Liking The Choker

[egg_uk]

Can get within a mm or two without a choker on my COC#2, after closing it with a choker last session id thought id experiment more this session. With choker mm set can rep for 3, for 2 a ccs, and can close my rb160 and rb180, for 2 and 1 reps respectively with a choker mm set, and these are both harder than the 2. SO i think my setting abilities are letting down my regular set work. Any advice apart from buying KTA, which i dont want at the minute as im still making progress, ill get it next time i plateau. DO you think i should spend ages practising setting with my trainer, and my setting is not good left handed at all.

thanks

[lloyd80s]

Can get within a mm or two without a choker on my COC#2, after closing it with a choker last session id thought id experiment more this session. With choker mm set can rep for 3, for 2 a ccs, and can close my rb160 and rb180, for 2 and 1 reps respectively with a choker mm set, and these are both harder than the 2. SO i think my setting abilities are letting down my regular set work. Any advice apart from buying KTA, which i dont want at the minute as im still making progress, ill get it next time i plateau. DO you think i should spend ages practising setting with my trainer, and my setting is not good left handed at all.

thanks

Hi Egg,

Yes I think if you've got a poor set it'll be a great idea to spend time on getting it right. I've seen some guys who have the strength close a gripper fail on the close, all because the set was bad. If you think about it, the hand only has a few positions of leverage to get the gripper shut. Unless you have the set just right, the gripper may not close however hard you squeeze it purely because the angle of the set is wrong.

I find that the closer the end of the dogleg handle is to the wrist, the harder the gripper will be to close. Try and get the dogleg a tight into the plam near the knuckles when setting. Maybe try a really easy gripper and just keep setting it until you find a comfortable sweet spot in your hand that gives you maximum leverage.

Also I'm not sure if you own a #3 but if you don't I'd recomend getting one. As it's much harder than your goal gripper #2, you may find that trying singles with the #3 will give you the strengh boost you need to mash the #2. Working on a gripper above what I can close has given me the best results, I hope it'll work for you...........GOOD LUCK MATE

[Cunny]

Where did you get the choker from

[egg_uk]

found a big hose clamp, designed for putting a hose over a tap.

[egg_uk]

got an rb210, which is pretty tough, gonna try and use that next workout

[egg_uk]

thanks for the advice

[Autolupus]

Don't choke RBs!, whaaaaa.

Get an HG a BB or a COC but DON'T choke an RB!

[mike69]

Don't choke RBs!, whaaaaa.

Get an HG a BB or a COC but DON'T choke an RB!

Why....... not choke a RB ??

Edited June 13, 2007 by mike69

[CoC#3]

Don't choke RBs!, whaaaaa.

yea, RBs are too nice for choking!!

Edited June 13, 2007 by CoC#3

[egg_uk]

not really too bothered about choking the RBs, they are just tools to get stronger. There doesnt seem to be any damage from the choker anyway.

[mobsterone]

Choking is for girls. The number of you guys that talk about chokers and deep sets that when the time comes to perform cannot do without the set or choker to get the rep shows that both ideas have been abused. They MAY be useful as part of training but are not turning out CoC's etc. If you think I'm wrong check the number who either only manage a close on video and in training but cannot cert. or do the same in competition. It's about 4-5 to 1.

[dimmers]

Oh, i best ditch my choker then as i don't want to be called a 'girl'!

shame, it was helping me in my training on harder grippers

[Autolupus]

Yeah, heavy partials are for girls too!

[egg_uk]

lol, love how mobster tried to turn it into a choker haters thread. Im happy training anyway to get stronger, and chokers might help me get stronger while im working on my setting. Maybe those people who dont cert arent ready to cert. Chokers work for some, maybe not for others. I think its a mental thing as well, once you see yourself close a gripper, whether choked or even as a neg, you are another step towards closing it as you have crossed that mental bridge.

[lifesnotfair]

You said you can REP your #2 at CCS width from a choker, but you can't MMS it without a choker? How can you not be able to set a gripper to CCS width in your hand? You just have a "pinch it" a little bit and it's there! I would like to see how you're setting it.

GO to Youtube and search for JOhn Eaton's video on how to set a gripper!! It's perfectly clear.

[mobsterone]

Now clever clogs I justified my comment.

