What about pinching, wrist work, digit exercises etc?

[Guest]

Hello everybody,

I hope this doesn't upset anyone in particular but I'm kinda bored with all this 'research' on the grippers. Can we be interested in some other gripping feats instead. I like Tom Black's interest in bending and leverage but he seems one of the few who looks at the big picture with grip training.

This unfortunately is the problem with not using bars and dumbells that we can all relate too. I appreciate the effort that has gone into finding out that some grippers are harder than others but if you practice all round grip strength it won't matter as you'll have a strong grip in all departments.

I personally think that to be a grip master you have to be good in all areas not just one. That's why Joe Kinney, although spectacular at crushing, was way down the list of David Horne's Top 30 Grip Athletes.

Training elements of your pinching strength, your digit strength, your supporting strength, your wrist strength, your crushing strength and forearm strength will give you great all round strength. In just the wrist stuff alone you could pick many great feats of strength, from weaver sticks to sledge hammer levering feats and table top wrist curls and supination strength.

I think all the talk and politics surrounding the grippers takes away from much of the 'real' grip work that Goerner, Saxon and Cyr were famous for and still are. There were no grippers then but it was obvious from their feats of strength that they had unbelievable grip strength.

[Guest JD79]

Good post Nick.  What you have said is true.  I'm finding out that I need alot of work in other areas of my grip.  While closing the #3 is one of my goals, I have others.  I'm sure the other guys do too.  I think right now, the grippers are a hot topic, and if you do close the #3, you are featured in Milo.  While bending steel and other things are cool, and just as extrordinary, they don't recieve that recognition.  I guess that "face time" could be the contributing factor to the interest in grippers.  The grippers are also easily available and alot easier to do than a one finger deadlift.  I'm not saying the grippers are easy, but I think the pain factor is a little less.  I'm incorporating other grip feats into my arsenal but my main focus is still the grippers.  I feel that if my gripper strength is strong, it gives me the confidence to perform other things.  Thats just my opinion though.

JD

[Guest woody36]

Nick,

       I am a noboby in the world of grip,so was glad

to see someone bring this subject up.I think people

are getting far too wrapped up in numbers and this

is detracting the fact that if you can close the 3 that

puts you in an elite category.whether they vary by a

few pounds here and there matters not,the fact

that you can close the 3 does not mean you are in

the same league as people like Mckinless,Sorin,Horne

 or indeed Mr Goerner.As you said in your post good

alround grip/wrist strength is whats important at

the end of the day,if people send  grippers to be

tested and it turns out there easier than others

its them thats going to be crushed not the gripper.

To my mind if you have closed the three that makes

you one of the best in the world,thats all you need to

   know.

     Woody.

[Bill Piche]

The reason it's a hot topic right now is obvious.  I believe the information that has come out recently is important.  Also, I'm sure as this board/site becomes more popular people will be more educated on things like plate curls, etc.  Heck, most people don't even know about the grippers!

[Tom Black]

    Great post Nick, I couldn't agree more.  I also think Wannagrip is right that grippers are a hot topic now because of the recent testing.   I think the emphasis on crushing is due to the #3 certification.   For those who have never been in Milo before, it is certainly cool to get the recognition they deserve for training hard to close the #3.  It is brilliant of Dr. Strossen to have excited the strength world with his #3 certification.  I think the time has come that grip feats on par with the #3 get similar recognition.  It is human nature to have some type of recognition once a difficult goal is reached.  Maybe the GripPage, PDA or Sorinex could create "certifications" for other feats.  I for one would love to see a list of those who have lifted the Inch Dumbbell or replica, even under non-authenticated conditions.  There are many other feats that come to mind (The numbers can be debated, here are my ideas):

    -Plate Curl 20kg or 45-pounds.

    -Deadlift Inch Dumbbell or replica.

    -Deadlift PDA's Turk at ~163-pounds (I think this is a good number to shoot for).

