Is competition the only true test of strength?

[Guest 115-1005574997]

I had an argument with a good powerlift mate last night.  He said that due to the toughness of lifting in competion (nerves, pressure, only 3 attempts etc) and the sheer guts needed to take part, all in all its the only 'true' test of strength.  A warm, empty, cosy gym with as many attempts as you like just isnt as 'impressive'.

I can see both sides of the argument but in the end had to agree with him.  Having competed myself, it takes so much more than sheer physical strength to lift a weight (and most importantly) beat another lifter.

Just wondered what you guys think.

[Bill Piche]

The real test is on the platform.  Ahhh, there is nothing like the adrenaline high of the "platform" and having it "on the line".  

[Sybersnott]

The way I see it..... you can do anything you want in the gym.  Proving yourself and your abilities takes place in a sanctioned competition.  Nobody gave credit to Gary Frank until he totaled 2500 in a powerlifting meet - after that, of course, there was no doubt about what he could do.

[HAMMERHEAD]

Performing when it counts is very different than when you are in your comfort zone.  However, competition isn't the only battlefield to prove oneself.  For example to get certified as a CoC there is no competition, but your strength must be proved just the same.

-HH

[Roark]

You, the feat.

And witnessed documentation.

Unfortunately, a friend who competes in masters

powerlifting tells me that loose judging and tight

shirts are ruining it.

So, it becomes: You, the feat, some honor, and

witnessed documentation.

A crowd is not needed.

[Guest el4n]

As in any sport or competitive endever, it only matters if you can perform when it is all on the line. The very best athletes in my opinion are the ones who win when it means the most, not those who have the most talent but choke when the pressure gets turned up.

However, I also feel that strength training is a little bit differnet than say playing golf. If you can shoot 65 everytime you play golf when it's for fun then choke when it comes to playing in a tournament that is somthing quite differnet than if you can bench press 600 pounds. Even if you coudlnt bench 600 in competition, you are still one #### strong dood, and to say that a guy who only benches 600 in his gym and not in competition dosent have strenght would be ludacris.

However since the question is worded "test of strenght" I voted "yes". I feel competition is needed to determine who the "best" and "strongest" are, and certanly will believe that sombody deadlifted 900lbs if I read it as a competition result and not herd him or somone else talking about it.

[Guest Mark]

I don't believe there is any easy answer to this one for several reasons:

1) Thre are only 3 lifts in pl and 2 in ol so there are a grand total of 5 competitive lifts in relatively "mainstream" competition. What about all the other lifts?

2) The lifts contested in competition and the techniques involved over the years have changed so it might be neccessary to look at lifts not done in competition to compare people of different eras.

3) On the other hand, there is a very real difference between doing a lift when you want (as in the case of gym lifts) and doing a lift when you are told it must be done in the next minute and in front of an audience while scrutinized for technique.

4) There is no guarantee gym lifts have met any objective criteria of performance nor that the weight actually weighs what it purports to.

5) Al least in the case of powerlifting any credibility inferred from a lift having been done in a meet is compromised by lax judging and equipment technology advances.

    Bottom line, a number of factors come into play.

Mark

[Roark]

Whenever I am working out alone I never try to

convince myself that I lifted more than I actually did.

[Guest Mark]

Joe,

    With an attitude like that, you will never be a powerlifter. You must really work on learning to be more deceptive about your strength levels. You will never fool others if at first you can't fool yourself.

    Seriously more people should have that approach.

Mark

[JoeyBurks]

"1) Thre are only 3 lifts in pl and 2 in ol so there are a grand total of 5 competitive lifts in relatively "mainstream" competition. What about all the other lifts?"

USAWA

[Guest Mark]

Joey,

    I kind of figured somebody would bring up all-around lifting but I was hoping the reference to "mainstream" competition would satisfy. I love the concept of this type of lifting but lets face it: there aren't a lot of meets, there aren't a lot of competitors, there's even less publicity than the types of contests I mentioned, and most people who lift don't even know one person who has done one of these contests. So how realistic is it to discuss this as a viable form of strength competition for most of us?

    Please don't take this as any disrespect toward the abilities of those who do this type of lifting. I even incorporate some of it in my own training.

Mark

[Roark]

We are so far off the mainstream that grip and the odd lifts

barely qualify to be a tributary- we are more similar to a

brook. Fine, with me.

But notice what just happened. Vic Boff, 87, who worked out

with some of the pioneer strongmen and socialized with some,

passed away last Saturday about 4pm. He was the last link in

the chain to that era. He knew first-hand experiences with

many famous names in the iron game.

Old School Strength, which should be having a large parade of

tributes to him, is almost vacant on the matter. Is it really the

case that those who post there are unaware of his accomplishments and contributions? Apparently so. And if so,

perhaps that board needs a name change, or a refresher

course.

Anyway, the point is, as newcomers disdain studying the

history of lifts and lifters and scan for shortcuts, we become

an ever more recently refreshed loop moving farther from

our wonderful roots.

[Guest Mark]

Joe,

    I agree with you about the lack of stuff on Vic Boff on Old School specifically and on the internet in general.

    As you know, I am quite interested in the history of the Iron Game. I must admit though that my knowledge and interest is greatest in the area of competitive weightlifting. Therefore, I know less about Vic than I would like to and, from the lack of info out there since his passing, it seems like this is true of most.

    His association with the "iceberg club" and the AOBS are well known but I was wondering if you would be kind enough to give those of us who need it a refresher on Vic Boff's achievements and, since you were his friend, Vic Boff as a person? It would be appreciated and appears to be needed.

Mark Kodya

[Roark]

Mark,

We had something on Vic in a recent ironhistory.com

and will have more this Friday.

Rather than repeat the material here, those interested

and go there.

It is off topic here anyway except for  the Goerner

section. That is what I meant about Old School- it

seems such a right fit for them to discuss it.

[Faheem Chauhan]

Makes no difference to me whether its on the platform or in the gym.

[Roark]

The only difference it makes to me is expecting someone

else to believe a gym lift. If you bench press 100 lbs

or close a trainer gripper in the gym, the point is moot.

If you claim a record, that is a different angle.

Unfortunately, so many aspects of the lifting field are

crumbling, poor judging, or judging done by friends of the

lifter (or employees of the lifter), underweight equipment,

'overdressed' lifters, and a general lack of honor in regard

to achievement, added to a wannabe best attitude, cause

reality to be elbowed aside so that ego can shine.

[young'un]

based on my limited experience (2 local meets), i agree that demonstrating strength in competition is very different than doing so in my own basement. however, i believe there are uncompeted lifts - like dips and chin-ups - which require a  great deal of overall strength just like those used in power- and O-lifting. Since these lifts are not 'official', claiming that the only true test of strength is in competition does a disservice to guys who are strong, but just demonstrate their strength in lifts that are never competed.

can you guess if i prefer dips or benches?