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Diet And Nutrition


Rick Walker

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Tom of Iowa2

Sorry...i sort of promised I'd drop this subject.Interesting side note.After Josh Biggers first strongman contest (the Pro/Am in St. Louis)he decided to really take his diet(and training)VERY seriously.

Before the contest he took in huge amounts of protein and was eating 4 to 5 meals a day,took some vitamins and some L-glutamine..... and of course his progress was(due to genetics)OFF the sheet.

However.After the contest he saw what must be done.(get serious)And His trainer convinced him to go to 7 meals a day.Flax seed.Various supplements such as L-Glutamine.BcAA.Fish oil.Anti-oxidants.Vitamin C. ZMA.Tribulus.CLA(i can't afford the CLA :cry ,i don't have a sponsor) But most importantly GOOD food(no white sugars,less fats,no more crap)he was around 280 at around 23% body fat when he competed.Now he is 285 at 16.5% bodyfat.Very lean for him(he's always had a gut..I've always been thin)And the most interesting thing is he NOW takes in 1500 more calories a day...than he did before.... when he was eating a lot but more hap- hazardly.There is something to this anabolic diet concept.

His Training progress has been boosted even further..i.e.gains faster than before.

Nope.I'm not an animal. ;)

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Well, in regards to weight loss, eatting 3 meals a day w/ same nutrients as say 6 meals a days yields the same results. It's been shown time after time in studies.

In regards to the multiple meals protocol ... I think it's easier mentally, and it's easier as well to manipulate specifics of your diet this way. No way Tom your going to pile 3000 calories meals down 3 times a day. As long as your getting quality in, supplements in that are quality (though not required, but some do have ergogenic effects), and regenerate better via supplementation, nutrition, and other means of recovery, you'll dominate. That is assuming your training protocol is sound.

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Davekline
Anyone want to guess how much longer this Atkins craze will go on, in America at least? I'm giving it three more months.

:ohmy The next fad will be the vegetarian-Atkins-crash diet. This diet combines the worst features of both unballenced eating regements.

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This is a good topic for this question. What is the best way to figure your

resting metabolic rate? I found different figures from different sources.

On the old HIT FAQ it says body weight x 20 is the calories you need

to maintain bodyweight. Another site says body weight x 12. That is

a huge difference.

I found this formula too:

Harris-Benedict formula:

Adult male: 66 + (6.3 x body weight in lbs.) + (12.9 x height in inches) - (6.8 x age in years)

Adult female: 655 + (4.3 x weight in lbs.) + (4.7 x height in inches) - (4.7 x age in years)

What is right? :whacked

Im trying to gain slowly so I don't get fat.

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this post is aimed towards "patrik b:"

milk does not have a special transport system that allows you to absorb high levels of igf-1. you are thinking of the 1995 study that showed that the absorbtion of orally administered igf-1 was increaded in the presence of the protein casein (one of the main proteins in milk) in rats. first off, the study was done with rats nearly 10 years ago (numerous research has been done since then on the subject). second, there is not a high enough level of igf-1 found in milk (even with rbgh treated cattle) to yield an increase in circulating igf-1 levels in the blood stream of a human. don't you think if milk was truely as potent a "transport system" for igf-1 as you say it is, wouldn't the bodybuilding community be jumping all over it? you are clearly mislead with plenty of pseudo-research and heresay. gimme some good (recent) abstracts and i'll consider argueing with you more.

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Well, in regards to weight loss, eatting 3 meals a day w/ same nutrients as say 6 meals a days yields the same results. It's been shown time after time in studies.

landon: please, show me some of these so numerous studies you speak of!

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We use HB here at the hospital.

Males BMR = 66 + (13.7 X weight in kilos) + (5 X height in cm) - (6.8 X age in years)

I've never seen one already converted to lbs and inches. I'm assuming the conversions are right on the one you listed????

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I wonder what the point is of quoting the studies? To be honest just about every "eating programme" I've ever read about claims scientific backing. Also, unless you actually go to the extent of going and finding them in the journals and read them yourself to see if you agree with the drawn conclusions (or if you even understand them, of course) and how many people will bother to do that??

You can prove just about anything with statistics. Scientific studies seem about the same.

Edited by The Mac
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this post is aimed towards "patrik b:"

milk does not have a special transport system that allows you to absorb high levels of igf-1. you are thinking of the 1995 study that showed that the absorbtion of orally administered igf-1 was increaded in the presence of the protein casein (one of the main proteins in milk) in rats. first off, the study was done with rats nearly 10 years ago (numerous research has been done since then on the subject). second, there is not a high enough level of igf-1 found in milk (even with rbgh treated cattle) to yield an increase in circulating igf-1 levels in the blood stream of a human. don't you think if milk was truely as potent a "transport system" for igf-1 as you say it is, wouldn't the bodybuilding community be jumping all over it? you are clearly mislead with plenty of pseudo-research and heresay. gimme some good (recent) abstracts and i'll consider argueing with you more.

I am not thinking about any 1995 study? And milk DOES have a properties that allows the hormones to survive digestion. Come on now, why do you think that milk contains hormones in the first place? Duh?

You are also wrong in thinking that the amount of IGF-1 in milk won't affect the IGF-1 levels in your blood. Just drinking a big glass of milk everyday can double the amount of unbound IGF-1 circulating in your blood stream. Our bodies contain both bound and unbound IGF-1, most of it is bound, around 95% if I am not mistaken. But if you consume lots of milk products you will have much higher than normal unbound IGF-1 in you.

