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Dumbbell from hell


Lennix

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7 minutes ago, Fist of Fury said:

Axle isn't the same thing, the handle doesn't have the same diameter. 81 kg on the RT is usually not enough to lift the Inch but you don't know for sure until you try because rolling handles and DB lifts are not the same. I'm better at DB lifts than with rolling handles, for some people the opposite might be true.

LGC handle is close to the Inch in difficulty (although not for me), if you can lift 78 kg on that handle you have a good chance of picking up the Inch. The same might be true for the Trilobite handle.

 

If your heading down to gbg sometime I'll pay gasmoney for your replica ;)

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What's the handle diameter on that bell? That will be a big factor in how it compares to the inch.

There's the obvious difference of 6kg, which is no laughing matter, but the additional detail that would be of importance is the precision of the construction. The cylinders on the end need to be perfectly parallel and the handle has to be concentric with them. If that bell were dropped and bent at the handle or poorly constructed fro the start. You would have a situation where there was a spot where the center of gravity of the bells were below the center of the handle and the torque force would be diminished. The best way to test for this is to roll the bell to see if it is really bent, and then make 4 evenly spaced marks along the length of the handle (like 3, 6, 9, and 12 o'clock) and see if any of them feel harder than the others. 

The total length of that bell will make it harder to tilt off the ground, I suspect.

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5 minutes ago, Lennix said:

If your heading down to gbg sometime I'll pay gasmoney for your replica ;)

Hehe I don't think I will go there but you're welcome to try it anytime you want if you're out exploring spruces and pines sometime in the future :D 

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@dave101 why the confused look on the comment of a longer bell being harder to lift than a shorter one? I have 2 handles of the same diameter one is 20 inches looks and the other is 27. Put the same weight on both and the 27 inch one is harder. Is there something confusing about that? The longer the bell the more difficult it will be to remain level throughout the lift at max weights. 

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4 hours ago, Fist of Fury said:

It's not about weight it's about torque. The shorter globes makes the torque much higher. That's what makes the Inch difficult, it spins out of the hand. You can actually load the dumbbell with weights and if you do it on the finger side it will actually make the dumbbell easier to lift, becasue the weight counter acts the rotation. It's called "Paradoxical loading" because the weight is heavier but yet it becomes easier to lift.

The length of the dumbbell is  irrelevant for the axis of rotation we care about. Length does not affect the difficulty unless you're talking about tilting it significantly. Diameter is what will affect the inertia. There is nothing magical about the globe shape. In fact, a 78kg handle would spin faster than a globe dumbbell. Cylinder or plate shaped heads would spin slower but harder.

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10 minutes ago, DAVE101 said:

The length of the dumbbell is  irrelevant for the axis of rotation we care about. Length does not affect the difficulty unless you're talking about tilting it significantly. Diameter is what will affect the inertia. There is nothing magical about the globe shape. In fact, a 78kg handle would spin faster than a globe dumbbell. Cylinder or plate shaped heads would spin slower but harder.

Interesting! 

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26 minutes ago, DAVE101 said:

The length of the dumbbell is  irrelevant for the axis of rotation we care about. Length does not affect the difficulty unless you're talking about tilting it significantly. Diameter is what will affect the inertia. There is nothing magical about the globe shape. In fact, a 78kg handle would spin faster than a globe dumbbell. Cylinder or plate shaped heads would spin slower but harder.

I beg to differ with you! I had an inch with a 4.5 inch handle and an inch with a 4 inch handle. You bet your bottom dollar the 4.5 inch one was WAY harder than the 4 inch. But I was not really even specifically talking about globe bells. I also have 2 loadable handles 2.5 inch that are 20 inch and 27 inch long. They are not the same as far as difficulty when I can lift 150 for 10 reps on the 20 inch and only 7 times on the 27 inch. Am I imagining that? No.. so perhaps I should give you a confused look? 😐 

So, anyway, that’s all I’m gonna say about that, having experienced it directly with 2 inch dumbbells  and regular bells. The longer the bell at your max weight  the harder it is going to be to lift due to the tilt forces. Deny it or not.... this is my personal experience as a non armchair expert.

