Jump to content

Natalia Kravchenko - a few episodes from training with grippers - CoC-1,5 deep set att., CoC-2 - 2sec SB hold, CoC-2,5 parallel set att. (51kg bw)


Ivan Pupchenko

Recommended Posts

Maiche 25

Hello, I put 3 in 1 oil on my coc 2, I have chest crushed it several times so that the oil goes well everywhere. Clearly it was dirty and a little rusty, I bought it used a few months ago it had almost never been used and it dates from 2010. It works much better, no more squeaks and above all extremely fluid.
It is much less hard to tighten until 1.5 cm from the end but after I do not find it easier, in any case it works perfectly on the full range of movement and I think it will be easier to progress without having to force a lot before arriving at the last cm.Thanks a lot again!

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Maiche 25
9 hours ago, Ivan Pupchenko said:

The first quarter or third of the movement performed mainly f. d. profundus, and the last quarter or third - almost only f.d.superficialis. Even though the role of f. d. profundus in the final is greater than the role of f.d.superficialis at the beginning of the movement ... And then genetics and specific of the nervous system come in. Those who progress well in wide closing - learn this variant very quickly. Literally from the first training. And those who begin this difficult, can learn this variant, but with the first slightest injuries, missed training, they will lose indicators primarily in wide closures and in a much smaller one in a short amplitude. Now I'm talking about people with palm 19cm or less. With a longer hand, the working fingers do not lie on the handle with distal phalanges, but at least with the joints behind them, or even the beginning of the middle phalanx. For a palm of 20-22 cm, the ccs is an analog of a 35-40mm block for a palm of 18-19cm ...

  Here is the hand of a man who closed a heavy grip 300 with a wide set without any grip training, and CoC-3 after a month of training. For the tns CoC-3 he took less than six months of work. Dynamometry after a day of hard physical work - 140-142.9 kg! B.w -  95kg. Dynamometry was checked on the apparatus, on the full analogue of which David Shamey and Valeriy Tolstyh were tested (if you know these names) - their best indicators are 137-139kg

 

 

 

 

IMG-76ed0c9ba57c36a4e52b5f57c5dcec1f-V.jpg

IMG-d68bf79635e7615895df4bec79216122-V.jpg

Wow this guy seems incredible, do you know his level in grippers currently?

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Maiche 25
1 hour ago, Maiche 25 said:

Hello, I put 3 in 1 oil on my coc 2, I have chest crushed it several times so that the oil goes well everywhere. Clearly it was dirty and a little rusty, I bought it used a few months ago it had almost never been used and it dates from 2010. It works much better, no more squeaks and above all extremely fluid.
It is much less hard to tighten until 1.5 cm from the end but after I do not find it easier, in any case it works perfectly on the full range of movement and I think it will be easier to progress without having to force a lot before arriving at the last cm.Thanks a lot again!

No I was wrong it became much easier, I close my COC 2 with a little room after a good warm-up. I have an HG 250 with an official RGC of 123 which I start to close from time to time and it is harder than my coc 2 whereas until now I perceived no difference, easily 10 lbs less hard than not maintained in the end ... impressive!

Link to post
Share on other sites
Wannagrip

Super gripping!

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Ivan Pupchenko
4 hours ago, Maiche 25 said:

No I was wrong it became much easier, I close my COC 2 with a little room after a good warm-up. I have an HG 250 with an official RGC of 123 which I start to close from time to time and it is harder than my coc 2 whereas until now I perceived no difference, easily 10 lbs less hard than not maintained in the end ... impressive!

When I calibrated my grippes and for my comrades, I determined that oil removes 1-3 kg, and very rarely more than that. Moreover, the heavier gripper did not always weaken more, sometimes CoC-1.5 or 2 weakened by 3+ kg, and CoC-3.5 by 1-2. Obviously, the quality of the spring plays a role (in which CoCs has never been high). Grippers with highly intersecting turns produce more difference. GHP and BB springs are much more stable in this!.. Use silicone or gun oil, or oil for sewing machines. WD-40 or analogs is primarily an anti-corrosion agent. It should be used only for the first time for a not new grippers ...

