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#41 OFFLINE   CANCRUSHER

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 03:31 AM

 

 

 

 

I have many strength goals this year but I would like to share one. I would like to squat 400+.

 

In a side note, I am surprised this area of the forum doesn't have more traffic/posts. All the top grip athletes are strong powerful athletes.

I am just surprised there are not form check threads and discussions on how to bring up this or that lift.

 

Also I am really surprised by some of the goals people have posted, I would have thought several of the individuals are much stronger.

 

Well, people are strong in different ROM's.  Sometimes its difficult to compare.  There are people with DL's (imo the best general indicator of overall strength) just a bit heavier than mine, or even less than mine that can absolutely destroy me when it comes to bending and grip.  

 

Agreed... I have aiming for a 400lbs deadlift off of the floor by the end of this year, but an 800lbs top end rack pull [max is750lbs right now]. If I were to really push the top end rack pull then I could hit easily hit 900lbs by the end of this year. By powerlifting standards I am weak off of the floor, but in the standing position I'm a monster at 180lbs. Also that is something else, being sub-200lbs I have to produce more tension than some 300lbs monster... but we have to produce a similar level of tension in a top end rack pull.

 

That's ridiculous. What kind of rack pull are you doing? Is it the stand relatively straight and use every muscle in your body to hoist the weight version, or is it the second stage deadlift version? Either way it is cool. I am asking because, I am using the second stage of the deadlift version (which has a higher trade off to the deadlift) and just barely got 500 lbs with straps. I last time I did a full deadlift I did 445 with a mixed grip, and then switch hands to do it again. I can basically deficit pull what I can deadlift. What that means to you and everyone else is that my legs are really strong in comparison to my upper back.

 

My brother is 190 lbs, and specializes in olympic lifting and powerlifting. On Tuesday, I watched him deadlift 495 lbs for six reps with no belt (he uses a hook grip). He ripped the bar from the floor like he was going to hurl it at me. Like I mentioned earlier, that kind of strength comes from the glutes, hamstrings, and quads. The evidence for that comes from his other lifts: with low-bar squats 455 lbs, paused front squats with 315 lbs, glute bridges with 635 lbs, and regular deficit deadlift training (I have recently seen him lift 415 which is the most I have ever deficit pulled).

 

I am not trying to give you advice so much as I am very curious about how you train--I noticed in your earlier post that most of your goals invovled your upper body. Do you focus on your lower body at all, and if so, where are those lifts? 

 

 

The 750lbs rack pull was a very short ROM like less than 5 inches[pin 4 on my power rack] and I used straps, but I'm not considering it a hand and thigh lift because I actually consciously replicated the deadlift pattern rather than a squatting pattern. I'm assuming by 2nd stage deadlift that you mean just below the knees? I am pulling 400lbs at that height for a max and increasing the distance by 1/2" or so whenever I feel that I have converted the max at the height to base strength. My bodyweight floats between 170lbs-180lbs and I don't really care about putting on anymore weight on for many reasons.

 

It was interesting that you said that your legs were stronger that your back... which angle, position of leverage, movement pattern, type of movement[speed, iso, quasi-iso, max effort], which variation? It's just never made sense to me when people say one muscle group is stronger than another as a blanket statement. My legs are stronger than my traps and upper back in the top end rack pull, but basically anything that my legs can withstand in the stretched positions are generally easy for my back. I have very strong legs in a short ROM, much like a draft horse.

 

In the past I haven't really focused too much on building power in my legs in the stretched position because I wanted to be unreasonably strong in the standing position but that's beginning to change. I greco-roman style wrestled [no leg hooks, no leverage based throwing techniques] a friend that is 50lbs-60lbs heavier than I am and man-handled him so I decided that it was time to begin more full range as my original goal has been met. I've more recently began A2G squatting but my numbers are less than impressive... I hit 100% 1RM at a whopping weight in the sub-200lbs [190lbs I think???], which I think became more of a squatting good morning. I am also practicing partial squatting with the goal of increasing distance... I am squatting to the goal height, which is roped off with a bungee cord, pausing 5s-15s at that height, standing back up and racking it. I believe that the combination of squatting with a full rom and squatting a partial supramaximal load with the goal of increasing the distance will be highly effective in translating my short range strength into a longer range strength.

