Race to raw 375 T&G bench thread!!!- Race still open!

[EricMilfeld]

1 hour ago, WestSlope said:

I'll play along. I will be the tortoise for sure as I have to pull back or stop benching when my joints protest. If I do approach 375 and decide to compete, I could wind up second on the USAPL masters 2b, 205lb list. I'm not sure how old you are, Eric, but you could be near the top of that list as well.

 

I checked the 205 class on the all-time list, M2. 375 gets you the 17th position. Crazy competitive!

How did you manage to further break it down to M2b? Were you just checking guys’ ages?

 

[Kluv#0]

29 minutes ago, EricMilfeld said:

Yep. Always 15-20 pounds for me. I just missed 341 at my last meet. So with an increase in calories and if I sleep on my bench at night 375 just might maybe could happen. 

Mike, I think you can do this. 

Eric, there is no doubt you will get 375 if you stay healthy! I was just putting that out there in case people were thinking about competing. Also, I like to keep sharp my Joe Sullivan style humble brag, LOL

[EricMilfeld]

Edit. 

Edited February 8, 2020 by EricMilfeld

[EricMilfeld]

42 minutes ago, Kluv#0 said:

Eric, there is no doubt you will get 375 if you stay healthy! I was just putting that out there in case people were thinking about competing. Also, I like to keep sharp my Joe Sullivan style humble brag, LOL

Haha! I’m gonna tell him you said that!

And thanks for the vote of confidence!

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Kluv#0 said:

Eric, there is no doubt you will get 375 if you stay healthy! I was just putting that out there in case people were thinking about competing. Also, I like to keep sharp my Joe Sullivan style humble brag, LOL

You know how I do!

[EricMilfeld]

2 minutes ago, WestSlope said:

I'm using https://www.openpowerlifting.org/rankings/raw/ipf93/usapl/men/55-59/full-power/by-bench

Is this site legit? The ages can be sorted by 10's or by 5's.

Of course, it's all sphincter talk until weight is moving on the platform. Still fun to set side goals like this!

Oh neat! I don’t think I’ve used that site before, but at first glance it seems to be legit. The USAPL database doesn’t allow for breaking down into the 5 year increments since the IPF only does 10 year increments. Some states still track 5 year records, though. 

Definitely fun. And motivating!

[Buccos1]

21 hours ago, EricMilfeld said:

Big bench for the low 190s!

Thanks!  I was “trying” to get down to the 181 class for awhile, with the intention to hit a double-body weight raw bench press at 40 years old.  Think I could’ve gotten it but I wasn’t willing to give up every food and drink I liked, and I hate doing cardio.  So it never happened.  Also, my bending started to take a hit when I dropped closer to 190.

[Tommy J.]

1 hour ago, Buccos1 said:

Thanks!  I was “trying” to get down to the 181 class for awhile, with the intention to hit a double-body weight raw bench press at 40 years old.  Think I could’ve gotten it but I wasn’t willing to give up every food and drink I liked, and I hate doing cardio.  So it never happened.  Also, my bending started to take a hit when I dropped closer to 190.

FWIW, I thought I’d take the time to point out that your previous benching at 190 makes you the best bencher in the race! That said, I think you should definitely go for double BW. Imo I still think double BW benches are the upper echelon of benchers. The elites.

just take it nice and slow after you hit 375 and keep churning. You’ll get it!

[Tommy J.]

If I’m being honest, I’m currently matching my all time best bench strength. Right now. So this is all gonna be uncharted territory for me from here on out. 

That said, I’ll take a moment to give my nerdy majestic thoughts on this lift.

the bench press is hands down the most difficult/complex movement of the big 3. In PL meets, it is the lift that has the most commands, and apparently the most rules against movement when you combine feet, butt, and head movement restrictions.

it is the one of the 3 big lifts that taxes and threatens the most complex joint in the body the most. Which is the shoulders.

