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Lennix

Volume/frequency for griptraining

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Lennix

Hello! 

I'm curious what you guys think about volume and frecuenzy . I often hear people talking about how sore they get from griptraining both CNS and muscle wise. But I don't really get that worn down from doing grip. This thread will look like a humble brag thread, but I'm genuinely curious if I'm overdoing it and your thoughts about volume.  Should I benefit from less volume? I hardly ever get sore or hurt. In powerlifting volume is key and you can either obtain it through working out often (which there are theories that it would be beneficial) or loads of volume on few but very long workouts) 

"If it's working and your progressing keep at it " Totally agree, but it would be fun to hear your thoughts about trying to workout as optimal as possible for gripstrength. 

Here's my last 10 days of griptraining: 

5/11 - Silverbullet with #4 (0 4 20) PR + IM Hub singles 10 19 19 19 31 PR
6/11 - Rolling thunder 66x10x3 BH
7/11 - rest 
8/11 - Rolling thunder 67.25x10x3 PR 66x7x3 Left 
9/11 - Silverbullet #3.5 20 Seconds #4 19 Seconds
10/11 - Rolling Thunder H 67x10x3 V 66x10x3
11/11 - Grippers working sets RH #3 1 mms + #3 CCS 1 0 0 + 1 mms + hub 
12/11 - Grippers RH #3 mms - 1 1 3 1 + Pinch 30x5x8 + 41x1 41x1
13/11 - Little big horn 44x3,54x3,54x3,59x3,64x3,69x3,71.5x3,76.5x3
81.5×2 RH 86.5x1 PR 
14/11 - Rolling Thunder RH 66×10 68.5×10 68.5×10 PR / LH 66x10x2 + 67x10 PR 

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mcalpine1986

If it aint broke, dont try to fix it. If you are handling this workload and your lifts are progressing keep on doing it. You have obviously built up the work capacity to be able to handle this kind of frequency and volume so dont worry about overtraining or CNS fatigue. Top athletes can train 20-30hrs per week and dont overtrain. The body can handle most things you throw at it within reason.

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Ricochet
53 minutes ago, mcalpine1986 said:

If it aint broke, dont try to fix it. If you are handling this workload and your lifts are progressing keep on doing it. You have obviously built up the work capacity to be able to handle this kind of frequency and volume so dont worry about overtraining or CNS fatigue. Top athletes can train 20-30hrs per week and dont overtrain. The body can handle most things you throw at it within reason.

This ^    Completely concur!

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Climber028

Volume is an issue for a lot of people because the grip community likes to PR often. I think it's too much fun so sometimes it's hard for people to pull it back. Maxing out multiple times a week is a bad idea no matter what sport you're in. 

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Joseph Sullivan

I never get sore or feel beat from grip, but I only train a max  of 3x/week sometimes only 2  and only no more than an hour for any workout. Grip is included with total body so all exercises have a grip component for upper body anything. I find that any more than that for me is overtraining and I regress. Everyone is different.  I take no supplements of any kind and only get my “nutrition” from food. 

Edited by Joseph Sullivan
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Hannes

Everyone is different. I only train grip once a week and over the past 7 months I've made some giant gains. 

But I can't say I like maxing every session

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Joseph Sullivan
8 minutes ago, Hannes said:

Everyone is different. I only train grip once a week and over the past 7 months I've made some giant gains. 

But I can't say I like maxing every session

Honestly, once a week is all one needs. I believe Andrew Durniat only trained grip once per week.

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Lennix

I'm trying to talk about the most optimal way possible and I dont believe everyone is completely different and I most definitely dont think working out once a week would be near optimal. Perhaps Andrew gets good compared to the rest but wouldnt he gain even more strength doing higher volume? 

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Hannes

For me it is. I tried doing it more and started getting sore quite a lot, I was even getting muscle pain during my training

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Fist of Fury
26 minutes ago, Lennix said:

I'm trying to talk about the most optimal way possible and I dont believe everyone is completely different and I most definitely dont think working out once a week would be near optimal. Perhaps Andrew gets good compared to the rest but wouldnt he gain even more strength doing higher volume? 

There's no such thing as "the most optimal" way of training. I can guarantee you that.

There's only the most optimal way for each individual.

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Lennix
6 minutes ago, Hannes said:

For me it is. I tried doing it more and started getting sore quite a lot, I was even getting muscle pain during my training

Studies have shown that working out the same  musclegroup twice a week is more beneficiary compared to once a week. So regarding your forearms it would be better with twice a week atleast. Then there's so many parts of gripstrength open hand and closed hand and pinch. I really dont think you will reach your genetic maximum with once a week. 

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Lennix
2 minutes ago, Fist of Fury said:

There's no such thing as "the most optimal" way of training. I can guarantee you that.

There's only the most optimal way for each individual.

Ofcourse.  But as in powerlifting there's a common consensus that 15-20 sets/musclegroup done over 2x workouts will give you like 90% the rest is individual (taking %ages out of my ass) 

No one of us will know the optimal way, but we can discuss what we think is the best and why that is. So perhaps it can spark ideas for developing the sport.

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Aleksandar Milosevic

As much as you can recover from, and it depends on your lifestyle and goals. I know it's a broad answer, but it's the most complete one. I look at Adam Glass' log, if I did that amount of volume, I wouldn't be able to do my job as a trainer and physical therapist. If you tolerate huge volume on a day to day basis, just keep doing it.