There are not many studies about this out there, most people don't even know that milk contain growth hormones. The only known hormone that can be assimilated by humans found so far is IGF-1.

Ever heard of a book called "Super Squats: How to Gain 30 Pounds of Muscle in 6 Weeks"? Squats and milk? Afaik, milk IS known as a great weight gainer already?

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Landon, there is so much conflicting info about nutrition i was just curious. i love avant labs forums :D .

as for you, patrick, please, you have given me nothing but empty words. gimme a study, just one. otherwise all that you say is worth nothing. i can sit here and make all sorts of claims, but if there is no research backing it up it means nothing. you are clearly misguided. do some reseach on sports nutrition and sports supplementation; it will enlighten you.

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Davekline
:laugh Ahhh come on, don't you know that if someone in the mainstream (sic) media said it, that it must be true. Especially if it was said on 60 minutes. :laugh:laugh
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Vise, np.

I'm not trying to be a dick, but if your going to claim something, you better be able to back it up. That Super Squats book doesn't count. Randall is a dumbass, and that bulking strategy is rather archaic.

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Davekline
Thanks for opening our eyes. Obviously food does not contain the necessary ingredients to sustain life.

:ohmy You mean you didn't know that you need lots of pills and powders and magic potions from the local vitamin store?

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Landon, there is so much conflicting info about nutrition i was just curious. i love avant labs forums :D .

as for you, patrick, please, you have given me nothing but empty words. gimme a study, just one. otherwise all that you say is worth nothing. i can sit here and make all sorts of claims, but if there is no research backing it up it means nothing. you are clearly misguided. do some reseach on sports nutrition and sports supplementation; it will enlighten you.

There are too many variables at play so some study that makes sense is hard to come up with. You can call my words empty if you want, too bad for you.

Instead, please enlighten a misguided one with your great knowledge as to why you believe milk contain hormones naturally in the first place since they according to you will be destroyed in the stomach anyway?

You don't need no fancy study to figure that one out. Do you also deny that milk is a great weight gainer?

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We use HB here at the hospital.

Males BMR = 66 + (13.7 X weight in kilos) + (5 X height in cm) - (6.8 X age in years)

I've never seen one already converted to lbs and inches. I'm assuming the conversions are right on the one you listed????

Thanks Jad

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Rick Walker

I guess we know why this is seldom if ever discussed here....

:whistel

Rick Walker :rock

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I guess we know why this is seldom if ever discussed here....

:whistel

Rick Walker :rock

Amen. Discussing diets and nutrition these days invokes as much emotion in people as politics and religion. I try to stay out of the diet debates for that reason. :dry

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Dargath78

My Boxers are very muscular and lean. Maybe I should start the dog food diet.

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Ever heard of a book called "Super Squats: How to Gain 30 Pounds of Muscle in 6 Weeks"? Squats and milk? Afaik, milk IS known as a great weight gainer already?

The role of IGF1 presence or not can be argued but might have health relevance.

But the major role of milk as a great weight gainer doesn't seem to be very strange.

It is a superb insulin raiser. One of the top insulin index foods all catagories. Greater then normal sugar in spite of the low glycemic index.

Easily digested proteins in general give some decent insulin raise, but the combination in milk is stunning!

And INSULIN is a great anabolic hormone. Sadly both for muscle and fat.

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Tom of Iowa2
I guess we know why this is seldom if ever discussed here....

:whistel

Rick Walker :rock

Amen. Discussing diets and nutrition these days invokes as much emotion in people as politics and religion. I try to stay out of the diet debates for that reason. :dry

Whatever works. :cool

Everybody is a little bit different..... :blush Stands to reason our nutrtitional needs and responses to nutritional 'programs' or diets would vary.

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VeGripper
I was reading some of the articles John Wood posted regarding "stones".  Someone Help!!!  What is a good source of "vegetable protein"???

Plenty of good sources of vegetable protein are out there. Brown rice protein, soy protein (although, I personally don't favor it in high quantities even though I rely on non-animal sources myself), wheat protein, pea protein...there are more than a few options. It is by no means hard to find animal-free sources of protein out there, but they just aren't widely used by those who train for strength or by bodybuilders so they don't get a lot of exposure.

And, for those who doubt the ability to consume a dozen hot dogs, I can attest that in my pre-vegan days I'd done it myself on one occasion - the day I first met my future wife's family. I was terrified and thought that I'd eat as much as possible so I wouldn't talk much and make an ass out of myself, so I put away the following foods inside of a 90 minute stretch:

9 bratwurst (not all with buns, though)

3 hot dogs

4 deviled eggs

3 brownies

1 burger

I even impressed myself that day with my consumption! Wouldn't touch most of those things with a ten foot pole these days, but back then they were staples.

And, for those who think that gaining strength or adding size on a vegetarian or vegan diet isn't going to work, consider the fact that in 4 years of giving up meat/dairy/eggs I managed to go from 212 lbs. to over 250 and nearly doubled the numbers in all my lifts, so I choose to believe that training hard and intelligently will always be number one in making progress. That isn't to say that diet isn't extremely important, but it leaves more room for error than haphazard training methods when you're looking to get the most out of lifting/grip work/etc. Just my thoughts on this!

VeGripper

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