And it is the one lift that bailing on the weight is most likely to seriously injure, or even kill you. Ain’t no quick bailing on a bench press! Not unless you have safety stops! No bs, I know a guy personally that literally almost died from a bench accident. Casey Emery ruptured his liver in half trying 405 with a suicide grip and dropped the weight on himself. True story! Fun fact- He is also a member here.

it is the lift, world wide known and understood as being the bro measuring stick for a general idea of you’re strength level. AKA “how much ya bench?”

so imo, all these factors make it the king and most manliest of upper body barbell lifts. More so than overhead press, due to its strict nature of being pinned against a bench during the lift. OH press allows for more English, momentum, and a far more forgiving/safer option when taking a bail into consideration.

And I love it for all these reasons.

 

got 99 problems but a bench ain’t 1.

[Tommy J.]

1 hour ago, Tommy J. said:

If I’m being honest, I’m currently matching my all time best bench strength. Right now. So this is all gonna be uncharted territory for me from here on out. 

That said, I’ll take a moment to give my nerdy majestic thoughts on this lift.

the bench press is hands down the most difficult/complex movement of the big 3. In PL meets, it is the lift that has the most commands, and apparently the most rules against movement when you combine feet, butt, and head movement restrictions.

it is the one of the 3 big lifts that taxes and threatens the most complex joint in the body the most. Which is the shoulders.

And it is the one lift that bailing on the weight is most likely to seriously injure, or even kill you. Ain’t no quick bailing on a bench press! Not unless you have safety stops! No bs, I know a guy personally that literally almost died from a bench accident. Casey Emery ruptured his liver in half trying 405 with a suicide grip and dropped the weight on himself. True story! Fun fact- He is also a member here.

it is the lift, world wide known and understood as being the bro measuring stick for a general idea of you’re strength level. AKA “how much ya bench?”

so imo, all these factors make it the king and most manliest of upper body barbell lifts. More so than overhead press, due to its strict nature of being pinned against a bench during the lift. OH press allows for more English, momentum, and a far more forgiving/safer option when taking a bail into consideration.

And I love it for all these reasons.

 

got 99 problems but a bench ain’t 1.

So no one thinks I’m being dramatic here..

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by Tommy J.

[Stephen Anderson]

2 hours ago, Tommy J. said:

If I’m being honest, I’m currently matching my all time best bench strength. Right now. So this is all gonna be uncharted territory for me from here on out. 

That said, I’ll take a moment to give my nerdy majestic thoughts on this lift.

the bench press is hands down the most difficult/complex movement of the big 3. In PL meets, it is the lift that has the most commands, and apparently the most rules against movement when you combine feet, butt, and head movement restrictions.

it is the one of the 3 big lifts that taxes and threatens the most complex joint in the body the most. Which is the shoulders.

And it is the one lift that bailing on the weight is most likely to seriously injure, or even kill you. Ain’t no quick bailing on a bench press! Not unless you have safety stops! No bs, I know a guy personally that literally almost died from a bench accident. Casey Emery ruptured his liver in half trying 405 with a suicide grip and dropped the weight on himself. True story! Fun fact- He is also a member here.

it is the lift, world wide known and understood as being the bro measuring stick for a general idea of you’re strength level. AKA “how much ya bench?”

so imo, all these factors make it the king and most manliest of upper body barbell lifts. More so than overhead press, due to its strict nature of being pinned against a bench during the lift. OH press allows for more English, momentum, and a far more forgiving/safer option when taking a bail into consideration.

And I love it for all these reasons.

 

got 99 problems but a bench ain’t 1.

Dang... i feel a little shade thrown towards my overhead press.. haha

[Tommy J.]

6 minutes ago, Stephen Anderson said:

Dang... i feel a little shade thrown towards my overhead press.. haha

Your overhead press is awesome! But for upper body, bench is the power movement. For reference, I think there is only a couple handfuls to take 500+ overhead. Many have done a 500+ And even 600+ on bench. And there is a handful to do 700+ officially on the bench, with a couple more unofficial 700+ benchers. No OH press can come close to those numbers. Making bench press undisputed champ for upper body power movement.

[Stephen Anderson]

5 minutes ago, Tommy J. said:

Your overhead press is awesome! But for upper body, bench is the power movement. For reference, I think there is only a couple handfuls to take 500+ overhead. Many have done a 500+ And even 600+ on bench. And there is a handful to do 700+ officially on the bench, with a couple more unofficial 700+ benchers. No OH press can come close to those numbers. Making bench press undisputed champ for upper body power movement.

