Just Order the HUB! What's a good lift?

[Beast_Incarnate]

I've got a red-neck Hub at home that I've made from a 1.75L Simply Orange bottle, with the stack of weights duct-tapped to the bottom. It's making due while I wait for my official IronMind Hub to come in!

Here's what the bottle looks like (filled with water), similar to a hub shape yes, but advantageous because of the ledge at the top which really allows the distal part of your fingers to really bite onto.

Reason for all this, is because tonight I lifted 60 lbs with my injured hand, wrapping my hand around the hub first between the index and middle like a "V" and then wrapping my thumb and the rest of my hand around the top and I lifted the weight until both my hand and elbow was parallel to my ear!

I'm wondering because while I do have experience with grippers (since November), and currently chasing down #2.5. What is a "good" Hub lift for an experience grip athlete? And what are some of your fellow gripaholics lifting?

Ironmind has listed:

30 lbs as average / 50 lbs accomplished / 80 lbs world class

But I'd like to see real data of some of my fellow members.

Also, to what height is considered "green" for the Crushed to Dust challenge and Hub World Record attempts?

I'm not bragging or looking for attention but it really hit home to me tonight and goes back to when I was struggling to tie my shoes with my one hand and using other foot to hold tension in the other lace about a year and a half ago...

Edited July 6, 2017 by Beast_Incarnate

[Chez]

Just a heads up. I have seen that V technique with two fingers and I'm pretty sure it isn't allowed by most hub rules. Since I believe most comps etc don't allow it, I wouldn't spend much time with it. I could be wrong and maybe someone will chime in and correct me. The rules for the hub are a pain and there has been a lot of controversy over them so it fell out of favor in NAGS contest. I would say good starts at 50+, 60+ is great and excellent is 70+ Lbs for an experienced guy but that is obviously subjective 

Edited July 6, 2017 by Chez

[Beast_Incarnate]

Thanks for the reply Chez, once I get pick up some chalk I'll be able to better see where I am. No problem using standard hand placement for my right hand, I might even be able to hit 50 lbs for 2 reps with my RH. But I'll have to adapt a legal but unique grip that'll allow me to lift heavy with my left hand. 

Didn't know that about hand placement, and it worked so damn well with my injured hand (LH), you're absolutely right - if it's NOT allowed in competition there's no sense training it. 

I'll report back some official numbers when the official Hub arrives next week. 

Edited September 6, 2017 by Beast_Incarnate

[Frank Pizzo]

I had 3 guys from work over last summer and they all tried my Ironmind Hub for fun, as well as a bunch of other grip stuff. 2 guys lifted 50 lbs and 1 guy lifted 56 lbs.  None of those guys train grip, and only the one that pulled 56 lbs even lifts weights.  

I think Ironmind's averages are a little low.  If you wan't to take a look at the NAGS list for the Hub it has quite a few lifts for the top 100 and also by weight class...

http://www.gripsport.org/lists.php?list=1&event=14&country=all&gender=1&measurement=1

[pburke23]

There's a bit of variance on difference hubs, due to materials and whatnot. But, across the board, I'd consider around 70lbs on an Ironmind or Barrel Strength hub to be a "good" lift. 

[Fist of Fury]

There's even variance in the Ironmind hubs. Some models doesn't take chalk at all. It's a friction based lift so that is a very important factor. The Ironmind hub I have doesn't take any chalk at all, it's difficult to pinch without chalk.

[Hubgeezer]

I am going to disagree with some...

 

On July 1, 2013, in San Jose, California, Alexey Tyukalov successfully pulled 64 pounds. He missed at 69 pounds.

In the same contest, Mike Burke successfully pulled 64 pounds. He missed at 69 pounds.

Someone else won it with 69 pounds. The previous year, at the same venue, Adam Glass missed at 64 pounds.

a) Do Tyukalov and Burke have good grips?

b) Is 64 pounds a "good lift"? 

 

I also think training lifts in garages or at home are going to be higher than in competitions, where there is limited time to come forward, and an audience is present. 

[pburke23]

They certainly have good grips, but my guess is they very rarely train or specialize with a hub, very low on the importance scale for them. So 64lbs is a great lift for someone who doesn't specialize, I would consider 70+ is good for someone who actually trains it regularly.

[Squeezus]

16 minutes ago, Hubgeezer said:

I am going to disagree with some...

