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If You Had The Secret Weapon


EJ Livesey

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EJ Livesey

You know the "secret weapon" Joe Kinney used to close the 4. The piece of training equiptment that damaged so many guys, yep that thing. I know you know what I'm referring to.

So would you use it and how often would you use it? Not asking if it's worth the money or if Joe closed the 4. Honestly I don't care. I'm asking if YOU would use it and how often would YOU use it.

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There is a price to pay for every thing we do. Extreme training is going to result in more wear and tear - and more injuries - than a more moderate and sustainable training approach. It may take you

I wouldn't compare them to the slingshot, necessarily. It would be more like loading up a weight beyond your max on the bench, unracking it and holding it at right above your sticking point until you

I've used the secret weapon in the past and will continue to use it because of the results I have gotten before; there has been zero injuries while using it. I've always trained the machine in the sa

climber511

I had one I made a long time ago - used it 3 or 4 times and got rid of it. But I don't train grippers ever either so take that how you wish.

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EJ Livesey

I had one I made a long time ago - used it 3 or 4 times and got rid of it. But I don't train grippers ever either so take that how you wish.

I've had one sitting in my living room for almost five years now. Used maybe a dozen times five years ago. Now I'm not sure what to do with it. I bought it from the gripper superstore back when they sold every gripper on the market, that tells you how old it is. I don't train gripper either.

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Frank Pizzo

I hardly ever touch my grippers cause I don't really care too much about them these days, but even if I did I wouldn't put a hand on that thing because of the risk of injury.

I don't always avoid a particular training path just because "I might get hurt" but in this case I care too little about grippers and the risk is too high for me to consider it as a viable training tool.

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EJ Livesey

I really don't see how you can get hurt. When the handle starts to slip just grab it with your empty hand. The handle is extended so there is no fighting for hand space. It boggles my mind how guys get hurt using this thing.

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Frank Pizzo

I really don't see how you can get hurt. When the handle starts to slip just grab it with your empty hand. The handle is extended so there is no fighting for hand space. It boggles my mind how guys get hurt using this thing.

Fighting to keep it closed too hard with a weight too heavy...basically not knowing when to stop.

I think some people experience something similar when bending...continually pushing themselves until their bones fracture!

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EJ Livesey

I really don't see how you can get hurt. When the handle starts to slip just grab it with your empty hand. The handle is extended so there is no fighting for hand space. It boggles my mind how guys get hurt using this thing.

Fighting to keep it closed too hard with a weight too heavy...basically not knowing when to stop.

I think some people experience something similar when bending...continually pushing themselves until their bones fracture!

Well played good sir! Touché! You got me.

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greasygorrilla

I built one two years ago. Used it a couple of times and never touched it since. Overloads and negatives are not for me.

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Evan Raftopoulos

You know the "secret weapon" Joe Kinney used to close the 4. The piece of training equiptment that damaged so many guys, yep that thing. I know you know what I'm referring to.

So would you use it and how often would you use it? Not asking if it's worth the money or if Joe closed the 4. Honestly I don't care. I'm asking if YOU would use it and how often would YOU use it.

I don't have the secret weapon. Is it just for holds and negatives? I practice that on a gripper machine at my gym but I 'd be interested in trying the secret weapon at some point to see how it feels.

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Justin Matney

I have one as well. a friend welded it up for me maybe 3 years ago.

I haven't used it much. I had it made when I was on my original gung-ho mission toward certing on the #3, a time during which I was also doing extreme negatives with a 3.5 and bending steel with horrific form. My body just wasn't ready for that much force, and this time around my training methods and goals are much different.

I don't know that I'll ever use it again. I'd sell mine if I could, but I only know of one other guy in my area who does grip. And he may not even do grip anymore. So for now it's just sitting in the garage.

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Justin Matney

You know the "secret weapon" Joe Kinney used to close the 4. The piece of training equiptment that damaged so many guys, yep that thing. I know you know what I'm referring to.

So would you use it and how often would you use it? Not asking if it's worth the money or if Joe closed the 4. Honestly I don't care. I'm asking if YOU would use it and how often would YOU use it.

I guess to more specifically answer the question, if I were to use it again, it would be infrequently, once per month max, and I would use it in the same way as an extended handle gripper--to push a bit beyond my max close in a forced/negative capacity, and to micro load toward that goal. Once you work out the equivalent weight, the micro loading aspect is probably the coolest thing about the secret weapon. It's something you just can't do with an extended handle gripper, at least not with any precision. A Silvis Megalodon is probably the closest, but you're not going to be able to micro load that thing with near the precision as SW.

But like I said my goals and methods have changed. I used to go max or near max twice a week. Now I'm between 70-80% once per week for sets of 5. So negatives aren't even in the equation for me at this time. Full, wide set reps for sets of 5 between sets of squats and presses are working great for me. If my effort and genetics see me through to an elite level one day, then I could see incorporating the SW again.

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I wouldn't trust myself with it.I don't have a middle setting, and I know I would get FUBAR if I had an SW around here. I would load it safely... At first. Then I would slam everything on it, and get stupid. Slow and steady will win my particular race.

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Jared Goguen

So I have the crusher attachment for my pops grip machine which is kinda the same as the secret weapon.

I use it often.

As for all these people saying they got hurt or you will hurt yourself I wonder how far they are pushing it.