Its all pretty impressive! I wonder what those 700lb benchers overhead is!??

[Guest]

45 minutes ago, Tommy J. said:

So no one thinks I’m being dramatic here..

 

It appears a lot of these bench fails have a weak grip aspect to them.... maybe they should join grip board for some tips on how to get strong enough to actually hold on to the bar!

[Tommy J.]

1 minute ago, Stephen Anderson said:

Its all pretty impressive! I wonder what those 700lb benchers overhead is!??

Interestingly enough, I’ve heard rumors of Julius coming for the OH record. Whatever it is. I’m certain it’s in the 500’s weather it be a log or a barbell. Big Z was touted as being the log WR holder not so long ago with a 500lb log press.

Wheels benches high 600’s and can 500+ OH barbell press pretty convincingly. But then struggled with 400+ on a log press... so no telling.

someone quoted a percentage to me not long ago about how you’re OH press will typically be X amount of percentage of you’re bench. Just don’t recall what the number was.

but then there are cases of guys who mostly OH press, and do not bench, that have a higher OH press than bench. Martins would be a good example. He said his best bench was about 5 or so reps at 200k. He can get that same weight OH for about the same reps on a log. But I think that’s just a byproduct of not training bench since it’s not necessary for strongmen.

 

imo, it actually doesn’t make sense that the bench press yields higher numbers than the OH press. If we take into account how much technique and leg drive most sports with overhead movements allow, it seems like those factors alone should blow a strict bench press out of the water. Shoulders are a big muscle if we combine all sides of the shoulder muscle and figure them for the same muscle. the shoulders could easily equal or surpass the mass of the pec muscles.

[Tommy J.]

3 minutes ago, Joseph Sullivan said:

It appears a lot of these bench fails have a weak grip aspect to them.... maybe they should join grip board for some tips on how to get strong enough to actually hold on to the bar!

Could be that.. I actually tried to make sense of why it was happening to a lot of them. Even the guys using conventional grip it happens to. The only note I’ve been able to take is that it seems to mostly happen on the way back up.

could be the flaring outward of the elbows that suddenly changes the mechanics of the grip, but I can’t say for sure..

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Tommy J. said:

Could be that.. I actually tried to make sense of why it was happening to a lot of them. Even the guys using conventional grip it happens to. The only note I’ve been able to take is that it seems to mostly happen on the way back up.

could be the flaring outward of the elbows that suddenly changes the mechanics of the grip, but I can’t say for sure..

Definitely appears to be a grip related issue. 

[Tommy J.]

1 minute ago, Tommy J. said:

Could be that.. I actually tried to make sense of why it was happening to a lot of them. Even the guys using conventional grip it happens to. The only note I’ve been able to take is that it seems to mostly happen on the way back up.

could be the flaring outward of the elbows that suddenly changes the mechanics of the grip, but I can’t say for sure..

Without wrist wraps I feel really wobbly in the wrist on a bench press. But don’t necessarily have weak wrists?.. so what’s sort of scary is not knowing how to prevent the sudden grip/wrist fails on these instances. But what I can say is I may only be benching in a rack with safety stops from here on out!

[Tommy J.]

Just now, Joseph Sullivan said:

Definitely appears to be a grip related issue. 

I suppose. But technically you don’t even need grip if you can keep the wrists on lockdown.

could also be slightly bent barbells that suddenly change direction in the hands and finding center causing this phenomenon.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Tommy J. said:

Without wrist wraps I feel really wobbly in the wrist on a bench press. But don’t necessarily have weak wrists?.. so what’s sort of scary is not knowing how to prevent the sudden grip/wrist fails on these instances. But what I can say is I may only be benching in a rack with safety stops from here on out!

Smart move!

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, Tommy J. said:

I suppose. But technically you don’t even need grip if you can keep the wrists on lockdown.

could also be slightly bent barbells that suddenly change direction in the hands and finding center causing this phenomenon.