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Ivan Pupchenko
Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Maiche 25 said:

Wow this guy seems incredible, do you know his level in grippers currently?

(I showed his palm as an example, like the hand of a genetically born squeezer for the ccs and tns) 

He is absolutely unambitious and non-motivated person ... I managed to lure him to KK last year, without training, he became 4 place in the 93kg category .. But on this his desire to train was dissolved in everyday problems and family life. I recently called him, he saying that not training, again. Only when he drinks a little beer after a hard working day and goes out to smoke - can squeeze a little his hg300 ...

Edited by Ivan Pupchenko
  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Paul Savage
On 6/25/2020 at 4:59 PM, Fist of Fury said:

It's not very likely to happen anytime soon. Paul has been waiting to do certifications for years. They train together so it seems like she's taking the same route. Would be happy to be wrong about that though.

Mashmonster grippers for females would be cool to see and it shouldn't be too difficult to set that up. Starting from #2 level and up.

I actually coach her but it's not so much she is similar to me in that she doesn't care about the #2.5, she would do it and probably could do it any day of the week to be perfectly honest but she's just always training for competitions so it's difficult. I think what is likely to happen is she will eventually cert the #3 when she's strong enough to do it without too much specific training but don't really know. I can't train grippers yet, still recovering from injury and she's much more focused on strongwoman than grip right now.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Cannon
11 hours ago, Paul Savage said:

I actually coach her but it's not so much she is similar to me in that she doesn't care about the #2.5, she would do it and probably could do it any day of the week to be perfectly honest but she's just always training for competitions so it's difficult. I think what is likely to happen is she will eventually cert the #3 when she's strong enough to do it without too much specific training but don't really know. I can't train grippers yet, still recovering from injury and she's much more focused on strongwoman than grip right now.

I know this has been ruminated about extensively, but I think part of the collective confusion about certification is that it takes... almost no time. You email IronMind like 1 sentence expressing interest. They organize the cert. You agree to a meeting with the ref which you can even double-up with something you do every day, such as coffee or lunch. Then, on cert day, you close the gripper or not. All told I'm guessing 15 minutes of "time".  

Just certify :) Just send the email. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Ivan Pupchenko
1 hour ago, Cannon said:

Just certify :) Just send the email. 

All this happens in different ways... In 2013, I also wanted to be certified for CoC-3. here is a video of my wide work with 65kg rgs CoC-3. Andrei Sharkov was appointed as referee for me, who at that time had nothing to do with grip, except for strong hands. I had to go to the opposite side of the country, although Igor Kupinsky, an experienced athlete and winner of many grip tournaments, was much closer in the capital. In Crimea, I was assigned certification at 8am - no options. I came to the appointed place. It was an unheated gymnasium for basketball and waited there at 10-12 degrees Celsius for about 4 hours. A week before the certification, I was told that gripper from IM may not have time to arrive by mail, and I should have one with me. Accordingly - I bought and brought with me a new CoC-3. When ref appeared, he said that gripper that I was holding in my bosom was cheating and an attempt to loosen the spring and brought another (new in packaging) that had been lying in the trunk of his car all night in a temperature of 0-2 degrees Celsius. It was so cold that it was painful to hold in his hands. In general, I was close to closing, but the last 5 mm did not give in to me (later, with normal temperature, I calibrated this CoC-3 to 69 kg). All this adventure cost me 5 days of my life and about $ 400. As you can understand, since then I have no desire to deal with IM and pass any certification. If I come back to thinking about it - it will not be CoC and not IM, that's for sure ..