Is Dimmer or are any of the regular guys who post here and repeatedly use chokers, filed down grippers etc a CoC? If not why not?

I've commented in the past that far too many techniques, of the kind described both here and in the KTA program are used by those with an inability to shut a gripper under pressure. By pressure I mean as part of a certification scheme or in competition. It's no good filing a gripper, using a grip machine, using chest crushes etc etc etc if I hand you your arse everytime we meet in competition.

Clay Edgin put up a post ages ago in which he stated that he was sorry. Sorry that he looked for easy books and cards to tear, sorry he searched for widths which suited him when pinching plates, sorry that he only used a deep hub and so on. He felt that it took away the satisfaction he had hoped to feel when hitting the targets and feats of strength he had wanted for himself.

But what I see here is worse. It's not the old excuse of hand size being equalled because some using the tricks are of a decent size but using EVERY trick there is and yet not actually getting the true hand strength they wanted or seeing the training closes turn into platform closes. I've obviously trained with and competed against many and only a handful have outdone me (gripper holds left handed, inverted grippers and at the GGC and Europeans) with my simple, no frills approach.

If I can regularly shut a BBSE in competition with a 20mm or wider set and never go that deep in training and yet I'm up against guys doing the same with deep sets, chocked SE's etc ec who never beat me... what does that say? Does in indicate some inate skill, big hands etc? or does it, as I infer, mean that doing the full range stuff for years at a time and making slow but steady progress might be more meaningful?? There are no self posted videos on youtube of me doing grippers etc. I've posted one on the v-bar and there are a few of me from events but that's it - none posted by me.

Now AP. You can carefully look through my log and search back a few years (at least 2 or more) to see the last time I did a partial. Then you can look in the contest section and see that I currently own both the total and single hand world record on the (630 and 330kilos) lift I used to do the partials for. Not in training but in competition. Back when I did the partials I was top 10 on the lift and now I don't and just train the lift as it requires I'm No 1. No tricks, no half lifts, just simple training of the lift as it is.

Don't use every trick in the book to post a video on youtube, use them sparingly and have the hand strength to shut a hard gripper anytime - be it video, MM or CoC certs or on the platform.

[mobsterone]

lol, love how mobster tried to turn it into a choker haters thread. Im happy training anyway to get stronger, and chokers might help me get stronger while im working on my setting. Maybe those people who dont cert arent ready to cert. Chokers work for some, maybe not for others. I think its a mental thing as well, once you see yourself close a gripper, whether choked or even as a neg, you are another step towards closing it as you have crossed that mental bridge.

1) True - I admit it

2) It only makes you stronger in that spot or postition that the choker is set at. Setting: What's to work on - pick up gripper, wrap fingers round, squeeze shut.

3) Agree. They are choking etc etc but aren't ready - why are they not ready?

4) Disagree and I said why - because we aren't seeing the numbers add up. Loads use the techniques and post (in sig lines often) that they have done it but very few are certing by comparison.

Edited June 14, 2007 by mobsterone

[egg_uk]

im not looking to compete, im not looking to argue, and im not saying your wrong. Read loads of posts where people said they had used chokers and it had helped them. My thumb is a definite weak part that i have to work on, ive seen the setting videos, but i cant seem to keep the bottom handle in the first crease in my hand to set it properly. Its something im going to work on, from my next gripper session, tomorrow. I tried what grippers i could close with a choker set to mm last session, and i can close my 2, rb160, and rb180, but without the choker i only managed to get within 1-2mm of the 2. That has reaffirmed that my set is not upto par, and that i have to work on that to get my closes. Everyone says that the close is the hardest bit, so if i know i can get the close with a choker, and the sweep without, then there must be something wrong and that is the set. Not saying i am going to use a choker forever, but it has shown me what work needs to be done.

Mob, you are much stronger than me, and have much more experience in these things, im just looking to see what works for me, and how i can progress. I know there is no point me be able to close it in a choker, if i cant close it without. and i have said in my sig that the closes were in a choker and have not asked to be added to the list of 2 closers as i see that it isnt a full close with the choker on.

i intend on focusing on building up my thumb so that i can work without a choker. any offense was not meant.

You said you can REP your #2 at CCS width from a choker, but you can't MMS it without a choker? How can you not be able to set a gripper to CCS width in your hand? You just have a "pinch it" a little bit and it's there! I would like to see how you're setting it.

