South Jersey 4 Results

[Eric Roussin]

When I think of "overall champion" I think "strongest person in the contest" -- in absolute numbers. I'd be more thrilled to win this type of overall title than one that adjusts for weight, hand size, or anything else.

 

I don't think every contest needs an overall title, but I like them. I don't feel they detract from the prestige of winning an individual weight class.

[temmmeeee]

2 minutes ago, Kashtan said:

His hand - as unorthodox underhand. Much difficult than classic overhand. 

Is it more convenient for him, or has nobody shown him how convenient?

Potential of Duevorn - colossal.

Next time - WR on Crusher will be his.

From powerlifting this man?  

 

I think he just did what felt comfortable for him. He didn't seem to have any problems, most people were just staring in amazement.

I'm not totally sure about his background but I know he's really into weightlifting (had some impressive numbers that I can't remember) and tried out arm wrestling. If I recall correctly, I think I overheard him say that he didn't like the sport powerlifting but enjoys just pumping iron. He has pretty massive hands as well. He is just an all around super strong guy.

[Squeezus]

2 hours ago, Cannon said:

Who is Devourn Harris pulling 96kg on the crusher!?   211 pounds good gawd

Duevorn was the guy that cleaned up at Jedd's "Battle of the Grip - Syracuse NY - 3/26/16". He had to show up late because of work and did all of his attempts on all the events in a row and won everything. I saw a guy setting up to do the crushed to dust challenge and he ripped the RT up off the ground like the plates were made of styrofoam and immediately walked over to Jedd to ask if that was "the guy". I talked to him a bit on Sat and asked him what he was into and he said that he did some armwrestling but mainly worked out. He neglected to mention to me that he had deadlifted 700 and squatted 700 in the past...minor details, LOL. Duevorn was also really good on pinch, tying for 1st with Jedd and Luke and pretty damn good on grippers, too. He told me has owned a lot of ironmind gear for a long time, but this was his first grip competition. I certainly hope he comes to some more, because if he does, there will be some records in serious danger.

[richcottrell]

3 hours ago, anwnate said:

There were 2 camera men (rich and mike) with 3 cameras.  Tons of film.  It may take me months to get a DVD together...but it'll be a free download.

Yes and no....

while nate wanted everything ... we only got the most we could.

more about that later... but we covered the the hotel part of the comp. very thoroughly.

once we hit the house my good  friend Mike took some candid video while I broke down the hotel equipment, but then Nate had me rig one of the cameras so we could feed video and audio from his basement to a HDTV set that was upstairs...

i send Mike home after lunch.  It was a long hot day for him, and it was pro-bono.  Sadly he was most interested in the bending stuff.

it was too crowded and crazy to cover the medley properly.   There was so much going on!!!!!

by the time the crazy stuff started, Nate gave me the OK to put the camera down (small story behind that, but let's just say I had enough and it was a long day for the cameramen)

the cool thing is my buddy also brought two nice still cameras so at some point Nate will have some nice stills of the hotel part of the comp.

but I also got to compete in the bending comp, so that was fun after a very long day!

[MCrushetta]

4 hours ago, Cannon said:

Who is Devourn Harris pulling 96kg on the crusher!?   211 pounds good gawd

Right?!? OMG 

Edited July 18, 2017 by MCrushetta

[MCrushetta]

4 hours ago, Cannon said:

I'm fairly certain that @MCrushetta pulled more than I can on the Crusher. 

Sick numbers posted by Dan Fleming and Bob Sundin. 

Great overall results!  It was really exciting to look through these.   

HAHA Maybe someday Cannon. Your gripper numbers are so inspiring. It might take me 3 plus or 5 plus years but I'll close stuff in the hundreds one day.

[richcottrell]

Open ended question...

Ok, while I was there...  I missed a bunch of the "happenings".    

So for those who can say " I was there" was was the single most impressive thing of SJ4?

(a very open ended question)

[KapMan]

12 minutes ago, richcottrell said:

Open ended question...

Ok, while I was there...  I missed a bunch of the "happenings".    

So for those who can say " I was there" was was the single most impressive thing of SJ4?

(a very open ended question)

Penny bend

Andrew D bending that 1/2? Bar. 