 

Amongst the full ROM squatting and partial squatting, in the past I've done quite a bit of conditioning work for my legs involving various BW squatting. As far as strength training for legs in the stretched position the answer is no, hence my low numbers on the barbell squat.

 

My strength training can be summed up as;

1) Top end rack work

2) Partials with the goal of making the weight at a longer distance

3) Full Rom work

4) Limited assitance work
5) Prehab and Conditioning

 

If i can ask what is the purpose of doing this kind of rack pulls?are you training to increase your deadlift or to get a pr in this king of rack pull?



#42 OFFLINE   Sam Scott

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 08:07 AM

I don't train grip anymore( It's been close to 2 years now) other than post bicep workout wrist curls on the 2.5" Crusher.


Probably squat 120kg for 10 ( absolutely no supporting equipment.)

Bench 100kg for 10 ( Feet up), and 140 ORM.

 

60kg strict wall curl with olympic barbell


Edited by Sam Scott, 21 April 2014 - 08:07 AM.


#43 OFFLINE   Sam Scott

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 08:10 AM

I have two big goals for the year:  

 

  • Triple-bodyweight deadlift (600lbs.)

 

  • double bodyweight raw bench press (390-400lbs.)

 

 

Both lifts lifetime drug free and as a soon-to-be Masters competitor.  I've been after a 600 DL for years--took me almost five years to go from 500 to 550, due to lots of injury issues.  Took me 22 years to go from 300 to 350 on raw bench.  LOL

 

Yep!

Gains are slow when you don't juice like 90% of the big lifters on forums do.



#44 OFFLINE   Mike Sharkey

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 08:23 AM

30-50 circa max singles per week Ass to Grass 20-30 circa max singles x partial squats to goal height with a 5-15 second pause 50-100 belt squats in the 5-15 rep range 100-200 BW squats after every squatting session

 

That seems like a ton of work.  And that's coming from someone who would regularly DL 20,000# + in half an hour.  If I may ask, have you seen your squat max go up, and if so by how much? 



#45 OFFLINE   Buccos1

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 01:52 PM

 

 

Yep!

Gains are slow when you don't juice like 90% of the big lifters on forums do.

 

 

That's part of the fun ... at least for me.  It's what keeps me chasing the goals (my goals typically are multi-year   :grin: ).  But, I never had any problem with people who chose to do that, at least as long as they weren't competing against me in the tested division.  I've always been honest with people about exactly what I do and what supplements I take.



#46 OFFLINE   wulfgeat

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 07:07 PM

 

There are several different ways to break up the deadlift, so let me explain what I mean when I use the term: "second stage of the deadlift." If we divide the deadlift into two stages: we have the first which requires a tremendous amount of glute and quad strength in order to jerk the bar from the ground, while the upper back and spine brace against the weight and the hamstrings stabilize dynamically. The second stage begins when the legs have extended to the point that the quads can no longer contribute significantly to the lift and the hamstrings and upper back hinge the bar from the knees to the upright postion. For most people, that spot where the second stage of the deadlift begins is just below the knees.

 

The reason that the glutes work harder at the bottom is because they are more powerful hip extensors when the legs are bent, while the hamstrings are more powerful when the legs are straight. Obviously, that does not mean they quite working outside of those ranges, it is just making the observation of which hip extensor has the most leverage in what position.

 

When I say that my legs are stronger than my upper back, what I am refering to is in the above deadlift mechanics. I have trained my glutes with hip thrusts (similar to glute bridges) and at one point was doing reps with 700 lbs, 1/4 squated 715 lbs, A2G highbar squat with 375lbs (I weigh 228 lbs so don't get too excited), and a good morning to the Romanian Deadlift starting postion with 265 lbs (no belt and I weighed closer to 220). In comparison, the most I have benched is 275 lbs, the most I have DB rowed is 160 lbs (my brother's dumbbell row makes mine look sad), the most I have barbell rowed is 275 lbs pronated and 305 supinated. I have done both pull-ups and chin-ups with a 45 lb plate between my legs, I have also done a weighted pistol with a 50 lb dumbbell either leg. That along with my higher deficit deadlift (probably 425 lbs at this point) means that my problem area in my deadlift comes when I reach the second stage and my upper back seizes a large chunk of the action. That's why I am currently doing three different rack pulls (a jefferson style, a hack lift style, and a convential style) in order to train my traps, lats, and obliques in orer to close the gap between myself and my (Younger) brother's #'s.