 

On July 1, 2013, in San Jose, California, Alexey Tyukalov successfully pulled 64 pounds. He missed at 69 pounds.

In the same contest, Mike Burke successfully pulled 64 pounds. He missed at 69 pounds.

Someone else won it with 69 pounds. The previous year, at the same venue, Adam Glass missed at 64 pounds.

a) Do Tyukalov and Burke have good grips? Absolutely.

b) Is 64 pounds a "good lift"? Yes, but not for a national/international level grip athlete.

 

I also think training lifts in garages or at home are going to be higher than in competitions, where there is limited time to come forward, and an audience is present. 

To be fair, not everyone that has a strong grip is good at the hub and, especially with painted/coated equipment like the IM Hub, taking results from one or two competitions or venues will not give an accurate representation of what constitutes a good lift.

That said, I would consider 65lbs "good". I would say you need to break into the 70's to get into "great" territory. I can personally pull 75lbs on mine any day of the week, but you won't see me pulling anything like the numbers that Tyukalov and Burke do on thickbar implements.

[Shoggoth]

Hand size/dimensions also plays a huge role in how well a person can hub. There are some great grip folks out there where the hub severely lags.

[Chez]

6 minutes ago, Squeezus said:

but you won't see me pulling anything like the numbers that Tyukalov and Burke do on thickbar implements.

Another thing I noticed is that smaller guys often excel on the hub. I think very big hands can be a disadvantage on it unlike thickbar. the hub is a small circle and big hands have to collapse in on it. 

Edited July 6, 2017 by Chez

[Beast_Incarnate]

On 7/6/2017 at 6:34 AM, Frank Pizzo said:

I had 3 guys from work over last summer and they all tried my Ironmind Hub for fun, as well as a bunch of other grip stuff. 2 guys lifted 50 lbs and 1 guy lifted 56 lbs.  None of those guys train grip, and only the one that pulled 56 lbs even lifts weights.  

I think Ironmind's averages are a little low.  If you wan't to take a look at the NAGS list for the Hub it has quite a few lifts for the top 100 and also by weight class...

http://www.gripsport.org/lists.php?list=1&event=14&country=all&gender=1&measurement=1

Thanks for that Frank,

I appreciate the link, it gives me a list that I can place myself within and get an idea of how competitive I need to train myself for!

Best Regards!

B.I.

[Beast_Incarnate]

19 hours ago, pburke23 said:

There's a bit of variance on difference hubs, due to materials and whatnot. But, across the board, I'd consider around 70lbs on an Ironmind or Barrel Strength hub to be a "good" lift. 

If only grippers were the only variance! 

I sweat a lot, especially my hands after a few dead-lift reps or heavy gripper work, hopefully the model I get warms up to the idea of chalk, because it would certainly progress my training even faster as opposed to a model that doesn't quite hold chalk as well.

[Beast_Incarnate]

I very surprised to see those 2 grip legends Hub total! Great lifts either way!

But,

I think the live atmosphere as well as the variance in the Hub's plays a role, I know Mike Burke specifically as the one who can axle deadlift 500+ lbs, and with his 64 lbs Hub lift - it's still an very strong lift, remember the original WORLD RECORD Hub Lift was set by Mike Corlett who lifted 64 lbs! on July 15, 2012

There's a mental barrier you have to erect in your mind when competing live in front of a crowd (I'm talking from experience in other sports, I've yet to actually compete in grip sport), you're there for one reason only and besides the distracting noise around you, the secret is to ignore all and get into the dark quiet space that exists within yourself and preform exactly what you came there to do, there's the difference between garage/competition...but it's very hard to do - we all have stage freight. 

Edited July 7, 2017 by Beast_Incarnate

[Beast_Incarnate]

18 hours ago, Shoggoth said:

Hand size/dimensions also plays a huge role in how well a person can hub. There are some great grip folks out there where the hub severely lags.

Hey Shoggoth, 

What's would be considered a "successful" hand size? For me mine are:

8" from tip of middle finger to bottom of palm.

11" around (dorsal muscle beside thumb around palm to the other size.

[Beast_Incarnate]

18 hours ago, Chez said:

Another thing I noticed is that smaller guys often excel on the hub. I think very big hands can be a disadvantage on it unlike thickbar. the hub is a small circle and big hands have to collapse in on it. 

That's interesting, 

Like I said, never seen one in person, so I'll be able to fully appreciate the insight of your Chez.

