Integrity of Grip Contests

[jchapman]

25 minutes ago, Kluv#0 said:

This topic has branched off into people saying I accused Joe of "tampering" - that is ridiculous and it was never a consideration on my behalf nor did I post such nonsense. I was not alone  in thinking the results were very large vs. last year pulls.  I was very happy NOT jealous(why in the fudge would I be) of the results. I mentioned in earlier post I was wrong to single out Joe's lifts but I like to try to lift what he does( which is very hard to do) and thought WOW. I did not know there was a possible "harder" Crusher handle pre '16 and an "easier" handle.  However, when I get e-mails from people(over 10 that competed)most that are not even really close to me asking my perspective on crusher results - I just felt it would be wise if organizers issued a brief statement saying xyz and nothing nefarious took place. If that many are asking someone from Oregon,its pretty good assumption that the worldwide (yearly competitors) might have been seen results with some curiosity. 

But you did call for the results to be stricken from the contest and NAGS list, and then went into a detailed post that cited Joe's publicly posted training lifts as "evidence" that the KK18 results were not fair and legitimate.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, jchapman said:

But you did call for the results to be stricken from the contest and NAGS list, and then went into a detailed post that cited Joe's publicly posted training lifts as "evidence" that the KK18 results were not fair and legitimate.

100% truth. Just about every lift and notable fear I do is posted online at YouTube and Instagram  and many venues with different implements. Next someone is gong to say how fishy it is that Justin Major, Eric Roussin and myself fell in the same standing order of placing  against each other in the overall KK18 as we did last month as the cross Canada grip challenge overall. 

[Alawadhi]

@Jedd Johnson and @Joseph Sullivan you bad boys. Why did you tampered with the implements like timmy?! But that is the last time guys okay? Next time dont do that. Tampering and modifying is not allowed boys, okay? I guess also your amazing feats Jedd along with Laine in my place where things are a bit harder was also faked. Three years back i could hardly lift a blob (i guess) and this year i cleaned it with two fingers with you and Laine witnessing, that was fake too it seems based on the not high increase possible. What else is fake? This reminds me of an email to be honest Jedd, what do you think? Everything is possible.

[Alawadhi]

Leaving jokes aside, and to be fair, if FBBC wanna check a crusher, then all should be checked. But it is weird coming from a person who didn't compete. I am wondering it might be someone else behind him that is asking though. I hope his intentions were honest though.

[Mywor]

Great job by @Eric Roussin explaining the situation and hopefully everything clears out. I think it's fair to ask for proof and that's one of the reasons we had camera rolling for the whole 3 hours at Iisalmi venue. 

@Jedd Johnson@Joseph Sullivan We always use the easiest Hubs, Moontops, Pinch blocks in Finland, and if we had a little bit easier Crusher we would definitely use that one (no tampering etc of course). To say they cheated because they used (maybe) easier, but legimate Crusher is absurd. Also Jedd just cleaned the INCH, I'd say his 102kg crusher is on point. 

Ps: please let's all be friends and keep pushing grip forward

 

Edited October 31, 2018 by Mywor

[Andrew P]

I already checked everything I have in inventory and all of the 27pc showed zero issues that could slow down the spin. It's the same tooling and design revision sense I removed the washers back in 7/10/2015. Give or take a few months I had the PO to the shop but tossed out the shipper for when I received them.

[Vinnie]

I am still a bit of a newb, with less than a year in the sport (but three comps now!) -- and newb that I am, even I have noticed EXTREME variety of results on the same model of implement -- with no alteration or cheat, just the seasoning of climate, chalk, and long use.  As the guy from Finland posted, since there is variety among qualified implements based on seasoning, we all hope to use well-seasoned implements at comps rather than fresh from the box slick ones.  If that is not permitted, you need to disqualify Queens because I have no interest in dishonest placement either.  But it IS permitted, and EVERY venue did just that -- used their best, but still unaltered, qualified implements.  In a multi-venue comp, there is no way to be precise.  You can even make all the promoters buy brand new implements, but the construction may not be 100% uniform and skill at chalking can make for differences.  That is always going to result in some apparent performance anomalies because people don't always use the contest implements when they work out and post progress.  There may be times when cheating takes place in multi-venue contests, but an anomaly is not enough by itself to suggest it, let alone prove it, and I doubt it took place here -- and the check on the implement now taking place should resolve that.  Joe doesn't even like to set his grippers, and I for one do not believe for a second that he was dishonest to pad his results.  I am pretty sure that having seen the rest of the thread, Michael may agree with that by now if he didn't before.  And if it turns out that there was a problem with that crusher, I still won't think it was dishonesty, but just a mistaken belief that it was a nicely seasoned but qualified implement like we all hope to get at a comp.  And if you want a more precise comparison, just go look at the results from a single venue comp where both competitors used the same implement.  That is all.

