Bill Piche Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 It appears I accidently sent the MMG1 DUD to Rick. I had ONE of these among my grippers and I should have gotten rid of it. I believe it was because I was in a hurry and just took the gripper off my rack and looked at the bottoms really quick. It's more like a hard MMG2. Rick told me Steve closed it anyway! My deepest apologies to Steve. I won't screw up like this again. I will completely verify this was the case by checking my grippers at work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Walker Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 We knew something was wrong when steve looked at me and said, "Man, that thing is like a 3.5!" This coming from a guy who is 1/4" or less from closing a #4, and a guy who reps a #3 like I rep a #1. No problems Bill. We thought you were playing a joke on us at first... Rick Walker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Steve Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 I hope I am right. I did have a strong week of training and a lot of PRs and a 1 hr and 1/2 show. So I was feeling a little weak. But when it was matching up with my dud I started laughing and joked that Bill was pulling my leg. Don't worry, it was fun! We laughed and shook our heads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Piche Posted October 12, 2004 Author Share Posted October 12, 2004 No joke Rick. I think I messed up. Are you going to send the video with the gripper? The MMG form as well? My take on this is the handles are stamped per the MMG because it was an early prototype (deemed too hard for level 1!). Therefore, he offically gets the MMG1 close. I believe both Heath and Rick have both tried this thing and can vouch for what a beast it is. I know it's much harder than the cert MMG1's. It's only fair to Steve to get credit for the MMG1 on this screwup. Again, I will absolutely confirm tomorrow I screwed up. Rick said the measurement from the bottom of the spring to the handle top is more like 1/8". The MMG1 is 1/4". So, this was a clue before actual confirmation that I screwd up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricMilfeld Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 The outcome would have been entirely different had you sent that thing to me. I would have felt like a worthless grip peon until I was enlightened as to the gripper's true identity. Man, the damage something like this could do to guy's ego! Very dangerous. Never again let this happen, Bill. So actually, is it safe to say the Big Man closed one atleast as strong as the MM2? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankyBoy Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 For Bill: For Steve: Good that Steve had the power to close that beast. For sure it's only fair that he receives the certification. Bill told me more than once that he is afraid the MMs and the duds are getting messed up one day. Luckily it happened to Steve who closed it nevertheless. Congrats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jad Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Great job Steve I have one of the early MM1duds and it is substantially harder than my MM2dud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Piche Posted October 12, 2004 Author Share Posted October 12, 2004 Yes, the MMG1 Dud is as least as strong as the current MMG2. Probably harder. I am still at home but will be confirming this morning. Also, if it turns out I did not screw up, I will make a video showing the dud and the 2 MMG1 cert grippers I have here to show the differences. History: there were 3 MMG1 duds. Rick bought two of them (they are definitely gone from my house!). One remained with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedd Johnson Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 I squeezed one of Rick's duds before, and they are no joke. Way tougher than the actual MM1. -Jedd- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Piche Posted October 12, 2004 Author Share Posted October 12, 2004 Here's the good news (from my perspective anyway! ) The MM dud was in my bag. No question. So, I did not mess up. That's an offical MMG1 gripper. Just to prove it so no one doubts me. I will take video of the MMG Dud (only THREE in existence -- Rick had two of them) so I have ONE of them and will show them next to the two MMG1's cert grippers that are backups (the other cert MMG1 is the one Steve used). I am vindicated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 I was hoping you messed up, Bill. Now I must continue my three year search to find a mistake you have made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mac Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Well, congrats to Steve anyway! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jad Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Rick said the measurement from the bottom of the spring to the handle top is more like 1/8". The MMG1 is 1/4". So, this was a clue before actual confirmation that I screwd up. So if you sent him the real MM1 gripper is the one you sent him just off on the mounting?? I"m not doubting your word Wannagrip but I thought the point of the MM process was that everyone used the same grippers and if the mounting is more like an 1/8 then 1/4 that's a big difference....basically a whole MM level difference. I'm very confused please help???????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Walker Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Well, I will say this: This gripper steve used was no where near the strength of the gripper I certified on. Not even close. This gripper was MUCH harder. The difference was night and day. I spoke with Jedd last night-his opinion matched the opinion of the Vigeant's, Heath, and my very own: the MM1 is basically a medium to tough #3 in strength. We have all closed tons and tons of #3s. I have closed some #3s that had handle spreads wider then I have ever seen prior. Austin sent me a #3 that used to belong to the Vigeant's that was HARDER then the MM1 I recieved for certification. I closed it cold. Now-my crush is not super high, but it aint bad. I took down a hard #3 with ease with my left hand at GGC, then overcrushed an MM1 replica, that both Vigeant's believe to be harder then the MM1 cert. gripper they recieved (with slightly narrower handles) again, with my weaker hand. Yesterday I took down my son's 2003 #3, Steve's extremely filed #3, Steve's normal #3 (was less then 1/4" with a no set) and jut outside of 1/4" on Steve's MM1 DUD (one of the 2 I purchased from you Bill). I did all of that with my left hand. After Steve certified (he closed it twice with his right hand, video turned out very good-missed it once left) I had to squeeze the MM1. I know it is against the rules, but to see the big man get the handles of a #4 to 1/4 or less, and be less then a credit card on the MM1 DUD (could just see daylight), then have an all out PR squeeze to hit this MM1-I just had to see what was up. I was outside of 1/4" on it-WITH BOTH HANDS! So, it appears we may have a problem with the grippers all being alike. A BIG problem. If I would have