless the owner requests that I not. Everything I use is calibrated as too weight and I am careful to use the same procedure each time. And while the poundage numbers do not reflect differences in hard/easy sweep versus hard/smooth close etc - they do give a pretty good idea of things for most but not all grippers - a few just defy the poundage numbers one way or the other in the way they feel. There are many variables in the way a given gripper will "feel" - calibration and then experience can give some pretty good information.

And yes - grippers with the same number or letter on the handle do vary quite a bit no matter who makes them - I have come to see that as a good thing as one can acquire intermediate grippers for smaller training steps towards a certain goal gripper. Calibration numbers should not be viewed the same as weight plates but they do offer some guidance that has value I think.

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1stCoC

Great info Chris. I want one! Can a first class unit be fit to a 3" tube power rack upright having 1 1/16" holes 2" on center? If so, please advise.RS

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climber511
Great info Chris. I want one! Can a first class unit be fit to a 3" tube power rack upright having 1 1/16" holes 2" on center? If so, please advise.RS

Richard - if you check my gallery you can see mine - it's for 2 1/2" sq tube but 3" is no different to make really. After you check and see if it is something you want - just let me know please. Chris

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climber511

I just received some of Jedd’s grippers to calibrate so I thought I’d kind of go through the process I do to calibrate them.

• First – they were dirty so I blew them out with the air hose. It’s always surprising how much dirt and stuff the springs hold.

• Then a few drops of oil on the springs – a hit with the air hose again gets the oil covering real nice and blows off some excess. Then wipe off with a rag as best you can.

• I got everything out for calibration – the RGC, strap, S hook, loading pin, and wooden separation block (all weighed). Also the spread sheets I will write everything on. I use little tags with string on them to write the result on attached to the spring – with that attached – I won’t confuse one with another by mistake if for example – we have multiple #3s or whatever. I finish each one before getting another one out.

• I then put a few wraps of that blue painters tape around the dog leg handle of each gripper where it will sit in the tube just to protect the handles – it doesn’t make much of a mark anyway if you don’t turn them under a load but it’s a bit of insurance when doing someone else’s grippers.

• Put the gripper in the RKC – the ends of the handles sticking out – dogleg (taped) side in the tube. Carefully align the other end (next to the spring) of the handle in the tube so they are even. Align the top handle so it is not touching the side rails. A few grippers will have a large “skew” and will line up and close funny no matter what you do.

• Put your 1” wide strap on the top (moveable) handle so that the end lines up with the end of the gripper handle – do this carefully. While holding the gripper so it doesn’t move – have your helper lift the loading pin up and hook the S hook into the pin with less than the approximate weight you think you will need to touch the handles together. Now put your spacer into the strap so that it spreads and does not touch the handles. Then gently add smaller plates just onto the 45# etc plates that are on the pin – as the handles get close – add very small plates until the handles touch – the smaller the better of course. You can move the handles sort of across each other to see if they are touching – the knurling will catch and let you know if in doubt. You do not have to remove and reload the loading pin each time you add a plate.

• You can only add so many plates onto the top of your base weight. When you reach that point – add another 45# plates and move on.

• Write down the weight of everything you put on when it closes – add it up – and there you have it. If you want to check it again – I take the loading pin off – then hook it back on and start completely over. You can make some funny things happen if you put too much weight on – take off a plate – pick up on the strap etc. For consistency – I think its best to do it the same each time you try and start from the top.

• Add up all weights and mark the tag – then do it again until you’re done.

I highly advise using two people – especially if you are doing bigger grippers – V-barring 200+# up and hooking it in while keeping the strap etc lined up gets old real fast. We use a handle and carabiner to lift with – then remove it after it’s clipped into the S hook. You’ll thank me for this tip after doing 20 or 30 grippers in a row. But if you want a big 2" V-Bar – feel free to practice here.

I can’t say this part enough - make sure your RGC set –up is anchored down and secure. An RGC creates a nice little leverage effect – and pulling over your Power Rack or shooting an RGC etc across the room because your clamping system fails might just leave a mark. I always load a bar up and put it in the rack to hold things down just as a precaution. Don’t say I didn’t tell you so.

