Training For Strength/endurance But Not Size/mass

[the j]

I'm working on grippers right now and will be adding some pinch work and thick bars, etc. I want to get my hands absurdly strong all around, and a long term goal is to close the #3 CoC. (Working on the #2, which I just got, right now.)

My question is this: Is there any training system/program that increases strength without greatly increasing the size of my forearms? I don't really want to look like Popeye as the rest of me is pretty slim. I have worked out to gain size (arms, shoulders, chest, etc.) in the past and it happened pretty fast on a standard 3x10/failure-ish type of program.

In terms of grippers, should I be pounding out reps on the Trainer until my arms are pumped and I can't do another one, then resting, then repeating like I did today? Or should I concentrate on doing as many on the #1 as I can and then forced reps or negatives? Or start (after warming up of course) on the #2 and do only negatives? Am I making any sense? Also, how often should I do this? I feel like I can do a whole workout at least every day as my arms never really stay fatigued, they never get that next day soreness that biceps do for example.

I appreciate any input. You have a great board here, very friendly and informed. Thanks.

[Cannon]

My question is this: Is there any training system/program that increases strength without greatly increasing the size of my forearms? I don't really want to look like Popeye as the rest of me is pretty slim. I have worked out to gain size (arms, shoulders, chest, etc.) in the past and it happened pretty fast on a standard 3x10/failure-ish type of program.

I would be surprised if this happened at all, especially since the rest of you is pretty slim. In general, I would say you can't tell a grip athlete by looking at them.

Check out this article by Heath: http://www.farmstrength.com/closing_big_grippers.htm

Good luck!

[CoC#3]

My question is this: Is there any training system/program that increases strength without greatly increasing the size of my forearms? I don't really want to look like Popeye as the rest of me is pretty slim. I have worked out to gain size (arms, shoulders, chest, etc.) in the past and it happened pretty fast on a standard 3x10/failure-ish type of program.

I would be surprised if this happened at all, especially since the rest of you is pretty slim. In general, I would say you can't tell a grip athlete by looking at them.

Check out this article by Heath: http://www.farmstrength.com/closing_big_grippers.htm

Good luck!

Quality article. Great stuff, Heath!

[thearm95]

My question is this: Is there any training system/program that increases strength without greatly increasing the size of my forearms? I don't really want to look like Popeye as the rest of me is pretty slim.

Is it possible to have forearms that are too big?

btw - congratulations on closing the #2!

Edited June 27, 2007 by thearm95

[pdfk20]

I think its very unlikely that you will reach absurdly strong levels without gaining some mass on the forearms.

[egg_uk]

if they dont get big they will definitely have a lot of definition, as there are a lot of people who gain high levels of strength but keep a small size, martial artists etc, but your body will change.

[aquilonian]

My question is this: Is there any training system/program that increases strength without greatly increasing the size of my forearms? I don't really want to look like Popeye as the rest of me is pretty slim. I have worked out to gain size (arms, shoulders, chest, etc.) in the past and it happened pretty fast on a standard 3x10/failure-ish type of program.

Agree with Cannon.

I don't know about a program (you make your own program thats flexible and siuts you best) but here are some guidelines:

STAY AWAY from anything MID to HIG rep. ALWAYS low reps/time under tension. Those terms are irrelevant because they are relative to your "tolerance to exercise". Low can be 3reps for "easygainers" or 6 reps for a normal person or 9 reps for a "hardgainer". But you can start like this.

Keep the frequency LOW. Only 2-3 days per week total for ALL your grip related work. The Monday, wednesday, friday thing works well here. we just want plenty of time off in between.

Keep the sessions SHORT. No more than 30 min at a time.

Keep the volume LOW.

Stick to sets of 3 for "light/easy" days. 3 sets per session after a light warmup being the mark to shoot for.

For "hard" days do Max attemps, overcrushes (of only 5 seconds or less). I don't recommend "negatives" but if you like them go ahead and do them (again a 5 second hold or less). Do 5-6 attemps , overcrushes, "negatives", altogether NOT 5 of each. Mix them any way you like but only a TOTAL of 5-6 altogether. Again after a warmup.