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Cannon
3 minutes ago, Ivan Pupchenko said:

All this happens in different ways... In 2013, I also wanted to be certified for CoC-3. here is a video of my wide work with 65kg rgs CoC-3. Andrei Sharkov was appointed as referee for me, who at that time had nothing to do with grip, except for strong hands. I had to go to the opposite side of the country, although Igor Kupinsky, an experienced athlete and winner of many grip tournaments, was much closer in the capital. In Crimea, I was assigned certification at 8am - no options. I came to the appointed place. It was an unheated gymnasium for basketball and waited there at 10-12 degrees Celsius for about 4 hours. A week before the certification, I was told that gripper from IM may not have time to arrive by mail, and I should have one with me. Accordingly - I bought and brought with me a new CoC-3. When ref appeared, he said that gripper that I was holding in my bosom was cheating and an attempt to loosen the spring and brought another (new in packaging) that had been lying in the trunk of his car all night in a temperature of 0-2 degrees Celsius. It was so cold that it was painful to hold in his hands. In general, I was close to closing, but the last 5 mm did not give in to me (later, with normal temperature, I calibrated this CoC-3 to 69 kg). All this adventure cost me 5 days of my life and about $ 400. As you can understand, since then I have no desire to deal with IM and pass any certification. If I come back to thinking about it - it will not be CoC and not IM, that's for sure ..

 

 

Damn. Wow. :ohmy

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
anwnate
6 minutes ago, Cannon said:

Damn. Wow. :ohmy

 

Yeah...that's messed up.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Paul Savage
9 hours ago, Cannon said:

I know this has been ruminated about extensively, but I think part of the collective confusion about certification is that it takes... almost no time. You email IronMind like 1 sentence expressing interest. They organize the cert. You agree to a meeting with the ref which you can even double-up with something you do every day, such as coffee or lunch. Then, on cert day, you close the gripper or not. All told I'm guessing 15 minutes of "time".  

Just certify :) Just send the email. 

She has done grippers I think twice in maybe 6-8 months though. I wouldn't be against her doing it but I just don't think it's in the thought process right now, it doesn't fit with the current training either, mainly events training so your never fresh enough to do grippers. I'm thinking if David does the Christmas record breaker event at the end of the year she would probably want to do that.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Hopefully
On 6/27/2020 at 12:28 AM, Ivan Pupchenko said:

The first quarter or third of the movement performed mainly f. d. profundus, and the last quarter or third - almost only f.d.superficialis. Even though the role of f. d. profundus in the final is greater than the role of f.d.superficialis at the beginning of the movement ... And then genetics and specific of the nervous system come in. Those who progress well in wide closing - learn this variant very quickly. Literally from the first training. And those who begin this difficult, can learn this variant, but with the first slightest injuries, missed training, they will lose indicators primarily in wide closures and in a much smaller one in a short amplitude. Now I'm talking about people with palm 19cm or less. With a longer hand, the working fingers do not lie on the handle with distal phalanges, but at least with the joints behind them, or even the beginning of the middle phalanx. For a palm of 20-22 cm, the ccs is an analog of a 35-40mm block for a palm of 18-19cm ...

  Here is the hand of a man who closed a heavy grip 300 with a wide set without any grip training, and CoC-3 after a month of training. For the tns CoC-3 he took less than six months of work. Dynamometry after a day of hard physical work - 140-142.9 kg! B.w -  95kg. Dynamometry was checked on the apparatus, on the full analogue of which David Shamey and Valeriy Tolstyh were tested (if you know these names) - their best indicators are 137-139kg

 

 

 

 

IMG-76ed0c9ba57c36a4e52b5f57c5dcec1f-V.jpg

IMG-d68bf79635e7615895df4bec79216122-V.jpg

My hands are 19.5 cm, I have the center of handle in the center of the distal phalange joint. I think this provides the most power. Maybe due to hand size, but I speculate that this would achieve balance between profundus and superficialis through the whole range of motion, and I also speculate that If you don't experience this, maybe that means your profundus is weak and you primarily utilize your superficialis. Or, even if my assumption would be true, maybe the more leverage provided by more amount of finger on the handle would still be more effectice for a large hand. 