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Fist of Fury
17 minutes ago, Lennix said:

Ofcourse.  But as in powerlifting there's a common consensus that 15-20 sets/musclegroup done over 2x workouts will give you like 90% the rest is individual (taking %ages out of my ass) 

No one of us will know the optimal way, but we can discuss what we think is the best and why that is. So perhaps it can spark ideas for developing the sport.

Why discuss if you can do something and it workes for you, just stick with it. Making a lot of gains is not the only important factor, you need to stay free from injuries as well. I'm sure there are ways of improving faster (for most people) but is it a sustainable way of training? There's a lot of factors that come into play. I think the 10% you're talking about is the most important factor to be honest.

If this wasn't the case, the code would've been cracked a long time ago and everybody would be doing the exact same thing.

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Fist of Fury
28 minutes ago, Lennix said:

Studies have shown that working out the same  musclegroup twice a week is more beneficiary compared to once a week. So regarding your forearms it would be better with twice a week atleast. Then there's so many parts of gripstrength open hand and closed hand and pinch. I really dont think you will reach your genetic maximum with once a week. 

Why not? Many world class deadlifters only trains the deadlift once a week. As long as you work on your weak areas I don't see why someone couldn't reach their full potential training only once a week. There's a lot of people that use low frequency training, especially in grip training.

 

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Lennix
5 minutes ago, Fist of Fury said:

Why discuss if you can do something and it workes for you, just stick with it. Making a lot of gains is not the only important factor, you need to stay free from injuries as well. I'm sure there are ways of improving faster (for most people) but is it a sustainable way of training? There's a lot of factors that come into play. I think the 10% you're talking about is the most important factor to be honest.

If this wasn't the case, the code would've been cracked a long time ago and everybody would be doing the exact same thing.

Because its interesting to discuss what works for people and if you can take ideas from others to strive to get better. Am I really that odd wanting to learn more about my passion? Because you sound patronising. 

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Fist of Fury
1 minute ago, Lennix said:

Because its interesting to discuss what works for people and if you can take ideas from others to strive to get better. Am I really that odd wanting to learn more about my passion? Because you sound patronising. 

Okay...

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Lennix
2 minutes ago, Fist of Fury said:

Why not? Many world class deadlifters only trains the deadlift once a week. As long as you work on your weak areas I don't see why someone couldn't reach their full potential training only once a week. There's a lot of people that use low frequency training, especially in grip training.

 

Deadlift point is right on, that's something that is common knowledge that once a week is sufficient. There must be things in grip that works the same. Heres a made up statement: Silverbullet works best to do once a week for max gains because it's so heavy for the joints. Do you see what I'm looking for? 

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Joseph Sullivan
1 hour ago, Lennix said:

I'm trying to talk about the most optimal way possible and I dont believe everyone is completely different and I most definitely dont think working out once a week would be near optimal. Perhaps Andrew gets good compared to the rest but wouldnt he gain even more strength doing higher volume? 

For grip, once a week is definitely fine for grip to get very strong. Especially for a natural athlete. There is really no need to over kill it, but doing more sessions won’t hurt. I actually train more than once because I enjoy it, but I do not think I would be any stronger if I did more than once per week. But, everyone is different, everyone’s CNS reaction is different and so are tolerances. 

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Florian Kellersmann

Devon Larratt currently trains his forearms three times a day. It sounds extreme, but if you have the time and want to be as good as possible, it makes sense to me. The single training session doesn't beat him down and he can come back to the gym (basement) a few hours later. 

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Lennix
2 hours ago, Florian Kellersmann said:

Devon Larratt currently trains his forearms three times a day. It sounds extreme, but if you have the time and want to be as good as possible, it makes sense to me. The single training session doesn't beat him down and he can come back to the gym (basement) a few hours later. 

Really? Wow, do you have any sources of him talking about it? 

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Climber028
23 minutes ago, Lennix said:

Really? Wow, do you have any sources of him talking about it? 

He talks about it dozens of times on his YouTube channel, even talked about moving his training equipment from the basement to his living room just to make it easier to train throughout the day. 

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Hopefully

I have more to add but little time, I agree with Aleksandar in regards to volume though. If it's effective volume and you can recover from it well enough then more seems to be better. If you can sustain the volume because intensity or relative intensity is too low, then it's probably better to increase intensity instead and compromise volume. Although I wouldnt say you really do that much each day, so the high frequency makes sense. And as you say there's many studies supporting that approach.

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Florian Kellersmann
10 hours ago, Lennix said:

Really? Wow, do you have any sources of him talking about it? 

I talked with him also personally and was at his seminar in Germany lately. Check out his YouTube channel. The seminar should be online. 

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Boulderbrew
16 hours ago, Joseph Sullivan said:

I believe Andrew Durniat only trained grip once per week

I train twice per week. Lots of near max sets though. When my grip training was all about climbing, I trained four times a week. There is no right answer. Although I have found that when I was new to grip I could train almost every day...now that my strength has progressed, I could train everyday if I wanted to, but there would be serious diminishing returns. Not sure how to beat articulate this concept. Training intuitively seems to be a skill that many don’t master easily 

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