Example if you can close a gripper rated at 150lbs and that is your max I really doubt you can hurt yourself doing negatives on any machine or gripper if your working at 105-110% of your max. Now if you want on full idiot mode and went for 150-175% yeah your likely to get hurt but that's the case with pretty much everything.

If your one rep max squat is 405 and you grind that, what do you think will happen when you jump under 535? I see no difference, its all about control and training smart.

Obviously I'm still kinda new here and by no means the strongest but I have seen a lot of progress in the past year. When I joined here I couldn't close my CoC #.5, and now just last week I close a GHP5 113RGC for the first time, I think part of that progress is due to timed holds and negatives.

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John McCarter

I've used the secret weapon in the past and will continue to use it because of the results I have gotten before; there has been zero injuries while using it.

I've always trained the machine in the same way as a hand gripper. I never attempted positive movements only holds/negatives when using it (3-5 seconds); if I do negatives, I only will let the swing handle open about 5-10mm. I say only let the machine open up to an inch or 1 1/2.

The most important concept I pay attention to is form. Never getting carried away with what I'm attempting. Focusing on the area I want to get better in.

I have gotten crazy numbers on the machine in the past (250+ lbs), but, I had put actual hand grippers aside and didn't focus my effort on using them and caused a setback that I had to overcome and learn a new way of approaching what I was doing.

I have no clue how other people have approached and used the machine.

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Had one, used it a few times, and sold it. I got a better feel from using grippers for negatives.

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Geralt

I have a homemade piece. I notice that every time I used it for a few weeks, I got more prone to irritations in the lower arm. For me - and this goes also for my plateloader - there is a sudden difference in pressure when holding a static weight i.e. secret weapon and applying heavy pressure immediately when performing a close (linear resistance with plateloader). This is more taxing for my tendons than squeezing grippers, where resistance ramps up throughout the motion.

Hope this makes sense how i described it. I did some more plateloader work recently and presto, lefty tendinitis is flaring up.

With the secret weapon, the thing is in whatever setup you train, you always need to train at least 100% with these things imo. I don't see any point in squeezing the SW tight/closed with a weight you can easily hold. Just see no point in that.

But maybe that is where my approach goes wrong :)

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EJ Livesey

All great info guys. I appreciate all the feedback.

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Anthony C.

I think negatives get a bad rap, mainly because people use them incorrectly. John McCarter taught me that when doing negatives, you don't fight the weight as the handle slowly opens. Once the handles open just a little bit, you release. So whether it be on the secret weapon or a regular plate loaded grip machine, as long as you aren't training like a jackass and you are also doing work for your extensors, things should be relatively safe. Of course, there is a chance for injury with everything no matter what.

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I think it had a place but shortens careers . I would do it lighter and for a more rehab type activity. Work till ya die or bleed is a thought NOT a plan . At 57 Re certing on a #3 ( after 17 years) was a good indicator I was for the most part making my grip strength longevity through training decisions

. How old is Mr. Kinney ? He should with sound training be ready to re certify again I would think... 1998+17=2015. Best of luck.

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climber511

There is a price to pay for every thing we do. Extreme training is going to result in more wear and tear - and more injuries - than a more moderate and sustainable training approach. It may take you a little longer to get there but look around at the number of people no longer training at all due to catastrophic and life altering injuries. The price may be worth it if you make your living at this stuff but be honest - do you? Train smart - train for life - so what if you end up lifting less but can do it 20 - 30 - or 40 years longer.

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There is a price to pay for every thing we do. Extreme training is going to result in more wear and tear - and more injuries - than a more moderate and sustainable training approach. It may take you a little longer to get there but look around at the number of people no longer training at all due to catastrophic and life altering injuries. The price may be worth it if you make your living at this stuff but be honest - do you? Train smart - train for life - so what if you end up lifting less but can do it 20 - 30 - or 40 years longer.

This is the TRUTH.

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I think it had a place but shortens careers . I would do it lighter and for a more rehab type activity. Work till ya die or bleed is a thought NOT a plan . At 57 Re certing on a #3 ( after 17 years) was a good indicator I was for the most part making my grip strength longevity through training decisions

. How old is Mr. Kinney ? He should with sound training be ready to re certify again I would think... 1998+17=2015. Best of luck.

I don't think you need to compare yourself to him anymore. Two different times, and people.

What you did at 57 was very impressive.

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EJ Livesey

I think it had a place but shortens careers . I would do it lighter and for a more rehab type activity. Work till ya die or bleed is a thought NOT a plan . At 57 Re certing on a #3 ( after 17 years) was a good indicator I was for the most part making my grip strength longevity through training decisions

. How old is Mr. Kinney ? He should with sound training be ready to re certify again I would think... 1998+17=2015. Best of luck.

I don't think you need to compare yourself to him anymore. Two different times, and people.

What you did at 57 was very impressive.

This x1000 we all know you don't like the guy, We are over it. I'm asking about the secret weapon and NOTHING else. Please don't derail or hijack this.

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Don't Sir, directly tell me what I think. I really don't care for you to speak for me. Thank you. I paid for his training tapes which encourage severe negatives both first and re -edited version and I have personally told you what I suggested for training, the potential pitfalls of" extreme training" which several others have suggested this intensity Damage of negative movement produces. Thank you ,Richard Sorin

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