Gil almost lifting the mannanuff and that big ass blob

[AKJV1769]

Here is my teammate James Retarides post write up of SJ4 on Facebook:

James Retarides  11 hrs ·

Finally back and rested after SJ4 and I have to say I was blown away at how fantastic it was. Nate Brouse put on the most amazing event in the history of the sport, which drew some of the strongest hands in the world over a myriad of disciplines from climbers, to armwrestlers, to grip specialists to strongmen, to crossfit athletes and steelbenders. The room was a who’s who in strength. The event was run unbelievably smoothly and the three platforms ran like a top thanks to the fantastic job the volunteers did with scoring. Despite only hitting my goal in one lift, I managed to take third place behind John Ezra McCarter (who shined) and Wojo John Wojciechowski . And I believe regardless if I hit my goals, I still would have placed third. I think most people who know me by now understand that I am always about how to hit personal goals and let the chips fall where they will. I seriously loved meeting and hanging out with everyone. There was not one person in the room who was trying to belittle anyone and everyone was very helpful. It was great to meet Chris Schoeck and get a steel bending tutorial from the man featured in the documentary Bending Steel. Also I wanted to thank Jedd Johnson for helping me as well. Jedd and I have had some rifts before but it seems like we are finding common ground now, which is cool. I thought the first event (grippers) ran almost flawlessly and on time. Though the 30mm block has been my nemesis it also helps me diagnose where my hand needs to become stronger. I managed to hit my goal in the crusher, going just over 160lbs and was able to witness a young man named Deuron (sp) just miss the world record on the lift. When he learns how to set a gripper, he is going to be among the best (if not the best) American athletes in the sport. It was great to finally meet Dan Fleming and Ger Alt who came from out of the country. Also, though he hurt his back, it was nice to see Kenny Smith and Michelle Smith come out and see Kenny and Steve SteveLisa Nichols try something new. Steve and Deuron killed the Iron Mind Crushed to dust challenge.
Now to address the elephant in the room: the flask. Look, I think I speak for everyone when I say that I like Gil Goodman and Maria Bascetta immensely. There doesn’t seem to be an ugly bone in their bodies; they are helpful, self-effacing and gracious to everyone they come across. Maria has helped me with my deadlift and given me stretches, which have been beneficial to healing what seemed like chronic pain in my forearm. Gil’s customer service is the best I have encountered at Barrel Strength Systems and I hope I have bought enough products from Gil an been congruent enough with him so he does not think of this as an attack on his business or products. I like the concept of the flask. At 57mm it is about the width of most plates you would pinch together and it is sloped in the same fashion. The problem with the device is either that it is aluminum or it is tough to chalk or it has no texture or all of the above. I am honestly not sure which. I am certainly not taking anything away from Lucas Raymond or Jedd as they (I believe) put up the best pinch numbers on the day but I think if they were honest, they would admit that Kody Delone Burns had the best 1hp ability of anyone in the room with Dan Fleming close behind. I am not saying there is anyone who cannot be beat on any given day but what I will say is that Kody is just a standard deviation above us all. His feats of pinch strength have proven that and I think the apparatus used in competition should also reflect accurately ones ability to pinch, not limited by texture. Lucas and Jedd won and were clearly along with Gil among the top five guys in the room, no question and neither has a weakness. However, it seems the flask seems to bring everyone’s numbers to the center. As far as training tools go, I think it is fantastic. Nothing has been better for me to do holds with as it has enabled me to do sets of extended holds without tearing the webbing of my thumb but I am not sure it is appropriate as a test of one’s overall pinch ability. I sincerely hope there is no bad feelings after posting this as I hope a second generation flask is released and improved upon.
The overall standings of the event had Gil winning first, followed by Dan Fleming and my training partner Bob Sundin . Then we were treated to a feast by Maureen Brouse, which was fantastic. The chicken and ribs were to die for, as were the brownies. Nate did the medley in his basement, which is a really cool training area. The medley was a widepinchapalooza, not conducive to these 7.5 inch hands. I was gassed by the time it was my turn and missed a few easy items before I decided it was naptime. I was truly bushed, hands taxed and thought I would bring a bit more levity to the room. Afterward in every direction, you could see someone doing awesome feats of strength like Chris Rider tearing phonebooks and license plates. My fellow PUAs, Bob Sundin, Rick Thorpe and Jason Otto also did some phonebook tearing. We all hung out, and drank some beer until Jason decided he was hungry again and needed to devour a whole pizza by himself. The following morning, we ate breakfast and hit the road, completely satisfied with our experiences and laughing most of the way home as PUAs do. We got stuck in a standstill in traffic on 85, where the lane (that’s right, one lane) was blocked. I decided to get out of the car and sit on the guardrail to have a beer, much to the chagrin of Jason, who was acting like my dad at the time. As usual, traffic got moving and Jason, Bob and Scott kept me in stitches all the way home. It was good to be home as I missed the family but I have to say I would not have missed this event for the world. I honestly hope it wasn't a once in a lifetime opportunity. Take a bow, Nate! Having put together events of this magnitude in a different sport, I know it is no small undertaking featuring months of planning and many manhours behind the scenes. I hope you are as satisfied with what you have accomplished in your execution of this event as the attendees were as it didn't seem like there was a long face in the room.