But, 

@Lennixhas a big hand, at least much bigger than mine, and recently he adjusted his finger position more towards the distal phalange and experienced a substantial increase in crush power. Just like in my experience. Of course his backhandle for a ccs is in my mms position 😅

Anyway I think this is a little interesting. 

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
Hopefully

*to clarify - "in the distal phalange joint crease"

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Ivan Pupchenko
47 minutes ago, Hopefully said:

 

 

I agree that all this is very individual. The total length of the hand is the sum of the length of the palm and the length of the fingers. And what I saw - with a common total length 19-20 cm, the difference in the length of the fingers can be 1-1.5 cm... I also agree that, for example, my distal phalanges are weak - I attach little attention to wide closing and there is nothing for them to become strong. But I want to emphasize that, in addition to all these subjective factors, we are dealing with one objective factor - the laws of physics. Fingers are the reverse lever. The farther the point of application of force - the less this force. Nobody can change this in any way ...

Given that the movement performed by two muscles, and load is very shifted from one muscle to another in different parts of the amplitude - we need find individual position at which lever will be the shortest, but each muscle can show maximum strength...

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Hopefully
15 minutes ago, Ivan Pupchenko said:

I agree that all this is very individual. The total length of the hand is the sum of the length of the palm and the length of the fingers. And what I saw - with a common total length 19-20 cm, the difference in the length of the fingers can be 1-1.5 cm... I also agree that, for example, my distal phalanges are weak - I attach little attention to wide closing and there is nothing for them to become strong. But I want to emphasize that, in addition to all these subjective factors, we are dealing with one objective factor - the laws of physics. Fingers are the reverse lever. The farther the point of application of force - the less this force. Nobody can change this in any way ...

Given that the movement performed by two muscles, and load is very shifted from one muscle to another in different parts of the amplitude - we need find individual position at which lever will be the shortest, but each muscle can show maximum strength...

Of course that is true, but also you gain more range of motion by having the handle higher up on the fingers. So I would think that If the back handle needs to be far back due to hand size you would run out of motion if you have the handle far below the distal phalange. For example if I get more fingers over, the first motion is easier due to leverage, but towards the end of the close I lose power because my middle phalanges gets near the end of their possible range of motion. If I put it higher up, the first motion is heavier but I experience more power at the end of the close. So a little bit of trade off there :) like this: 

I am not strong enough to close it yet, but I trade off wide power there in order to have a shot at closing it. Many think the start is easy and wasted movement, however I think you would only say that If your hand is big enough. 

I think it is worth experiment a little bit with this regardless of hand size, and not just try to get as much finger over as possible. 

Now, basically I just repeat your point but with different words ^^

Link to post
Share on other sites
Ivan Pupchenko
43 minutes ago, Hopefully said:

Of course that is true, but also you gain more range of motion by having the handle higher up on the fingers. So I would think that If the back handle needs to be far back due to hand size you would run out of motion if you have the handle far below the distal phalange. For example if I get more fingers over, the first motion is easier due to leverage, but towards the end of the close I lose power because my middle phalanges gets near the end of their possible range of motion. If I put it higher up, the first motion is heavier but I experience more power at the end of the close. So a little bit of trade off there :) like this: 

I am not strong enough to close it yet, but I trade off wide power there in order to have a shot at closing it. Many think the start is easy and wasted movement, however I think you would only say that If your hand is big enough. 

I think it is worth experiment a little bit with this regardless of hand size, and not just try to get as much finger over as possible. 

Now, basically I just repeat your point but with different words ^^

100% agree. especially for that the position of rear handle and the fact that when front handle too low under the fingers, the power disappears at the end of the movement (in short closing too). Some things I take for granted, and did not mention them, starting to write the answer before the morning cup of coffee))) In general - we need to look for an individual, the most favorable position!

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
honk

Very strong! 

Hopefully she stays with grip for the long haul....

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy policies.