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26 minutes ago, Joseph Sullivan said:

I beg to differ with you! I had an inch with a 4.5 inch handle and an inch with a 4 inch handle. You bet your bottom dollar the 4.5 inch one was WAY harder than the 4 inch. But I was not really even specifically talking about globe bells. I also have 2 loadable handles 2.5 inch that are 20 inch and 27 inch long. They are not the same as far as difficulty when I can lift 150 for 10 reps on the 20 inch and only 7 times on the 27 inch. Am I imagining that? No.. so perhaps I should give you a confused look? 😐 

So, anyway, that’s all I’m gonna say about that, having experienced it directly with 2 inch dumbbells  and regular bells. The longer the bell at your max weight  the harder it is going to be to lift due to the tilt forces. Deny it or not.... this is my personal experience as a non armchair expert.

Joe, during Summer of Rows I had one of the nastiest vids-  DB rows 211lb x 6 reps and somebody gave me a confused emoji. Don't read too much into confused look Emoji's, LOL

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42 minutes ago, DAVE101 said:

The length of the dumbbell is  irrelevant for the axis of rotation we care about. Length does not affect the difficulty unless you're talking about tilting it significantly. Diameter is what will affect the inertia. There is nothing magical about the globe shape. In fact, a 78kg handle would spin faster than a globe dumbbell. Cylinder or plate shaped heads would spin slower but harder.

That is nonsense dude. The larger the bells are the harder it's going to spin.

31 minutes ago, Joseph Sullivan said:

I beg to differ with you! I had an inch with a 4.5 inch handle and an inch with a 4 inch handle. You bet your bottom dollar the 4.5 inch one was WAY harder than the 4 inch. But I was not really even specifically talking about globe bells. I also have 2 loadable handles 2.5 inch that are 20 inch and 27 inch long. They are not the same as far as difficulty when I can lift 150 for 10 reps on the 20 inch and only 7 times on the 27 inch. Am I imagining that? No.. so perhaps I should give you a confused look? 😐 

So, anyway, that’s all I’m gonna say about that, having experienced it directly with 2 inch dumbbells  and regular bells. The longer the bell at your max weight  the harder it is going to be to lift due to the tilt forces. Deny it or not.... this is my personal experience as a non armchair expert.

True.

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9 minutes ago, Kluv#0 said:

Joe, during Summer of Rows I had one of the nastiest vids-  DB rows 211lb x 6 reps and somebody gave me a confused emoji. Don't read too much into confused look Emoji's, LOL

I’m sure you can back me up, you have the long handle one we made from pipe with is 27 inches  and a shorter handle. I’m sure You can definitely see the difference with the same weight that the longer one is more of a challenge. 

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14 minutes ago, Hopefully said:

If talking about a no tilt lift only I'd say the length isnt really relevant as long as you grab it by it's center point. But in practice being just a little off center would make the longer bell harder to counter balance. And although I have never touched a bell such as this I can imagine being perfectly on center the whole lift is a pretty difficult task. 

And the larger the diameter the more torque is going to be applied as the distance to the handle would increase. 

Or, that makes sense to me ^^ could be way off. 

Length of the bell absolutely makes a difference . No matter where you grab it...... the same weight grabbed in the same spot of the same weight bell, the longer one  will be harder. I am definitely not imagining it. I’m out....

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Lots of weird physics going on in here. Joe is right, length matters in difficulty it just doesn't affect the torque. That's why a one handed axle lift is harder than a dumbbell lift of the same diameter and weight

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1 minute ago, Climber028 said:

Lots of weird physics going on in here. Joe is right, length matters in difficulty it just doesn't affect the torque. That's why a one handed axle lift is harder than a dumbbell lift of the same diameter and weight

Thanks,Mike! I’ve lifted enough dumbbells  of all types to know. 

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8 minutes ago, WestSlope said:

Those don't look like solid cast bells. Could you tell how the bells were filled? Loose fill would lower the center of mass and reduce the torque.

I have no idea :) With all the info and thoughts in this thread it looks like the is conclusion that this is far from the inch and that I'm better of working out with something else xD 

 

So I'm going to keep lifting it and practice my open hand strength to the day I drive down to try the inch replica in southern sweden and we will see if its enough. 