GO to Youtube and search for JOhn Eaton's video on how to set a gripper!! It's perfectly clear.

i know, i dont get it either, watched the video a few times, can get within 1-2mm, just hasnt closed yet. The set definitely needs more work. hope to have it sorted tomorrow

[superfeemiman]

Are you using chalk egg_uk?

EDIT: Also, I've never been to fond of training to set with something I can close very easily. A #2 pushes a lot harder into your palm than a trainer does. So I'd practice with #1. Also, braced closes help me a lot on my wider setting (not so much on my parallel setting, though I'm sure they still help at least a tiny bit), you should give them a try.

Edited June 14, 2007 by superfeemiman

[egg_uk]

yea, using chalk, hands sweat a bit so definitely need chalk, otherwise i get no set at all after a few attempts

thumb isnt strong, and thumbpad isnt very big

[dimmers]

Nope, i'm not a certified CoC and didn't claim to be. Just posting a tounge in cheek comment to your statement that 'Chokers are for girls'!

I say good for you Steve that you train without them, 'no frills' as you state, but surely you didn't expect everyone to agree with you on that?

Hey, i know what, why don't i go in the bending forum and post 'wraps are for girls'? surely the 'no frills' way to train would be bare handed? In fact, don't we all know someone who could bend like that and could say that? but does he?..... no he doesn't.

Edited June 14, 2007 by dimmers

[superfeemiman]

Nope, i'm not a certified CoC and didn't claim to be. Just posting a tounge in cheek comment to your statement that 'Chokers are for girls'!

I say good for you Steve that you train without them, 'no frills' as you state, but surely you didn't expect everyone to agree with you on that?

Hey, i know what, why don't i go in the bending forum and post 'wraps are for girls'? surely the 'no frills' way to train would be bare handed? In fact, don't we all know someone who could bend like that and could say that? but does he?..... no he doesn't.

Yeah, I understood what Steve was talking about, but the fact that he named you made no sense to me. You haven't been training long enough to where it would show that chokers or whatever else wouldn't work for you, so I don't see the point.

[dimmers]

Sorry for the sarcastic reply everyone! I'm having a bad day at work.

I can see everyone's point of view, and love the fact we all have great discussions on this board... it really does

[mobsterone]

I used the names to identify whose post I was replying to and no more.

You'll note, much like the bending arguments (which I thought laughable and crazy at the same time and the tempers that were set off - man oh man), that people are defending certain techniques which they favour. I argued well enough that ALL techniques are ok but of them many are over used to produce a close. But we are seeing, as Egg admits, sig lines etc in MANY (as I said) cases where the only way the gripper gets shuts is with a choker etc.

It was my intention to throw light on what Clay stated ages ago. That by only being able to do the gripper in that way we are starting to miss the point. There is no argument in my mind that someone has hands so tiny or can claim that this technique or that is the only way they can shut a gripper. It's just not true. It is more true that they are in too much of a hurry to get to the standard they admire in others and so use every trick in the book.

I'd remind most of ay that by the very fact of training and doing so for the hands you'll have strength in that area outside the normal range. Take longer to get there, use the tricks but sparingly and in time you'll acheive heights that seem far away right now.

[CoC#3]

I used to use chokers, and yeah, it did help me achieve a MMS of a #3. Both my hands can shut a #3 with a fairly wide set now, as i did at the british. When i used to use chokers, i couldn't close anything without a deep set. Whether or not chokers are used or not is personal preference but be sure to still keep working the set to drill technique etc... So basically my point is, chokers are decent training tools in moderation. They SHOULD NOT be the bulk of your training though.

Negatives and other techniques described in the KTA program work, and directly increase your max close. If i could do 2 grip exercises it would be negs with my #4 and overcrushes with a #3. I don't think anyone could do a program of negatives and overcrushes and not see gains. Mobster, if you focused on grippers and did a 'Kinney style' routine i'd put money on you being a certified #4 closer by the end of the year. I'm not sure this is a goal of yours though, but i am just using that as an example. Regarding Mobster's point about filing grippers, again, it's up to you. I rate this method of training, and using a deeply filed #3 has no doubt helped me get stronger when it comes to attempts on the #3.5 etc..

As long as you are getting stronger and it works for you, keep doing it. Just airing my view on the issue.