 

I asked you about your leg training because it appeared to me that you have the opposite problem. And based on your second response, it might even be related to glute strength. That being said, you could look up two different exercises: Glute Bridges and Hip thrusts. They work the hips like hyper-extensions on a glute/ham bench except with the legs bent. Bret Catreras has some intellegent things to say about the glute bridge, and he invented the hip thrust. The draw-backs to the hip thrust is that it draws alot more attention that the glute bridge, requires more equipement, and makes more noise. The draw-backs to the glute-bridge is that it can be limited by tricep and front delt strength, is requires special adjustments from people with large hips like myself, and will rub a hole in-between the shoulders of your favorite gym shirt.

 

Keep working on your squat, having a strong squat makes the bottom part of a deadlift easier. Also, you might find, that instead of trying to work your way down from your knees on your rack pull that if you start using deficit deadlifts that your regular deadlift start position feels easier because it requires less range of motion (i.e. less leg work). My brother had a system that he used to go from 4- 500 lbs: conventional deadlift (hookgrip), deficit deadlift (straps), and rack pull from below the knees (straps), glute bridges, then Dumbbell rows (yes he spent like 2-3 hours in the gym, it worked out because he had four workouts and went three times a week. That set-up gave him over a week to recover from a specific session).

 

I feel like increasing the distance is an incredibly effective way to train squats too.

 

Whether you look up those exercises or not, I hope you rip 405 off the floor like it owes you 2 years rent.

 

 

I have t-rex arms so my "second stage" begins slightly above the knee caps. Makes for a looong pull but a short push :sorcerer: .

 

Since our strengths seem to be exact opposites as you stated, then we could definitely trade tips as to what got us so strong in those areas to begin with... this is awesome. Below are my suggestions:

1) You could try conventional deadlifts at that height off of boxes.

 

2) Not for the faint of heart, deadlift an empty bar in a power rack and have someone put tape the exact position of your eyes at the front. Next put the bar in the J-hooks, with hand placement in a snatch grip remove the bar and lower to the point that your eyes are even with the tape and pause for 5s-15s, then lift and return to j-hooks. I'm saying tape instead of string or bunjee thinking of safety, because there was a study that shows that having your neck slam into something that isn't going anywhere with a couple hundred pounds in your hand isn't good for your health.

 

3) Lift conventional style in the power rack with pins at knee height and once the bar hits the pins pull isometrically against the pins.

 

4) Have a crane hoist surgically implanted in your body :rock

 

 

 

Your DB rows are the same as mine... I don't know what my limit is, but last time I checked it was 150lbs, but I suspect that it is higher now.

 

 

 

 

That's interesting in you saying that your brother trained at different heights on different days. I've structured my training to fit my lifestyle... intuitive and erratic[mostly due to school]. I have my training set up to say, "I want to hit this number of lifts with this weight on this movement on this week." So if I cannot get to the gym because I must study or finish a project and it takes 14 hours then it is no big deal because I can make it up later. It's almost like a weekly check list of things to do. Sometimes I am able to hit 2/day, rarely even 3/day sessions. More often than not I end up skipping days which is fine. My training is generally high frequency, high intensity, high volume followed by a 1 week deload every 2-3 weeks plus moderate conditioning work.

 

I haven't tried the glute bridge or the hip thrust, but I've heard about it and my girlfriend does it. Do you consider it to be a taxing exercise?

 

Thanks man! I will definately look into some of those, especially the crane hoist ;). I can understand that style of training, mine is similar, except that there is one day that I know I am going, no matter what. I want to clarify however, that was my brother's deadlift workout, which he did on one day, next he had an upper body workout two days later, and then a squat workout, and then another upper body workout, and then back to the deadlift one. He definately has a different style of training from me.

