Bill Piche Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 If the #4 is closed by a known user of steroids, do you think it would tarnish the close? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazza Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 Bill My personal opinion Yeah,as i put it down to cheating. Still an awesome feat,but like all the other awesome feats in Strongman,powerlifting etc,could they have done these feats without the juice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griparn Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 I do also think it's cheating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amaury Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 I don't think many of todays world strength records were done drug free anyway. If the guy is a known user of steroids at least the guy is honest. PS: i must add that i think the #4 can be closed drug free... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Black Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 Most definitely. I can close a 4 now with a vice. In my mind there is no difference between using a vice or juice. In both cases you are using a tool to achieve a feat of strength that you would not normally be capable of. I admit that I have a hard nosed view on steroids. Just the way it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratavarious_connection Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 absolutely yes, Wanna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmmicklabs Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 I don't know how I feel on this issue. What if a guy did some PCP right before his certification and closed a # 3 or # 4 due to the drug jacking up this adrenaline levels. Who would know. Having everyone take a piss test before certifing would not work so well now would it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2strong Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 I think using steroids will tarnish the feat. I don't have anything against people who choose to use these substances, but I don't want them to play on the same field as the people not using steroids. ( PS. I agree with Amaury... I don't think that many of the strength records of today is accomplished the "clean" way ). I think the "grip world" is relative clean, and steroids don't play such a big role in this form of strength. This is one of the reasons I have become so addicted to grip training Just my 2 cent's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Piche Posted April 17, 2003 Author Share Posted April 17, 2003 To add... As we all know, no one is going to admit to roid usage and some actually claim drug free status when they are not. In Strongman, there are very few true drug free competitors at the WSM level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bender Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 I would encourage the steroid populus to grip train. Sure, it would completely tarnish any feat, but like a non-tested meet, it would be fun to watch what they could do with the help of "gear". I guess that's just humor, but if the hand has incredible recuperative abilities as is, imagine how hard and frequent you could train with a body full of steroids! BBWC negatives all day, every day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSW Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 Only in the sense that I would be less impressed by it. Same as I would find a #4 close by a 170lber more impressive than a close by a 400lber. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Black Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 In Strongman, there are very few true drug free competitors at the WSM level. It saddens me to hear that. WSM is one of my favorite sporting events to watch. I had suspected that some of the competitors were using or had. But thought it to be at a minimum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Piche Posted April 17, 2003 Author Share Posted April 17, 2003 Only in the sense that I would be less impressed by it. Same as I would find a #4 close by a 170lber more impressive than a close by a 400lber. Yes, but now we are talking about the next closer after Kinney. Personally, I would not recognize it. Especially if a grip brother here ended up 3rd on the list (Heath, Dave, etc. etc.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminator Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 Steroids suck, and the lies associated with their usage suck even more. Add to that list GH and any other drugs or hormones used for performance enhancement. That crap tarnishes everything.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endpoint Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 I dont think it changes a thing. the person will still have to train....if not harder to close the thing. steroids arent a magic solution s/he will have a major advantage...but dont forget the effort and dedication to get there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Piche Posted April 17, 2003 Author Share Posted April 17, 2003 I dont think it changes a thing.the person will still have to train....if not harder to close the thing. steroids arent a magic solution s/he will have a major advantage...but dont forget the effort and dedication to get there. I disagree. It tarnishes it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supersqueeze Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 I believe Roids are in nearly EVERY sport at the elite level. It no longer bothers me. I have more important things to worry about and make myself miserable over. I say if a juicer closed it, and closed it in front of many people on many separate occasions, that would be less "tarnished" than Kinney's stealth closes. Mike M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 i say lettum if they wanna. i personally aint willin to take the risks. plus if ya gotta jiuce to do anything, that kinda says it all right there. as far as wsm, theres plenty that dont use im sure, there the ones in most often in #3-#8 or so place. not sayin anyone is cus i dont know. just know im more impressed with the likes of Gerrit B. and Raimonds B. and the likes of them. they never won it, but have come close and are/were in olympics and powerliftin where they are tested and have had records to there accomplishments.and Raimonds is always in top 5 and seems to be happy just to be there competin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmmicklabs Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 I agree with Wanna. Keep the roids in the gym for the bodybuilders that stare in the mirror 8 hours a day. Real men don't need juice. Someone hand me a bear and a braughtwurst. p.s. No offense meant to any bodybuilders on the grip board. Not trying to start a flame war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobsterone Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 If the #4 is closed by a known user of steroids, do you think it would tarnish the close? I can safe answer that dbol doesn't help grip work to any degree - whatsoever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Piche Posted April 17, 2003 Author Share Posted April 17, 2003 If the #4 is closed by a known user of steroids, do you think it would tarnish the close? I can safe answer that dbol doesn't help grip work to any degree - whatsoever. There are more drugs than just dbol Steve. Drug reactions are also highly dependent on the individual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 So the only muscle not aided by dbol is grip? Is that what you are saying? Was this a double blind study? Or just a blind statement? Respect diminishes as gear increases: Raw is best. One ply is less impressive; two ply less etc. Raw diet is better than steroid diet. Denial is the worst diet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobsterone Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 I think using steroids will tarnish the feat. I don't have anything against people who choose to use these substances, but I don't want them to play on the same field as the people not using steroids. ( PS. I agree with Amaury... I don't think that many of the strength records of today is accomplished the "clean" way ). I think the "grip world" is relative clean, and steroids don't play such a big role in this form of strength. This is one of the reasons I have become so addicted to grip training Just my 2 cent's It has been discussed here before that Grip and grip work/training do not involve the muscles of the forearm in the same way a squat uses muscles of the thigh. Therefore you should consider what benefit, if any, a basic low doseage of say D'bol would benefit a grip man. Most, but not all basic roid cycles add water weight and allow a speedier recovary and a few of the testosterone drugs used by bodybuilders allow for a more aggressive approach but hardly any develop sinew and tendon strength which we know plays a big part in grip. Indeed we have seen many 'users' have muscle tears for that very reason. I'd suggest we can only think of the next person to shut a 4, if they be 'naughty' from a purely moral and highly personal point of view. Which could get messy... IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobsterone Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 So the only muscle not aided by dbol is grip? Is that what you are saying?Was this a double blind study? Or just a blind statement? Respect diminishes as gear increases: Raw is best. One ply is less impressive; two ply less etc. Raw diet is better than steroid diet. Denial is the worst diet. Wanna and Joe. Neither of you, as indeed most who have taken the decision not to ever use roids in any form, have educated yourself properly as to roid use, its true side effects, the benefits etc. You will, however, have some working knowledge on grip, forearm anatomy etc and have a rough idea even from scare stories that it is highly likey that roids in any form will effect grip and grip strength to any great degree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSW Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 Mobster, So you would predict that women have the same grip strength potential as men, since steroids give no advantage to grip training? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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