Mephistopholes Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 So I've never done choker work before, but lately I've been throwing the idea around... I've been thinking of maybe applying the progressive distance principle (like you would use with partial range squats or deadlifts) with a choker, starting from a very narrow range with a heavier gripper than I can normally handle, and opening it up little by little over time, increasing the ROM until it's all the way open, like 2mm a week or so. The thing is, this would require me to choke a gripper down to a range not normally used in choker work. I know it's been pretty much agreed upon that choking a gripper to about 20mm doesn't hurt the spring, but what I'm talking about is choking it to a much narrower range, starting at like 5mm and working outward from there... Does anyone know if this choking a gripper to such an extreme range would damage the spring? And besides that, has anyone tried this and have an opinion on it? Thanks, Bobby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANCRUSHER Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 So I've never done choker work before, but lately I've been throwing the idea around... I've been thinking of maybe applying the progressive distance principle (like you would use with partial range squats or deadlifts) with a choker, starting from a very narrow range with a heavier gripper than I can normally handle, and opening it up little by little over time, increasing the ROM until it's all the way open, like 2mm a week or so. The thing is, this would require me to choke a gripper down to a range not normally used in choker work. I know it's been pretty much agreed upon that choking a gripper to about 20mm doesn't hurt the spring, but what I'm talking about is choking it to a much narrower range, starting at like 5mm and working outward from there... Does anyone know if this choking a gripper to such an extreme range would damage the spring? And besides that, has anyone tried this and have an opinion on it? Thanks, Bobby I do not think that chokers can damage the spring in anyway but to me choking down a gripper to 5 mm seems pretty "useless"; of course it will develop some strength but your hand will be in a very advantaged position that can't be replicated during the set. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 Well, it's intended as supplemental, not to be "all" of my work. Haha. Just a little part of it. Like doing 1/4 squats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Scibelli Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 I don't think it would damage it, especially if you took the hose clamp off after ever workout and then the next workout you could just put it back on to the width that you're working towards. I think it's a good idea, adjust it 2mm's wider each workout, go for it! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 I may, I may. Haha. Even if the progressive distance thing doesn't work out, this could helpmeet strengthen those last few mms, I think. That's where I always have trouble... I mean, I know thats the toughest part for anybody. Haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 I mean that, all the no set stuff I do, especially with the silver bulllet holds, has made closing a goal gripper up to those last few mms easy, because I've been applying overload in that range... So now I need to apply overload in the narrow range to make my gains there... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellswindstaff Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 (edited) A lot of my training has revolved around progressive movement training; here is my two cents. Gains will come fast in certain ROMS, but as the distance of movement increases you will find that there are leverage changes that cause a big drop in your strength curve. Also, you can't hide behind acceleration and momentum to blast you through that particular sticking point... this method trains almost exclusively starting strength from every part of the movement, that's the downside. The upside is once you flatten out your strength curve then just about anything that you can get moving, you can finish... evening it out will take a while though, so this system will take patience. Also, you more than likely won't see any jumps in your absolute strength for your full ROMs for a while but when you do it will be BIG! It will be interesting to see how this plays out for you because the curve required for a gripper close isn't constant... it would be interesting to see both someones strength curve graphed with a grippers strength curve at varying ranges of motion. x=ROM, y=force production Edited February 19, 2013 by hellswindstaff 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 Very interesting, thanks for the insight... Yeah I'm not so worried about being able to close the gripper I'm choking in a full ROM... The idea is overload, which will make me more efficient in that particular ROM when "actually" trying to close a lighter gripper in a full ROM. Like I said, the extra heavy silver bullet holds I've done have helped strengthen me in the ROM from open to a little inside parallel through overload, so now I need to strenthen the inner ROM through a different application of overload. Case in point: narrow choker work and progressive distance. Excited to try this out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 What about tape? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellswindstaff Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 What about tape? What do you mean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 I mean, taping the gripper handles to protect the knurling where the choker will be. I've read about people doing that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Matney Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 I used athletic tape around the top of the handles and it worked great. if you apply it thick enough, it even holds the clamp in place. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 I used athletic tape around the top of the handles and it worked great. if you apply it thick enough, it even holds the clamp in place. Awesome, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat 74 Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 It may sound crazy but when I do choker work I mark my hand for placement. Take a weak gripper and set it like normal, then take a sharpie and draw a line on the palm of your hand for the palm side handle. Now you can use a choked gripper at whatever width you want and it will still be in the same range as a set. I was bad to move the choked stuff higher up towards my fingers giving me a great leverage position but I was having zero carry over. When I kept the handles where they were supposed to be and used a choker I could see carryover. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
climber511 Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 It will mess up the rating on Heavygrip grippers over time to leave them choked but won't change COCs - BBs - GHPs etc. I have had a couple of my "unclosable" grippers in chokers for years at various distances - and always re rate them before a contest with no change in RGC numbers. The steel does not seem to be effected in any way. As to training them - I would trust Heath on this one - hand position is everything. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 The hand Positioning makes a ton of sense. Thanks guys! And the unchanging of RGC ratings is cool, because it would be a pain for me to have to "re-choke" the grippers every time I want to use them. Haha. If I can just leave them, that would be wayyy easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellswindstaff Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 It may sound crazy but when I do choker work I mark my hand for placement. Take a weak gripper and set it like normal, then take a sharpie and draw a line on the palm of your hand for the palm side handle. Now you can use a choked gripper at whatever width you want and it will still be in the same range as a set. I was bad to move the choked stuff higher up towards my fingers giving me a great leverage position but I was having zero carry over. When I kept the handles where they were supposed to be and used a choker I could see carryover. WOW... that's a GREAT idea. I'm making a note of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 21, 2013 Author Share Posted February 21, 2013 Got some hose clamps last night, so this morning I was just messing around putting them on the grippers. Just grabbed one from the rack (my #1.5) and put it on there... Couple things I'm thinking right away: 1) I might need something stronger than this hose clamp. Muffler clamp? 2) this is going to take some getting used to. Feels weird right now. Granted, i didn't warm up or anything, so maybe it won't feel so weird when I "really" do it... But it definitely feels like the first time I did Bottom-up squats. Like you all were saying, you don't have the benefit of acceleration from the beginning of the close. It's like starting from a dead stop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat 74 Posted February 23, 2013 Share Posted February 23, 2013 I kept a BBSE that is 194 in a stainless hose clamp forever, a muffler clamp may work but a good stainless hose clamp is pretty stout. Great idea with the athletic tape holding the choker. Nothing says " s*** that hurts" like getting your skin between the clamp and the handle when releasing the gripper. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 23, 2013 Author Share Posted February 23, 2013 Put the choker on the #3... Set at 13mms (the Max the hose clamp will close to)... Geared up.... And made the handles touch! And I was mad too because it's been a rough week, so I ground those suckers together. Felt great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 23, 2013 Author Share Posted February 23, 2013 I mean, i know this isn't a super feat or anything, but damn it felt good. I've never touched the handles on the #3 before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Scibelli Posted February 23, 2013 Share Posted February 23, 2013 Nice!! Good work!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 23, 2013 Author Share Posted February 23, 2013 Nice!! Good work!! Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearcat 74 Posted February 23, 2013 Share Posted February 23, 2013 Nice work, when I did choker work if I hit 5 singles at a distance I would open the clamp up and start again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephistopholes Posted February 23, 2013 Author Share Posted February 23, 2013 Nice work, when I did choker work if I hit 5 singles at a distance I would open the clamp up and start again. Thanks! Thats my plan. Hit 5 today, so next week I'll open it up a little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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