[Jedd Johnson]

14 hours ago, anwnate said:

I should note...that when Jedd drops to 3rd with a 93kg BW, Dan is literally only 5/100ths ahead of him.  Probably needless to say, Gil took it down anyway it was done.

Jedd, while you probably feel a little screwed at this point, I gotta say that for YEARS, the little guys were shut out of the overall...regardless of how many BW World Records they could break in a comp.

Getting things completely locked down on the body weight thing may take a very long time.  In the mean time, Weight Class will always be considered fair as can reasonably be calculated.

Pulling handsize into computations is a Pandora's box.  Some people have much bigger palms, some fingers, some have short as hell pinkies.

The sport needs to simplify to move forward and expand, not complicate.

Frankly, except perhaps for making a name at Nationals, I'm not exactly sure why comps need an "overall" winner. 

I think that SJ4's 83kg Champion is just as cool as SJ4's 120kg Champion.

I never said I felt screwed, ever bud.  I didn't win, regardless of the scoring system.

I'm just pointing out what at this point should be an obvious flaw in this Allometric scoring.

And just a reminder: I've ALWAYS said that smaller competitors were at a disadvantage in many grip events.  That is why I instituted hand size categories in the comps I ran way back in 2005.  This is why we quickly re-thought the use of the credit card set in contests with grippers.  This is why I fully supported smaller wrist rollers, and why, even though I thought hand size categories made much more sense, I supported going to weight classes. 

 

[Lucasraymond]

14 hours ago, Tommy J. said:

Dang you run a huge comp, Nate! 

Looks like a lot of fun. One of these years i hope to finally make it out.

 

since i dont compete much these days, i havent given much thought to the formulas and whatnot. But yeah, i can see the argument on both sides any way it goes. Finding a perfect one to keep things even across the board is gonna be near imossible i would think.. at least in the sense that a formula could keep everyone in agreememt.

 

not that i should jump in and have a say (since im not even competing these days), but i dig what Nate mentioned about the "overall" standing. Why bother with a formula for the sake of overall placing? Nates comps especially are big enough that there are plenty of competitors in each class. Which makes a placing in a particular weight class that much sweeter.

 

imo, the select few guys that have the ability to win an overall placing while competing against guys nearly 40-60lbs heavier, do not need a formula to get that overall spot. Guys like Adam Glass, Andrew, Gil, Kody, Tanner, all come to mind.

 

and im definitely in agreement the hand size thing. Definitely. All the greats in grip do not have small hands. Not even remotely. Only problem is no way to get a formula for hand size.

You can use an allometric scoring which does take hand size into account. For example Ill use 6", 7", 8", and 9" hands and using basic fractions to show an equal score but with different weights lifted at those amounts. Using the 8" hand and lifting 100lbs say on the flask as the baseline. The amount below would score equally the same using an allometric scaling. You would have to use the scaling on hand size events (fixed width pinch, thickbar, 30mm/CC grippers) while other events you wouldnt use its where hand size has less of an effect.

6" = 75lbs    7"= 87.5lbs    

8"=100lbs    9"=112.5lbs

[Tom Scibelli]

1 hour ago, Lucasraymond said:

You can use an allometric scoring which does take hand size into account. For example Ill use 6", 7", 8", and 9" hands and using basic fractions to show an equal score but with different weights lifted at those amounts. Using the 8" hand and lifting 100lbs say on the flask as the baseline. The amount below would score equally the same using an allometric scaling. You would have to use the scaling on hand size events (fixed width pinch, thickbar, 30mm/CC grippers) while other events you wouldnt use its where hand size has less of an effect.

