TelegraphKey Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 I just saw some comments elsewhere that blow my mind. Things like, "I closed such-and-such higher BB gripper, before I could no-set close CoC # 2." This blows my mind. Is a parallel (or closer) set really that much easier than a no-set? If that's the case, then I should be fairly close to set-closing a BBSM or maybe even a #3... (But why would any set be much easier than no-set? The springs make the gripper harder, the closer the handles are.) It sounds like the theory of using sets is similar to using partial-range motions in a bench press or squat, etc. Is that right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat 74 Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 Is a parallel (or closer) set really that much easier than a no-set? Yes. A lot of people don't practice no set work, but it is still much harder. People complain about hand size and it is a factor, but if you can no set a Trainer then you just have to get stronger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TelegraphKey Posted February 22, 2006 Author Share Posted February 22, 2006 Well, does a set work because, even though the last part is harder, it is less distance than full sweep (no-set), so your body can just concentrate on getting the s**t closed? I've thought about looking into setting stuff, but mainly I just close everything from full sweep. I've basically closed the 2, but only once or maybe twice. Most work has been either reps (no sets) (with #1 or Trainer) or gap-strap holds & negatives (with #2). I ordered a BBSM which should be here anyday now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jad Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 The no-set is just a matter of leverage or lack thereof. A #3 is only rated at X number of lbs whether you close it with no set or parallel set, it's the same spring. People with bigger hands have better leverage when it comes to no-setting grippers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironoak Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 I honestly dont get much out of setting. I position the gripper in my hand and use a full sweep motion. I feel that I can use more speed and explosive power this way. I dont feel comfortable using the traditional set. Thats just me though. I am sure it works well for others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rying Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 (But why would any set be much easier than no-set? The springs make the gripper harder, the closer the handles are.) The set is about more than just "getting through the beginning"--it's about getting better leverage at the close. Only when I could dominate the BBSM with a MM set could I close the #2 with a CC set (never could TNS the #2). My hands are 7.5" and it is a factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TelegraphKey Posted February 22, 2006 Author Share Posted February 22, 2006 Okay, thank you, guys. Set seems to be most useful for leverage purposes. Though I haven't tried it, I really can't imagine I could more easily close a higher gripper with a set than without one. I'll probably try it out eventually though, just to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Styles Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 I can no-set close an easy BBSA (1.3). I can set close an average 2. I've got 7" hands. The increase in leverage you get from a good set can make a huge difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fissure Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 All I can tell you is I closed my #3 for the first time this weekend using a MMS.However, almost all of my gripping is done NO Set - and when NSing, I can't close anything stronger than my HG300. I have to say, I didn't get alot of satisfaction from MMSing the #3. I felt like I was shooting for a 400lb bench and "settled" for a 400lb lockout. I think I'm gunna have to NS the #3 to feal like I really own it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tibere Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 What do you call small or large hand ? Mine are 7.4 is it small, medium, large ? Wich size is good for gripping ? thx. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Styles Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 IMO: 7" and under is small 7-8" is medium 8"+ is large I think the average man's hand is about 7.5" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jad Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 What do you call small or large hand ?Mine are 7.4 is it small, medium, large ? Wich size is good for gripping ? thx. Good question....I'll say this: mine are 7 5/8" and I wear a men's medium glove but it's a little too big: I can't get my keys out of my inside coat pocket or dial a cell phone, you can pinch a little excess on the end, etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubgeezer Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 IMO:7" and under is small 7-8" is medium 8"+ is large I think the average man's hand is about 7.5" I agree. I tell my son, who has 7.5 inch hands, that his hands are medium. However, by Gripboard Standards, they are small. I wonder what the average NBA player's hands are. HG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klicks Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 I no set closed my #2 today and I have been closing the #2 for lest then a month and I have no set closed it a few times before. I almost always CCS or no set close grippers. I guess when I first started I did not really know much about grippers except that you where supposed to close them, and when I saw a guy close a gripper with a MM set I thought he was cheating. Even though I now I know he was not cheating I still have it somewhere in the back of my head that you have not really closed the gripper unless you can CCS or no set close it. So I always do it that way. Well that is just my .02 Klicks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bencrush Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 Even though I now I know he was not cheating I still have it somewhere in the back of my head that you have not really closed the gripper unless you can CCS or no set close it. Most here on the GripBoard use an MMS exclusively. Some use the TNS and CCS in their training also. I and others will heartily disagree with you on your observation that you have not really closed the gripper unless it was CCS or NS closed. You will learn through trial and error, IF you try new things that are out of your current comfort zone, that MMS closing builds tremendous strength with the grippers. It builds up your CCS and your TNS also by virtue of just making you plain stronger overall. For instance: One man spends his entire training career ONLY doing TNS closes. He will be very limited in what he can close. He might be a genetic freak and still only get to the Elite level with the TNS stuff. He's not very likely to get to the Super Elite level with TNS. The other man spends his entire training career ONLY doing MMS closes. He will probably make it to the Super Elite level if he's a genetic freak and possibly higher than that with a lot of consistent workouts. He will probably be able to TNS close a #3 with no TNS training once he gets to the Super Elite level with the MMS. So who's stronger? The guy who can close a Super Elite MMS or the guy who can TNS close the Elite? Once you get your answer, you'll know which one to start training for. To me the answer is simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bencrush Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 I honestly dont get much out of setting. I position the gripper in my hand and use a full sweep motion. I feel that I can use more speed and explosive power this way. I dont feel comfortable using the traditional set. Thats just me though. I am sure it works well for others. The only reason the set hasn't worked for you is you haven't worked on it enough. If you spent a bit of time practicing the MMS technique, you would reap the benefits. Which means you'd close a harder gripper than you can NS close. There is no gray area here. MMS allows one to get better leverage. End of story. That's a good thing! So if your goal is closing a #3 and above, then MMS work is a good idea. If you want to get there only using TNS, then good luck. Because you'll need it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bencrush Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 All I can tell you is I closed my #3 for the first time this weekend using a MMS.However, almost all of my gripping is done NO Set - and when NSing, I can't close anything stronger than my HG300.I have to say, I didn't get alot of satisfaction from MMSing the #3. I felt like I was shooting for a 400lb bench and "settled" for a 400lb lockout. I think I'm gunna have to NS the #3 to feal like I really own it. Congrats on the #3 close by the way Fissure. If you didn't get a lot of satisfaction from MMS closing the #3, maybe you should try the Elite. Or the RB300. Or higher. MMS versus TNS...it's hard to compare the two, and before you ask, YES I am a fan of TNS and CCS closes, but it should be quite obvious that if someone can close a #4 with an MMS but can't TNS close an Elite, then I STILL consider the #4 (MMS) closer stronger than somone who can TNS the Elite but not MMS close the Super Elite. The above scenario is possible. I (and more here on the GB) can do the latter version. There are probably a few who fall into the first category. Of course if there was a contest where TNS was the only option, then the TNS closers would do well. But what some TNS-only trainees might not realize is that there was a graph produced from a poll here on the GripBoard that had some very interesting info on it regarding the max TNS and MMS closes of grip trainers. TNS-only trainers did well on TNS stuff, of course. But the MMS-only trainers also did well on the TNS stuff. AND more importantly, they were usually stronger on the max MMS closes than the TNS guys were. What seems to happen to most who use TNS to the exclusion of any other set is that they develop the ability to TNS close a gripper that is VERY close to their maximum. This is easily explained from the constant form and technique work they do on their pet set. What is interesting though, is the TNS guys tend to fall off about the #3 level when it comes to MMS strength. There are always exceptions, but I'm talking about strictly NS or TNS guys here. Whereas the MMS guys tend to fall off around the Elite level and their TNS strength was not too shabby either. So even without training the TNS, if you develop enough strength in the MMS, the TNS will improve also. It just won't be a one for one type of carryover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Lipinski Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 On some grippers, TNS is more like a party trick than really training. I mean, if you have to juggle the damn gripper around to get it your hand around it decent it is not a very productive use of your time. If you can find a gripper to fit your hand, the TNS stuff becomes more worthwhile. I can close something very very close to a #3 with a 2.5 spread, but much wider and I am useless. I can barely close my hard #2 with a 3"+ spread TNS. While both could be usefull training tools, in my experience training the set is much more effecient if your goal is to be good at both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bencrush Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 On some grippers, TNS is more like a party trick than really training. I mean, if you have to juggle the damn gripper around to get it your hand around it decent it is not a very productive use of your time.If you can find a gripper to fit your hand, the TNS stuff becomes more worthwhile. I can close something very very close to a #3 with a 2.5 spread, but much wider and I am useless. I can barely close my hard #2 with a 3"+ spread TNS. While both could be usefull training tools, in my experience training the set is much more effecient if your goal is to be good at both. AMEN Bob! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironoak Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 This is going to sound totally noobish but here it goes. What exactly does MMS, TNS and CCS closes mean? I just grab my grippers position it in my hand and squeeze. I am new to technique and would like to learn. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 (edited) My TNS is the strongest if I only train with a MM set and then just try a TNS on the odd occasion. I have tried to train solely TNS but I never got up to the level I achieved by not training it at all. To me, TNS training is a complete waist of time. It would have been more useful in real life if the handles moved in a parallel position throughout the close, which of course they don't. Edited February 23, 2006 by Mikael Siversson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bencrush Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 My TNS is the strongest if I only train with a MM set and then just try a TNS on the odd occasion. I have tried to train solely TNS but I never got up to the level I achieved by not training it at all. To me, TNS training is a complete waist of time. It would have been more useful in real life if the handles moved in a parallel position throughout the close, which of course they don't. I am curious what the best TNS close you've done is. I'm guessing it's pretty stout. #3 at least? Your MMS strength is WAY up there also if I'm not mistaken. By telling us you might help lend credence to my point about the strong MMS closers having a strong TNS close too without specialized training. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soilworker Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 This is going to sound totally noobish but here it goes. What exactly does MMS, TNS and CCS closes mean? I just grab my grippers position it in my hand and squeeze. I am new to technique and would like to learn. Thanks MMS= "Mash Monster Set". The Gripboard rules. TNS= "Table No-Set". A close with no help from the non gripping hand. CCS= "Credit Card Set." The Ironmind rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironoak Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 Thanks for the clarification soil. I never knew so much went into gripping. I am constantly learning as I go along and appreciate all the help I can get. Thanks man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soilworker Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 Thanks for the clarification soil. I never knew so much went into gripping. I am constantly learning as I go along and appreciate all the help I can get. Thanks man. You're welcome. As much as I hate to repeat what others say, your best friend is probably going to be the search button. As for me, I find that when my deeper set closes get stronger, my TNS closes follow suit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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