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, Mywor said:

Great job by @Eric Roussin explaining the situation and hopefully everything clears out. I think it's fair to ask for proof and that's one of the reasons we had camera rolling for the whole 3 hours at Iisalmi venue. 

@Jedd Johnson@Joseph Sullivan We always use the easiest Hubs, Moontops, Pinch blocks in Finland, and if we had a little bit easier Crusher we would definitely use that one (no tampering etc of course). To say they cheated because they used (maybe) easier, but legimate Crusher is absurd. 

Ps: please let's all be friends and keep pushing grip forward

 

I believe every single lift done was filmed at our Venue. Am I correct @Jedd Johnson ?

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Vinnie said:

I am still a bit of a newb, with less than a year in the sport (but three comps now!) -- and newb that I am, even I have noticed EXTREME variety of results on the same model of implement -- with no alteration or cheat, just the seasoning of climate, chalk, and long use.  As the guy from Finland posted, since there is variety among qualified implements based on seasoning, we all hope to use well-seasoned implements at comps rather than fresh from the box slick ones.  If that is not permitted, you need to disqualify Queens because I have no interest in dishonest placement either.  But it IS permitted, and EVERY venue did just that -- used their best, but still unaltered, qualified implements.  In a multi-venue comp, there is no way to be precise.  You can even make all the promoters buy brand new implements, but the construction may not be 100% uniform and skill at chalking can make for differences.  That is always going to result in some apparent performance anomalies because people don't always use the contest implements when they work out and post progress.  There may be times when cheating takes place in multi-venue contests, but an anomaly is not enough by itself to suggest it, let alone prove it, and I doubt it took place here -- and the check on the implement now taking place should resolve that.  Joe doesn't even like to set his grippers, and I for one do not believe for a second that he was dishonest to pad his results.  I am pretty sure that having seen the rest of the thread, Michael may agree with that by now if he didn't before.  And if it turns out that there was a problem with that crusher, I still won't think it was dishonesty, but just a mistaken belief that it was a nicely seasoned but qualified implement like we all hope to get at a comp.  And if you want a more precise comparison, just go look at the results from a single venue comp where both competitors used the same implement.  That is all.

You know me Vinny!! I always go for the harder way! 

[Anthony C.]

Reading this thread was brutal.

An injury kept me out of this year's King Kong, but I'm no stranger to competing. It's common and expected, actually, to compare implements at the venue and decide which one to use based on what has the best seasoning.

Was it an FBBC Crusher?  Did the rules state that a specific year/model of the crusher had to be used?

You train your ass off to get strong and when you actually make gains, it has to be because you cheated, right?

Or, because I usually lift around the same weight as you, and at the contest you lifted more than what I can do, that means you cheated!

This is just embarrassing.

 

 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Anthony C. said:

Reading this thread was brutal.

An injury kept me out of this year's King Kong, but I'm no stranger to competing. It's common and expected, actually, to compare implements at the venue and decide which one to use based on what has the best seasoning.

Was it an FBBC Crusher?  Did the rules state that a specific year/model of the crusher had to be used?

You train your ass off to get strong and when you actually make gains, it has to be because you cheated, right?

Or, because I usually lift around the same weight as you, and at the contest you lifted more than what I can do, that means you cheated!

This is just embarrassing.

 

 

I guess I should take it as a compliment. I know what I did, what I can do, and will continue to do. I am very new at this and one of the most determined and ethical people you will ever meet. I literally get stronger on these implements near every time I touch them. So, thanks for the compliment @Kluv#0

[Tom Flesher]

13 minutes ago, Vinnie said:

You can even make all the promoters buy brand new implements, but the construction may not be 100% uniform and skill at chalking can make for differences.