 

I do not consider neither the hip thrust nor the glute bridge to be a taxing exercise, so long as they are done after squating or deadlifting in the workout. Four reps with heavy weight will get your heart rate up, but If you are willing to do isometric rack pulls against a pin, these are a cake walk. My brother and I have learned alot about these two exercises, so feel free to ask me anything, and I will try to help as much as I can.

 

 

Also, thank you for sending the good vibes. I'm positive that you'll hit your goals too... we just have to stay the course.

Thanks man, and no problem. There should always be good vibes between lifters because ultimately, the only person that we have to beat is ourselves.



#47 OFFLINE   wulfgeat

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 08:11 PM

To everyone working on a squat goal, what is the plan of attack?

 

I have a main squat day every other week. I rotate between 5x5, 5x3, 5x1. Then follow up with sumo and lunges and then some accessory work.

I also squat every Sunday for like 3x10. I usually try to work on form issues and get some volume this day.

 

I always need more ideas of things to try. How are you planning to reach your goal?

What is your goal, and what kind of squat are you doing? If you say back squat, please specify highbar or lowbar. Where are your other lower body lifts (see # 36 for ideas).



#48 OFFLINE   king crusher

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 02:29 PM

My non grip goals are to hit 450 squat, 585 dead, 350 bench and 365 front squat and also 265 or so mil press. All are roughly 25 pounds over current levels. It's taken 17 years to get to my current numbers so keeping goals realistic.

#49 OFFLINE   hellswindstaff

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 11:26 AM

 

 

 

 

 

I have many strength goals this year but I would like to share one. I would like to squat 400+.

 

In a side note, I am surprised this area of the forum doesn't have more traffic/posts. All the top grip athletes are strong powerful athletes.

I am just surprised there are not form check threads and discussions on how to bring up this or that lift.

 

Also I am really surprised by some of the goals people have posted, I would have thought several of the individuals are much stronger.

 

Well, people are strong in different ROM's.  Sometimes its difficult to compare.  There are people with DL's (imo the best general indicator of overall strength) just a bit heavier than mine, or even less than mine that can absolutely destroy me when it comes to bending and grip.  

 

Agreed... I have aiming for a 400lbs deadlift off of the floor by the end of this year, but an 800lbs top end rack pull [max is750lbs right now]. If I were to really push the top end rack pull then I could hit easily hit 900lbs by the end of this year. By powerlifting standards I am weak off of the floor, but in the standing position I'm a monster at 180lbs. Also that is something else, being sub-200lbs I have to produce more tension than some 300lbs monster... but we have to produce a similar level of tension in a top end rack pull.

 

That's ridiculous. What kind of rack pull are you doing? Is it the stand relatively straight and use every muscle in your body to hoist the weight version, or is it the second stage deadlift version? Either way it is cool. I am asking because, I am using the second stage of the deadlift version (which has a higher trade off to the deadlift) and just barely got 500 lbs with straps. I last time I did a full deadlift I did 445 with a mixed grip, and then switch hands to do it again. I can basically deficit pull what I can deadlift. What that means to you and everyone else is that my legs are really strong in comparison to my upper back.

 

My brother is 190 lbs, and specializes in olympic lifting and powerlifting. On Tuesday, I watched him deadlift 495 lbs for six reps with no belt (he uses a hook grip). He ripped the bar from the floor like he was going to hurl it at me. Like I mentioned earlier, that kind of strength comes from the glutes, hamstrings, and quads. The evidence for that comes from his other lifts: with low-bar squats 455 lbs, paused front squats with 315 lbs, glute bridges with 635 lbs, and regular deficit deadlift training (I have recently seen him lift 415 which is the most I have ever deficit pulled).

 

I am not trying to give you advice so much as I am very curious about how you train--I noticed in your earlier post that most of your goals invovled your upper body. Do you focus on your lower body at all, and if so, where are those lifts? 

 

 

The 750lbs rack pull was a very short ROM like less than 5 inches[pin 4 on my power rack] and I used straps, but I'm not considering it a hand and thigh lift because I actually consciously replicated the deadlift pattern rather than a squatting pattern. I'm assuming by 2nd stage deadlift that you mean just below the knees? I am pulling 400lbs at that height for a max and increasing the distance by 1/2" or so whenever I feel that I have converted the max at the height to base strength. My bodyweight floats between 170lbs-180lbs and I don't really care about putting on anymore weight on for many reasons.