Well, wrist strength is a major component of grip strength. The link between the hand and the forearm. The grip will only be as strong as the weakest link will allow. 

[Tommy J.]

21 minutes ago, Joseph Sullivan said:

Well, wrist strength is a major component of grip strength. The link between the hand and the forearm. The grip will only be as strong as the weakest link will allow. 

I would point out that grip strength really doesn’t matter on bench. Until things get off center anyways. Its a pushing movement. don’t need grip to push something. It’s more of a balancing act with the arms wrists as the bigger muscles handle the load. The hands are nothing more than shelves for the barbell to sit on on a bench. Could easily compare it to saying you need good “shoulder grip” on a squat... when what you really need is support on a squat. Or a place for the bar to sit, rather.

the suicide grip simply enhances the chances of that balance, or “shelf” being suddenly lost. And eliminates the probability you can correct an imbalance with the grip. But there are guys out there who suicide grip all day and don’t lose barbells. Or even don’t grip at all.. I’ve seen some do a modified suicide grip where the barbell rests on the palms and finger nails. (Pic below) So it’s obviously not a grip feat or even grip challenge to bench press.

Edited February 9, 2020 by Tommy J.

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, Tommy J. said:

I would point out that grip really doesn’t matter on bench. Until things get off center anyways. Its a pushing movement. don’t need grip to push something. It’s more of a balancing act with the arms wrists as the bigger muscles handle the load. The hands are nothing more than shelves for the barbell to sit on on a bench. Could easily compare it to saying you need good “shoulder grip” on a squat... when what you really need is support on a squat. Or a place for the bar to sit, rather.

the suicide grip simply enhances the chances of that balance, or “shelf” being suddenly lost. And eliminates the probability you can correct an imbalance with the grip. But there are guys out there who suicide grip all day and don’t lose barbells. Or even don’t grip at all.. I’ve seen some do a modified suicide grip where the barbell rests on the palms and finger nails. (Pic below) So it’s obviously not a grip feat or even grip challenge to bench press.

Actually, quite the contrary, a good grip is very much needed  for a better bench press  and a safer  bench press by increasing radiant tension. The more stable you can get the bar to be the better and more successful you will be at the bench. The concept works by the harder you can squeeze the bar, the more tension you can produce for a bigger and stronger bench press. This is the case for all upper body exercises as well. The more you can squeeze the bar, even though it’s a pressing movement, the more you increase your potential for a bigger lift. Try it next time you bench. It’s pretty useful. The less tension someone can produce on the bar the less stable the bar will be and the more likely a drop can occur. The harder you can squeeze as  opposed to not being able to apply as much force on the bar, say by not  wrapping the fingers and thumbs around the bar hard enough or as you are demonstrating in the pic above  can sacrifice quite a few pounds on the press.

Edited February 9, 2020 by Guest

[Tommy J.]

Either way, I’m getting nerdy here. It’s Saturday night and I’m sitting here posting about bench drama in a bench race thread.  And I need to stop. But don’t judge... cuz you’re sitting there reading it!

[Tommy J.]

1 minute ago, Joseph Sullivan said:

Actually, quite the contrary, a good grip is very much needed  for a better bench press  and a safer  bench press by increasing radiant tension. The more stable you can get the bar to be the better and more successful you will be at the bench. The concept works by the harder you can squeeze the bar, the more tension you can produce for a bigger and stronger bench press. This is the case for all upper body exercises as well. The more you can squeeze the bar, even though it’s a pressing movement, the more you increase your potential for a bigger lift. Try it next time you bench. It’s pretty useful. The less tension someone can produce on the bar the less stable the bar will be and the more likely a drop can occur. The harder you can squeeze as  opposed to not being able to apply as much force on the bar, say by not  wrapping the fingers and thumbs around the bar hard enough can sacrifice quite a few pounds on the press.

I should have been more specific here so to avoid a pointless exchange... No ones grip is what’s holding their bench back from getting stronger. And most certainly not anyone here. I’ll buy that a good grip makes bench pressing “safer”. But I’m not buying that anyone needs a strong grip to bench respectable weight. My 61 year old dad still out benches me and his grip strength isn’t half mine.