recieved this gripper for my cert back in Feb., I would have NEVER been certified. Period. When I recieved the MM1 gripper in Feb. it had a very spongy sweep and a strong close. I was able to set it with no trouble. From the 1 inch mark down was where it got stout. I could not set this gripper with any kind of comfort. This is a huge issue IMO. This gripper will stop a lot of people who are at the MM1 level with the gripper I used. It is your certification process Bill, and your call-but I think this is an issue that needs ironed out. Regardless-Steve closed it, with a huge effort no less, but he still closed it. I know Steve, and I know he wont say a word. Maybe I just lost a lot of strength in my grippers since GGC-but I doubt it. This morning, to be sure, I clicked off some more singles wiht my son's 2003 #3 with ease...so who knows... Rick Walker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Walker Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Forgot to add this. I dont know what I was more impressed with, Big Steve's closing of this very stout gripper, and his performances on other grippers, or his strength show afterwards. He 2-hand pinched 207 with ease, then had 217 going before he lost it. He then got 102-pounds about 8 inches up with 1-hand before he lost it (2-45s, 2-2.5s, 7-pound pipe through the middle of them.) I might add that the 45s where coated in mud from our previous flood making them SLICK. He didnt even clean them off. Then-he made a coupld attempts at cleaning 3-25s. Had them moving, but couldnt transition over. His thumb pads were destroyed! He wasnt done. He pinched 2-45s, then proceeded to pass them back and fourth from hand to hand. How many times??? 31 He then went outside to the giant axle Dave Morton left here for him. It is 3 inches in diameter and over 11 feet in length. Solid all the way through and very close to 300 pounds. Me and Shrug handed it to him so it was racked on his shoudlers. Then Steve did 12 reps with it, fully locking it out each time, overhead. The man is only getting stronger. He is a freak of nature-and man oh man, I am glad I have the chance to train with him from time to time. Rick Walker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedd Johnson Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 The MM1 that I got was a joke compared to my easiest of threes. The MM Dud that Rick let me borrow was close in strength to an MM3 Replica that Gamidon let me borrow. There's some major variance there. I am sorry, but I think that is a problem. I am willing to help out anyway I can in re-calibrating grippers if need be. -Jedd- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mac Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 31 times? Bloody hell! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clay Edgin Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Great crushing Steve! I thought I was just having a "down" day when I tried the MM1, but it seemed to me that the MM1 was as hard or harder than the MM2. Definitely harder than a #3. Maybe the MM1 grippers need to be recalibrated or at least have one person try all three at once? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Walker Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Great crushing Steve!I thought I was just having a "down" day when I tried the MM1, but it seemed to me that the MM1 was as hard or harder than the MM2. Definitely harder than a #3. Maybe the MM1 grippers need to be recalibrated or at least have one person try all three at once? ← Ahh.. Now it does seem as if there is some variance. Rick Walker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 (edited) Great crushing Steve!I thought I was just having a "down" day when I tried the MM1, but it seemed to me that the MM1 was as hard or harder than the MM2. Definitely harder than a #3. Maybe the MM1 grippers need to be recalibrated or at least have one person try all three at once? ← Ahh.. Now it does seem as if there is some variance. Rick Walker ← For the LGC competitions, we test new grippers against calibrated ones back to back about 15 closes each gripper (over several workouts), working in the 1/64-1/8'' range. In some cases up to three people have tested the same two grippers, totalling over 40 attempts each gripper. The same should perhaps have been done with the the original MM Grippers. Edited October 12, 2004 by Mikael Siversson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jad Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 However they are recalibrated or if they are at all, if the MM1 is supposed to be mounted at 1/4 and one of them is mounted around 1/8 then it should be disqualified as far as a MM1 gripper because it's certainly not the same gripper and invalidates the whole process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankyBoy Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 (edited) Not sure if I should add some comments here. Perhaps it helps: The MM1 was always thought to a gripper comparable to a hard #3 and was rated as a 3.2 by Heath. The MM1 Florian closed was nearly exact of the strength he has expected. (Between the 3.22 and the 3.38 Elites of the Europeans). And it was almost identical to my MM1 replica with an 1/4 spring depth. (Our MM1 spring was mounter at 1/4 of course, the grippers looked and felt like twins). Florian couldn't tell which one is easier. So the questions is: Was the gripper Florian certified on the one which was sent to Steve? (Steve was the very next after Florian) To be honest I doubt this unless there are influences on gripper strength we don't yet know. For Florian the MM1 was a good step up from an average #3 and our feeling of an average #3 was well confirmed by the 3.0 gripper of the Europeans. So the gripper sent to me was definately the MM1 according all the information we gathered up to this point. So the MM1 of Steve was either an early dud or another 'original' MM1 (out of the three) gripper with different strength? Edited October 12, 2004 by FrankyBoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGuy Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 You all need to READ Wannagrip's post. He says he sent an early prototype for the MM cert program by mistake. That gripper has never been sent to anyone else, and is not part of MM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikael Siversson Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Hmm, really? I thought he concluded that it was a genuine MM1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankyBoy Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Oldguy: This was Bills latest post on this topic : Here's the good news (from my perspective anyway! ) The MM dud was in my bag. No question. So, I did not mess up. That's an offical MMG1 gripper. Just to prove it so no one doubts me. I will take video of the MMG Dud (only THREE in existence -- Rick had two of them) so I have ONE of them and will show them next to the two MMG1's cert grippers that are backups (the other cert MMG1 is the one Steve used). I am vindicated. ← Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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