Keep the rest times between 3-5 minutes between sets/attemps

Do it like this and you can minimize the possiblity of growing much (wich is your goal).

___________________________________

NOTES

Warm up before each session, youre gonna need it. The hand has a ton of connective tissue thats not near any big muscles. they dont have their own blood supply so its hard for them to warm up. Also....the hands are the extremeties of the body, far away from the WARM core. They are used to RELEASE heat. use warm water for 5 min. then warm up internally with light grippers or whatever you like.

KEEP THE INTENSITY HIGH, you only have a few sets/attemps so MAKE THEM COUNT!

If you do Pincing/blockweights stick to max attemps and holds lasting no more than 10 seconds

See a pattern here? LOW reps, LOW sets, LOW frequency, LOW volume. If in doubt remember the pattern.

If you find these reps/attemps are too low, or not yielding results increase them SLOWLY overtime.

Finally...there will be "SOME" growth everytime you get stronger, but you wont be scaring anyone, so dont freak out. Most people will not even notice at all.

GOOD LUCK!

Edited June 27, 2007 by aquilonian

[Wes]

why on earth would you care about having big forearms? You aren't going to get 18'' forearms on 15'' arms. At best they would be the same size

[MrZsasz]

Mass is gained based on diet. If you don't consume excess calories, you won't grow. As someone mentioned, you will get better definition so that you may find that you "appear" larger. Look at a lightweight powerlifter, they lift as heavy as possible but still keep within their weight class.

However, it seems silly to me to only focus on one area of strength. If you get stronger all over, this will translate to your grip activities as well.

[superfeemiman]

Mass is gained based on diet. If you don't consume excess calories, you won't grow. As someone mentioned, you will get better definition so that you may find that you "appear" larger. Look at a lightweight powerlifter, they lift as heavy as possible but still keep within their weight class.

However, it seems silly to me to only focus on one area of strength. If you get stronger all over, this will translate to your grip activities as well.

Couldn't have put it better myself. Unless you go psycho in an effort to have bigger forearms, they aren't going to grow much unless your whole body grows.

[the j]

Thanks for all the replies.

The congrats are a bit premature, but thanks in advance. I've got the #2 down to about 5/16" gap now.

I am not really only concentrating on one area, I am also doing a general exercise program to try and strengthen my whole body but I don't want to get any bigger, that's all. I guess you are right that that is mostly dependent on the amount of calories I eat, which tends to be around "maintenance" level, though I don't count at all. I never overeat, I try to eat medium-healthy, but I also don't worry about it. I drink too much beer.

I will stick to the low-volume program. That's basically what I have been doing the last couple of days. The other day after reading a high volume program I tried doing the T to failure, passing it to the other hand, failure, then wait a few minutes, then repeat 2 more times. I totaled out around maybe 60-70 reps right hand, 50 or so left hand, and my forearms were completely wasted. They recover unbelievably fast though - only an hour later I did about a 1:15 no-thumb hang on the chinup bar, and the next day only my hands were aching even slightly. I wonder if I really need any sort of rest.

The last couple days I've been doing - a few warmup reps on the T, then attempts at the #2, a couple negatives, then the #1, somewhat varying this... most recently, I try the #2 R hand, try it L hand, wait a few minutes, do the same again, wait, then do negatives a couple times, then set it down for a few hours. Always both hands, and my left is never that far behind my right. If I don't feel any pain or anything, and can't seem to really fatigue myself with low reps, is there really any need for days of rest at a time?

Pardon me if I'm being idiotic, this just seems very different from exercising larger muscles where I can feel that they need a lot of time to recover.

Thanks.

P.s.: I am using the expand-your-hand bands (green currently) as often as I think about it, usually while spacing out on a movie or whatever. I generally just expand them and hold until it starts to burn, then stop for a bit, then repeat, a bunch of times until I get bored.

P.p.s: I never use an other-hand set except for negatives occasionally. My hands are long enough that I feel like that would be kind of defeating the purpose since I can do quite well with no set.

Edited June 28, 2007 by the j