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5 minutes ago, Hopefully said:

Yes, it does. 

That's what I said. 

You said length didn’t matter as long as you grab it by it’s center point. It does matter. 

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5 minutes ago, Lennix said:

I have no idea :) With all the info and thoughts in this thread it looks like the is conclusion that this is far from the inch and that I'm better of working out with something else xD 

 

So I'm going to keep lifting it and practice my open hand strength to the day I drive down to try the inch replica in southern sweden and we will see if its enough. 

If you don't have access to one just go with the WW. It's super easy to make one, you can find all the material on Biltema :D 

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3 minutes ago, Hopefully said:

Arnes egna? 

Ja den är närmst! 

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4 minutes ago, Ricochet said:

You might consider trying a thumbless flexed wrist lift with it.

I tried that! I think I got it a few mm from the ground! 

3 minutes ago, Fist of Fury said:

If you don't have access to one just go with the WW. It's super easy to make one, you can find all the material on Biltema :D 

I hear what you and rico is saying but I cant really grasp how that would be better then practice with a 70kg+ huge fatgrip dumbbell xD 

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3 minutes ago, Joseph Sullivan said:

You said length didn’t matter as long as you grab it by it’s center point. It does matter. 

Yes it matters, I deal with this shit all the time when doing DB rows because I only have 5 kg plates. It makes the DB really long and aweful to lift when the weigths are heavier. It's really annoying actually.

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Just now, Lennix said:

I tried that! I think I got it a few mm from the ground! 

I hear what you and rico is saying but I cant really grasp how that would be better then practice with a 70+ fatgrip dumbbell xD 

Yes if you have one that is better but I said if you don't have one...

The DB you're using has a fixed weight, much easier to progressively load with something like the WW. 

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Just now, Fist of Fury said:

Yes if you have one that is better but I said if you don't have one...

The DB you're using has a fixed weight, much easier to progressively load with something like the WW. 

Yea the higher weight is ofcourse a very good thing to practice with, but the feeling of an actual fatbar dumbbell and getting used to it must account for something. Also if I manage to thumbless lift this badboy it must be great for an actual inch lift? 

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5 minutes ago, Fist of Fury said:

Yes it matters, I deal with this shit all the time when doing DB rows because I only have 5 kg plates. It makes the DB really long and aweful to lift when the weigths are heavier. It's really annoying actually.

100% 

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7 minutes ago, Lennix said:

Yea the higher weight is ofcourse a very good thing to practice with, but the feeling of an actual fatbar dumbbell and getting used to it must account for something. Also if I manage to thumbless lift this badboy it must be great for an actual inch lift? 

Depends on how you train I would say, I personally am stronger with thumbless grip. I know a lot of armwrestlers are that as well because they train cupping a lot. If you're weaker, then maybe yes. However lifting something that is 6 kg easier in thick bar is a big difference, it's sort of like 60 kg in a normal barbell deadlift. Something like that.

I don't think you need to train the lift much Thom, as I said you're already strong. Lifting 78 kg is like a walk in the park for you. It's all about the hand strength for you. Keep training with the DB you have and add in other stuff as well. Pinch, plate curls, wrist wrench etc.

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13 minutes ago, Fist of Fury said:

Depends on how you train I would say, I personally am stronger with thumbless grip. I know a lot of armwrestlers are that as well because they train cupping a lot. If you're weaker, then maybe yes. However lifting something that is 6 kg easier in thick bar is a big difference, it's sort of like 60 kg in a normal barbell deadlift. Something like that.

I don't think you need to train the lift much Thom, as I said you're already strong. Lifting 78 kg is like a walk in the park for you. It's all about the hand strength for you. Keep training with the DB you have and add in other stuff as well. Pinch, plate curls, wrist wrench etc.

Thanks Emil! Yea I'm not good at thumbless, actually I suck thumbless so I guess it's something to work on.

I liked the idea someone said about onehanded axle deads.. I always liked 1 handed deadlifts both with and without hook. Gotta try it! 

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