If this were the case I'd anticipate that @John McCarter would auction himself off to compete at the highest-bidding venue, and by the way chalk all the implements the day of.

Edited October 31, 2018 by Tom Flesher
Fixing a typo that I made with my stupid giant fingers

[Alawadhi]

18 minutes ago, Vinnie said:

I am still a bit of a newb, with less than a year in the sport (but three comps now!) -- and newb that I am, even I have noticed EXTREME variety of results on the same model of implement -- with no alteration or cheat, just the seasoning of climate, chalk, and long use.  As the guy from Finland posted, since there is variety among qualified implements based on seasoning, we all hope to use well-seasoned implements at comps rather than fresh from the box slick ones.  If that is not permitted, you need to disqualify Queens because I have no interest in dishonest placement either.  But it IS permitted, and EVERY venue did just that -- used their best, but still unaltered, qualified implements.  In a multi-venue comp, there is no way to be precise.  You can even make all the promoters buy brand new implements, but the construction may not be 100% uniform and skill at chalking can make for differences.  That is always going to result in some apparent performance anomalies because people don't always use the contest implements when they work out and post progress.  There may be times when cheating takes place in multi-venue contests, but an anomaly is not enough by itself to suggest it, let alone prove it, and I doubt it took place here -- and the check on the implement now taking place should resolve that.  Joe doesn't even like to set his grippers, and I for one do not believe for a second that he was dishonest to pad his results.  I am pretty sure that having seen the rest of the thread, Michael may agree with that by now if he didn't before.  And if it turns out that there was a problem with that crusher, I still won't think it was dishonesty, but just a mistaken belief that it was a nicely seasoned but qualified implement like we all hope to get at a comp.  And if you want a more precise comparison, just go look at the results from a single venue comp where both competitors used the same implement.  That is all.

Yes and no. We didn't have the jug until 2 weeks before the contest. Its as slick as a stainless steel soaked in oil. No but you get the point. My items is shitty seasoned and I don't b!t€ about it. When i go competing in thing like gripmas then its 100 percent same implements. But besides that, we chose to compete in this. It's fun and that's all needed for me. But assuming I had a well seasoned jug or whatsoever, I am not stupid to use a harder one. The rules dont say anything about it.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Alawadhi said:

Yes and no. We didn't have the jug until 2 weeks before the contest. Its as slick as a stainless steel soaked in oil. No but you get the point. My items is shitty seasoned and I don't b!t€ about it. When i go competing in thing like gripmas then its 100 percent same implements. But besides that, we chose to compete in this. It's fun and that's all needed for me. But assuming I had a well seasoned jug or whatsoever, I am not stupid to use a harder one. The rules dont say anything about it.

A jug is a jug..... of course of course. A crushers a crusher..... of course of course.... but most importantly... A HORSE IS A HORSE OF COURSE OF COURSE!!! Hahahah   

[Vinnie]

3 minutes ago, Alawadhi said:

Yes and no. We didn't have the jug until 2 weeks before the contest. Its as slick as a stainless steel soaked in oil. No but you get the point. My items is shitty seasoned and I don't b!t€ about it. When i go competing in thing like gripmas then its 100 percent same implements. But besides that, we chose to compete in this. It's fun and that's all needed for me. But assuming I had a well seasoned jug or whatsoever, I am not stupid to use a harder one. The rules dont say anything about it.

Well, sounds like you did use your best jug, it just happened to suck lol.  Anyway, hope to meet you at Gripmas.  Looking forward to it!

[Vinnie]

Just now, Joseph Sullivan said:

A jug is a jug..... of course of course. A crushers a crusher..... of course of course.... but most importantly... A HORSE IS A HORSE OF COURSE OF COURSE!!! Hahahah   

Some of the younger folks here won't get that reference.  Might have to, er, ED-ucate them ...

[Fist of Fury]

1 hour ago, Mywor said:

Great job by @Eric Roussin explaining the situation and hopefully everything clears out. I think it's fair to ask for proof and that's one of the reasons we had camera rolling for the whole 3 hours at Iisalmi venue. 