    -One hand Deadlift- Ring or Handle (Numbers to shoot for- the weight of the Larger Dinnie Stone for the ring (~435-pounds, 500-pounds for a non-revolving handle)

    -Sledgehammer Leverage Lift- Maybe 20-pounds over the head.

    -Pinch Grip-  Somewhere between 100-120 pounds with a 2-inch width.

    -Bend a certain piece of Steel.  I'd say the Ironmind Red, but it would be a very short list.  The blue may be too easy.  I think 18"x1/2" Hot rolled would be good for the big stock, this I believe is what Dennis Rodgers bends, and thus seems like a good goal.

    Note that the feats should have a certain amount of "intrigue" to them in order to promote excitement when training for them.  I think that we could also have a category for all around grip strength.

[3Crusher]

Nick, great post.  As interesting a topic as the grippers are, there are alot more aspects to training the grip, as you brought up.  Books that influenced me to start my grip training were Dinosaur Training and Mastery of Hand Strength.  If anybody has read these books, they know what Mr. McKinless is talking about.  There are countless ways to work one's grip because of the complexities of the hands themselves.  Thinking about how many different lifts can be done for the grip (combinations of fingers, how many fingers used, width of a pinch grip block, thickness of bars, revolving or non-revolving bar, etc.) can be staggering to the mind.  The ideal would be to get all around development, but most people tend to focus on things they are good at.  A person may have a great crushing grip, but a weak pinch grip, and may never work their pinch grip.  The better approach would be to keep your strong areas strong and try to improve your upon weak areas.  It is very difficult to excel in all aspects of grip strength.  That is why I tip my cap to guys like John Brookfield, Richard Sorin, David Horne, and Nick, because their grip strength is not purely one dimensional, it is well rounded and strong in all areas.  We're all in this for the challenge and the fun, and we should all try as many different grip feats as possible.  It is very difficult to specialize in many different grip feats at one time, but it can be done.  As your grip develops, then you can concentrate on tackling a particularly difficult feat by putting the emphasis of your grip training into that feat.  I guess what I am trying to say is, develop your grip and wrists with a wide variety of exercises, work them heavy and hard, get sufficient rest, and you will get stronger.  Enough for now.  Steve Weiner

(Edited by 3Crusher at 9:21 am on April 12, 2001)

[Gorilla Hands]

Hi Nick,

I'm glad you brought this up. My next endeavor as we speak is training on the forward weaver stick. I've been progressing fairly, but not as fruitfully as I would like. Do you or David Horne have any suggestions on the matter.

David,

I've never posted to you directly on the board before but my history of showing you great respect and awe are well noted here. You certainly can ask Nick. Any advice you have on this excercise would certainly be taken to good use.

Thanks,

David

[David Horne]

David,

We use little small 50gram weights to increase on this lift. These help alot, a half a kilo jump can just be too much. I've found holds and singles the best, reps are all over the place.

But my favourite variation of this exercise is an exercise I call 'posting', I'll possibly include info on this in the next issue of Iron Grip if there's space.

Basically, in armwrestling, when you are setting up at the table with your opponent you want to try to attain the position of having your knuckles facing the ceiling, which will usually pull his hand away from his wrist. In other words you are pouring some drink down your throat - that kind of action, except with great force. This is 'posting', which along with many other techniques can help greatly. Anyway, I find that using the weaver stick on a table in this armwrestling position (stick and weight facing away from me) very, very benificial. It works the same part (radial flexors) as the normal Weaver Stick to front.

Oh yeah, congrats. on the plate curl.

David

[Guest scotte]

Dear Nick

Seems to me that the iron mind grippers are taking on a fanatical extreamism as bench pressing has done in power lifting.  I couldnt agree more with your common sence reminder as we should all be devoted to grip strength, not just crushing strength.

Maybe the 'pain' factor is a bigger issue than most would admit to.  Too many wimps looking for acalades at minimum discomfort?