Thank you.

How big are your hands?

[Chez]

11 minutes ago, Beast_Incarnate said:

That's interesting, 

Like I said, never seen one in person, so I'll be able to fully appreciate the insight of your Chez.

Thank you.

How big are your hands?

Mine are 8" inches long from the first crease in the wrist to the tip of the middle finger. 

[Josh O'Dell]

Mines 8 1/4 from wrist to tip of middle finger and 10in handspan. I am not that good at the hub, although i have never really trained for it.

[Shoggoth]

1 hour ago, Beast_Incarnate said:

Hey Shoggoth, 

What's would be considered a "successful" hand size? For me mine are:

8" from tip of middle finger to bottom of palm.

11" around (dorsal muscle beside thumb around palm to the other size.

Seem big for hubbing from what I've seen but everyone's different. Don't let it alter your perception much. Hubbing is a great "equalizer" event to have in the mix so it's best to be as good as you can with it. 

[Squeezus]

I think there are a few reasons that many large hands suffer on the hub, even when the guys are really good at other grip stuff.

1. Big hands make you better at thickbar, wide pinch, and grippers. This means that people with an overall average grip, but huge hands, can put up impressive numbers on those implements. Hub doesn't care how big your hand is, so you have to actually be strong, independent of your size advantage, to succeed.
2. Hand flexibility. In order to get your hand positioned optimally on the hub, you have to directly oppose your thumb from your strongest fingers. If you can only get your thumb to the side, you are basically pinching between your thumb and your ring and pinky finger. If you can get your thumb all they way to the back, you can more so oppose your middle  and index finger, which are leagues stronger than your last two fingers.
3. Experience: Big guys like the big lifts and stuff that they are naturally good at. If you don't train a specific event because you aren't good at it from the get-go, then don't expect to magically become great at it. The hub, and other small device lifts (stub, coin, etc) require dexterity and specificity to be good at, so most people, regardless of hand size will need to train them to get good.

I made a video just a bit ago to back up my points, give it a gander if you get a moment:

 

[Beast_Incarnate]

4 hours ago, Shoggoth said:

Seem big for hubbing from what I've seen but everyone's different. Don't let it alter your perception much. Hubbing is a great "equalizer" event to have in the mix so it's best to be as good as you can with it. 

I'm hoping it can help me get past the #2.5 and a little closer to the #3!

I'm excited to be able to expand my grip sport equipment collection beyond assorted grippers. 

Edited July 7, 2017 by Beast_Incarnate

[Beast_Incarnate]

2 hours ago, Squeezus said:

I think there are a few reasons that many large hands suffer on the hub, even when the guys are really good at other grip stuff.

1. Big hands make you better at thickbar, wide pinch, and grippers. This means that people with an overall average grip, but huge hands, can put up impressive numbers on those implements. Hub doesn't care how big your hand is, so you have to actually be strong, independent of your size advantage, to succeed.
2. Hand flexibility. In order to get your hand positioned optimally on the hub, you have to directly oppose your thumb from your strongest fingers. If you can only get your thumb to the side, you are basically pinching between your thumb and your ring and pinky finger. If you can get your thumb all they way to the back, you can more so oppose your middle  and index finger, which are leagues stronger than your last two fingers.
3. Experience: Big guys like the big lifts and stuff that they are naturally good at. If you don't train a specific event because you aren't good at it from the get-go, then don't expect to magically become great at it. The hub, and other small device lifts (stub, coin, etc) require dexterity and specificity to be good at, so most people, regardless of hand size will need to train them to get good.

I made a video just a bit ago to back up my points, give it a gander if you get a moment:

 

Thanks for sharing your video, I appreciate that.

I took note of the technique you used, and I think I'll try it on actual Hub once it arrives and not just this piece of sh*t I have at home.

And that easily explains earlier about Burke's Hub lift, but you have remember 64 lbs being a very respectful lift, and at 80 lbs is WR territory, 90 lbs has just been officially recorded by Harri Tolonen this most recent February. 

[Hubgeezer]

On 7/6/2017 at 1:08 PM, pburke23 said:

They certainly have good grips, but my guess is they very rarely train or specialize with a hub, very low on the importance scale for them. So 64lbs is a great lift for someone who doesn't specialize, I would consider 70+ is good for someone who actually trains it regularly.

I suspect each point you make here is on the mark.