@Jedd Johnson@Joseph Sullivan We always use the easiest Hubs, Moontops, Pinch blocks in Finland, and if we had a little bit easier Crusher we would definitely use that one (no tampering etc of course). To say they cheated because they used (maybe) easier, but legimate Crusher is absurd. Also Jedd just cleaned the INCH, I'd say his 102kg crusher is on point. 

Ps: please let's all be friends and keep pushing grip forward

 

I completely agree. I expected Jedd to pull 100+ on the Crusher. The only surprise for me was that Alexey didn't win the Crusher event.

[Guest]

So, I just went to Instagram and looked at others crushers. Many are the same as mine. No difference at all. Same model. I won’t post anyone’s pics up though, not gonna throw anyone under a bus for using proper, legal equipment. Just not my style. And uncalled for.

[Jedd Johnson]

2 hours ago, Joseph Sullivan said:

I believe every single lift done was filmed at our Venue. Am I correct @Jedd Johnson ?

I think so, but I haven' even turned the camera back on.  And my dad was running it, and he missed a world record attempt of mine a couple years ago, so no promises.

[Kluv#0]

When you make a decision to submit something you also have to deal with whatever consequences may come. I was wrong to the organizers of KK- Eric R. and Andrew P. for my harsh statements- I apologize. I was wrong to Joe for involving his vid and my subsequent comments- I have had that done to me numerous times and it pisses me off, too- Iam sorry Joe. I was wrong to insinuate that something was not above board at the Penn. Location- Iam sorry to Jedd. I apologize for to the entire Gripboard it sucks - I screwed up- wish there were mulligans but I can say I was in the wrong. I have been on this board for over 2 years and seen countless contest results and I have always made an effort when seeing them to congratulate all athletes NEVER questioning results or lifts. Furthermore, anyone who posts vids of various grip feats, achievements on here- big or small I always give a shout out to them. Iam no saint but Iam no jealous hater.

[Lucasraymond]

Jedd and I improved 5lbs on flask (we both just missed 7lb improvements), Rindo improved 7lbs. I inproved 20lbs on 2.5” crusher (which i couldnt loft the inch db consistently up until the past two months), and my 2.5” jug record is higher amount than my 2” vbar from last year. It is amazing what consistent training before a contest for 10-12 weeks does instead waiting til 5-6 weeks before the event. And fyi I made a 40lb improvement on the jug in the last 3 weeks. 

Other things people dont see is the jumps that people are taking; one weight feels light so you do a 10-15lb jump and just miss it; does that mean you are 15 lbs weaker or just that it wasnt your day at that weight. So many variables involved that could be the reason for improvement from one year to the next

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, Kluv#0 said:

When you make a decision to submit something you also have to deal with whatever consequences may come. I was wrong to the organizers of KK- Eric R. and Andrew P. for my harsh statements- I apologize. I was wrong to Joe for involving his vid and my subsequent comments- I have had that done to me numerous times and it pisses me off, too- Iam sorry Joe. I was wrong to insinuate that something was not above board at the Penn. Location- Iam sorry to Jedd. I apologize for to the entire Gripboard it sucks - I screwed up- wish there were mulligans but I can say I was in the wrong. I have been on this board for over 2 years and seen countless contest results and I have always made an effort when seeing them to congratulate all athletes NEVER questioning results or lifts. Furthermore, anyone who posts vids of various grip feats, achievements on here- big or small I always give a shout out to them. Iam no saint but Iam no jealous hater.

I always forgive a man that asks. Apologies accepted!

[John McCarter]

5 hours ago, Tom Flesher said:

If this were the case I'd anticipate that @John McCarter would auction himself off to compete at the highest-bidding venue, and by the way chalk all the implements the day of.

Good one

 

[Mike Rinderle]

19 minutes ago, Lucasraymond said:

Jedd and I improved 5lbs on flask (we both just missed 7lb improvements), Rindo improved 7lbs. I inproved 20lbs on 2.5” crusher (which i couldnt loft the inch db consistently up until the past two months), and my 2.5” jug record is higher amount than my 2” vbar from last year. It is amazing what consistent training before a contest for 10-12 weeks does instead waiting til 5-6 weeks before the event. And fyi I made a 40lb improvement on the jug in the last 3 weeks. 