I may have left a step or something out as I typed this and I’m open to any practical suggestions as to my method.

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Cannon

Chris, excellent write-up. This is exactly how I do it as well.

Another tip to calibrate by yourself: I have set up an iron pipe that is supported at one end and acts like a lever. I installed an eye-hook in the middle of the pipe where I can hookto the loading pin with an S-hook. I can then lift the weight easily with one hand and set the strap with the other. Once the weight load is on the gripper, you can remove the lever so it's not adding any weight to the calibration. I can very easily calibrate 200+ grippers this way by myself. It's even easier if your friend is on the lever and you can set the strap with both hands.

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Magnus

Yep, same way I do it, too.

For what it's worth, though, an ATV lift makes life WAY easier.

Edited by Magnus

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Force

Has anybody calibrated those "decoration" grippers like Galaxy, Super Galaxy, Universe and The Beast? And what are the wire sizes of those?

Edited by Force

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Tim71

Somebody on here attempted to calibrated the Super Galaxy a few years ago and it turned his power rack over. I think it was Kevin Bussi if I remember right. Search "super galaxy" and you'll see the thread. He estimated it would've took like 800 lbs or so. He did cal the Galaxy and it took 490 lbs I believe.

Galaxy currently has a wire size of .394 or 10mm. Super galaxy has .437 which I believe is 7/16 and universe / celestial / Beast has a .501 wire size. Older Galaxys had .375 or 3/8 inch FYI.

Here's the link to the thread. It's a funny read.

Super galaxy

Tim

I just read the thread and the Galaxy he cal'd seems like it was narrow so a full spread Galaxy would no doubt be more than 490. Also, I was wrong on his estimate, he says probably 900 to 1000 lbs to close the super galaxy.

Edited by Tim T

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Magnus
Somebody on here attempted to calibrated the Super Galaxy a few years ago and it turned his power rack over. I think it was Kevin Bussi if I remember right. Search "super galaxy" and you'll see the thread. He estimated it would've took like 800 lbs or so. He did cal the Galaxy and it took 490 lbs I believe.

Galaxy currently has a wire size of .394 or 10mm. Super galaxy has .437 which I believe is 7/16 and universe / celestial / Beast has a .501 wire size. Older Galaxys had .375 or 3/8 inch FYI.

Here's the link to the thread. It's a funny read.

Super galaxy

Tim

I just read the thread and the Galaxy he cal'd seems like it was narrow so a full spread Galaxy would no doubt be more than 490. Also, I was wrong on his estimate, he says probably 900 to 1000 lbs to close the super galaxy.

Makes you wonder what the Universe is.

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Force

Is the BB World Class .345? That seems to be the last gripper that has some sense in it, as if Pro:s calibrate around 250 and World Class around 270 (according to Matti's calibrations). And after that Galaxy takes a huge leap to useless numbers.

Anybody calibrated World Class narrow? World Class Narrow adjustable might be useful to some grip monsters. :)

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Tim71
Somebody on here attempted to calibrated the Super Galaxy a few years ago and it turned his power rack over. I think it was Kevin Bussi if I remember right. Search "super galaxy" and you'll see the thread. He estimated it would've took like 800 lbs or so. He did cal the Galaxy and it took 490 lbs I believe.

Galaxy currently has a wire size of .394 or 10mm. Super galaxy has .437 which I believe is 7/16 and universe / celestial / Beast has a .501 wire size. Older Galaxys had .375 or 3/8 inch FYI.

Here's the link to the thread. It's a funny read.

Super galaxy

Tim

I just read the thread and the Galaxy he cal'd seems like it was narrow so a full spread Galaxy would no doubt be more than 490. Also, I was wrong on his estimate, he says probably 900 to 1000 lbs to close the super galaxy.

Makes you wonder what the Universe is.

Here's the Universe:

Galaxy / Beast / Celestial

It's the same as the Beast and Celestial.

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