6" = 75lbs    7"= 87.5lbs    

8"=100lbs    9"=112.5lbs

This is a pretty interesting idea

[Andrew Dube]

10 hours ago, richcottrell said:

Open ended question...

Ok, while I was there...  I missed a bunch of the "happenings".    

So for those who can say " I was there" was was the single most impressive thing of SJ4?

(a very open ended question)

For me:

Gil winning the overall no matter how you score it.

Duevorn opening weight of 91 on the crusher. 

Josh's amazing and unique trophies. I hope that he or anyone else with photos of them will post them here so those who did not attend can appreciate them too.

[MCrushetta]

17 hours ago, Kashtan said:

Any video of this attempts? 

Yes I have it. I sent it to him.

[Jose Cabrera]

3 hours ago, Tom Scibelli said:

This is a pretty interesting idea

I agree, maybe a cut off can be divised, for example, people with "small" hands, 20mm set, medium 30mm, and large a ccs. On the same note possibly even with the rolling handles;  trylobite comes to mind. Small hands 2" handle, medium hands 2.5 large 3 inch and so forth. Just tossing the idea out there. Maybe even the flask can be produced  at various widths lets say three and a three platform format can be used with all three examples. One with 2" handle etc. 

[Jose Cabrera]

If i may ask, can a moderator move my comment to the overall vs class discussion please, i beleive its more relevant there.

[Squeezus]

11 hours ago, richcottrell said:

Open ended question...

Ok, while I was there...  I missed a bunch of the "happenings".    

So for those who can say " I was there" was was the single most impressive thing of SJ4?

(a very open ended question)

I immediately think of Duevorn's thickbar mastery: Snatching up the 200lb Rolling Thunder like it was a sack of groceries, opening higher than the second place weight on the 2.5" Crusher, finishing with a 211lb lift, and hopping weight above the world record. Very impressive. But it's hard to narrow down a single thing...

Handing a phonebook to @Adam Juncker and telling him to tear it for me (because I didn't know how) and him casually busting it open halfway while talking and leaning against a wall.

160lb Chris Shoeck rolling up a beautiful scroll out of a damn 3/16" x 1" flat bar after HOURS of lifting and bending.

@Andrew Dube bending a monstrous 3/4" x 5' (I think) steel round after HOURS of lifting and bending.

I know I'm forgetting some stuff.

[anwnate]

7 hours ago, Jedd Johnson said:

I never said I felt screwed, ever bud.  I didn't win, regardless of the scoring system.

I'm just pointing out what at this point should be an obvious flaw in this Allometric scoring.

And just a reminder: I've ALWAYS said that smaller competitors were at a disadvantage in many grip events.  That is why I instituted hand size categories in the comps I ran way back in 2005.  This is why we quickly re-thought the use of the credit card set in contests with grippers.  This is why I fully supported smaller wrist rollers, and why, even though I thought hand size categories made much more sense, I supported going to weight classes. 

 

No one has done more than you in this side of the pond.  I used the word "probably" because I would feel shut out in a similar position.  Everyone would like to play on a level field.

[anwnate]

The most impressive thing to me was the way everyone pulled together to make the event happen.

The red shirts were crazy invaluable to execute this comp.

Beyond that...regular comp goers and even newbies stepped up to handle anything that was needed.

From a promoters perspective...this was impressive as hell.

Thank you all.

[Climber028]

The community was incredibly impressive. I can't even count the people that were giving me advice and helping out with implements I was unfamiliar with or clarifying rules. Everything from hand placement to choosing opening weights was so valuable, I would have performed much worse if I was just on my own. It's rare to find a group of people so open to new comers, I've been in a lot of communities that disregard new people until they're "good enough", what ever that means and this event was a welcomed surprise.

[bwwm]

Congrats to all the competitors!!!  I can't even imagine a contest this big!

[Buccos1]

Congratulations to everyone!  Congrats Anton on the bending too.  Are the bending results going to be posted?  Really, really wanted to compete, but it wasn't in the cards this year.  From looking through the pics and reading some of the write-ups, it looks like it was epic.  Awesome job Nate and everyone who helped get it together.   

[Anton.Torrella]

Thanks Carl! And yea if @acromegaman still has the bending score sheet lets throw it up