Other things people dont see is the jumps that people are taking; one weight feels light so you do a 10-15lb jump and just miss it; does that mean you are 15 lbs weaker or just that it wasnt your day at that weight. So many variables involved that could be the reason for improvement from one year to the next

And some of us actually decide to train  grip and events instead of just showing up to a couple contests a year and winging it.    That's where my improvement came from.  For the first time in several years I actually trained my grip consistently.  I trained a little before KK 17, and the results were encouraging enough that I really dedicated myself to getting better for this year's NAGS and KK contests.  Honestly, based on my training, I was a little disappointed where I ended up.

Flask:  I had pulled 110 on my 2" pinch block and was hoping I would be able to match that on contest day.  Ended up with 105.8, which was still a 7 lb PR and a 7.1% jump over last year.  Good for 11th overall, 3rd in the 120KG class, and 2nd in Masters.  I was already at 14th in the world from last year, so I didn't have as much room for improvement as i did on the crusher.  So I'm not too dissapointed.  I think you will see 115 out of me before I hang it up.

Crusher:  Had never trained a revolving handle until I bought a super slick Titan 2.5" handle in April.  When I got that, I could pull 161.5 on it.  Right before the contest, i hit 184.  I was hoping for 190 on the crusher since it has better texture, but I was a little tired from the flask and had to settle for 187.3 lbs.  Honestly, I was a little disappointed, as anyone who has tried a Titan Snot handle knows how slick they are.  Not exactly sure how much more than the year before, but at least 30 lbs.  Finished 24th overall, 4th in 120KG class, and 4th in masters.  Big improvement (about 20%), but not what I wanted.  Still work to be done.  I think I have 200 in me down the road.  If Sullivan can do, I know I can.  Bwahahaha

Moon Top.  87th overall, 17th in 120kg class, and 6th in masters.  I hate it.  Nuff said.  Nothing to compare it to because I had only messed around with the older version (which is easier) a few times. 

Jug: I have never tried a jug before, or anything 2.5" vertically.  At one point, I pulled 291 on my 2" vbar, but I was well below that coming into the contest because i was unable to train Vbar much because it aggravated my torn rotator cuff and partially torn bicep.  Ended up getting 219.8 lbs.  Jumped to 230 or 231 and missed 4 times.  Got decent air on all 4 attempts, but couldn't quite get it there.  Got 225 in warmups pretty easy.  I was probably good for 227,  so I left a smidge on the table there.  Since my 2" vbar is probably around 250 or 260 right now, I'm pretty happy with that.  29th overall.  5th in 120kg class.  4th in masters

 

I definitely spent the majority of my time training the 2.5" rotating handle because that's where I had the most improvement to make.  It was a big increase for me, but I had the most improvement to make there for sure.  Even so, I finished 24th in that, which was well below where I was in the flask and barely above where i was with the jug.  Screw the moon drop.  So about where you could have expected me to finish given where the other competitors finished.  Did I mention how much I hate the MT?

[Mike Rinderle]

1 hour ago, Kluv#0 said:

When you make a decision to submit something you also have to deal with whatever consequences may come. I was wrong to the organizers of KK- Eric R. and Andrew P. for my harsh statements- I apologize. I was wrong to Joe for involving his vid and my subsequent comments- I have had that done to me numerous times and it pisses me off, too- Iam sorry Joe. I was wrong to insinuate that something was not above board at the Penn. Location- Iam sorry to Jedd. I apologize for to the entire Gripboard it sucks - I screwed up- wish there were mulligans but I can say I was in the wrong. I have been on this board for over 2 years and seen countless contest results and I have always made an effort when seeing them to congratulate all athletes NEVER questioning results or lifts. Furthermore, anyone who posts vids of various grip feats, achievements on here- big or small I always give a shout out to them. Iam no saint but Iam no jealous hater.

If I had a nickel for every iladvised post I've made over the years, I'd be doing ok.  Of course Tommy J would still be able to buy and sell me 100 X over.  HAHA  JK Tommy. 

Takes a big man to admit when they have made a mistake and ask for forgiveness.  I'm sure the people on this board will be gracious in accepting your apology.  Now let's all get gripping!!!