 

It was interesting that you said that your legs were stronger that your back... which angle, position of leverage, movement pattern, type of movement[speed, iso, quasi-iso, max effort], which variation? It's just never made sense to me when people say one muscle group is stronger than another as a blanket statement. My legs are stronger than my traps and upper back in the top end rack pull, but basically anything that my legs can withstand in the stretched positions are generally easy for my back. I have very strong legs in a short ROM, much like a draft horse.

 

In the past I haven't really focused too much on building power in my legs in the stretched position because I wanted to be unreasonably strong in the standing position but that's beginning to change. I greco-roman style wrestled [no leg hooks, no leverage based throwing techniques] a friend that is 50lbs-60lbs heavier than I am and man-handled him so I decided that it was time to begin more full range as my original goal has been met. I've more recently began A2G squatting but my numbers are less than impressive... I hit 100% 1RM at a whopping weight in the sub-200lbs [190lbs I think???], which I think became more of a squatting good morning. I am also practicing partial squatting with the goal of increasing distance... I am squatting to the goal height, which is roped off with a bungee cord, pausing 5s-15s at that height, standing back up and racking it. I believe that the combination of squatting with a full rom and squatting a partial supramaximal load with the goal of increasing the distance will be highly effective in translating my short range strength into a longer range strength.

 

Amongst the full ROM squatting and partial squatting, in the past I've done quite a bit of conditioning work for my legs involving various BW squatting. As far as strength training for legs in the stretched position the answer is no, hence my low numbers on the barbell squat.

 

My strength training can be summed up as;

1) Top end rack work

2) Partials with the goal of making the weight at a longer distance

3) Full Rom work

4) Limited assitance work
5) Prehab and Conditioning

 

If i can ask what is the purpose of doing this kind of rack pulls?are you training to increase your deadlift or to get a pr in this king of rack pull?

 

 

I intentionally setup my training like this and spent a year on high end rack pulls for multiple reasons;

 

1) to be unreasonably strong in the standing position

 

2) to lay a foundation for future training. This allowed for three things; 1. more or less becoming impervous to tendonitis at least for a few years, 2. so full rom would not be very systemically shocking when I chose to do the switch, 3. because of 1 and 2 + a decent level of conditioning I am now able to train high volume, high intensity, high frequency with no permanent negative effect to my body

 

note: if I feel beat up then I deload and I play that by ear but is generally a one week deload every 2-6 weeks [depending on stress levels from outside factors], but in the past I have generally deloaded every 4th week by dropping all heavy lifting.



#50 OFFLINE   hellswindstaff

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 11:43 AM

 

30-50 circa max singles per week Ass to Grass 20-30 circa max singles x partial squats to goal height with a 5-15 second pause 50-100 belt squats in the 5-15 rep range 100-200 BW squats after every squatting session

 

That seems like a ton of work.  And that's coming from someone who would regularly DL 20,000# + in half an hour.  If I may ask, have you seen your squat max go up, and if so by how much? 

 

 

Just to be clear everything was meant to be NUMBER OF LIFTS PER WEEK, not number of lifts per session, unless stated otherwise [ei: BW squats]

 

Even with the clarification that I made, I would be lying if I said that it wasn't a lot of work... it is considering I'm doing the same for overhead press and grippers... and deadlifting off of boxes with significantly lower volume on top of it. I generally perform the movements in a psuedo-circuit and barely take any rest, because for me they do not interfere with one another too much but if they begin to then I either end the session or break until I'm ready or even break the session up into multiple sessions per day.

 

My squat A2G max has gone up from roughly 130lbs to 185(ish)lbs in a month... I suspect that it is higher now because that was at the end of my "cycle" and I'm making the wild assumption that there was supercompensation that went on in that period. I have not nor will I have the chance to make it back to the gym before finals which are the week after next because, I am going to conservatively state, that be studying 70hrs/week and do not want to take the chance of being in a mental fog during those exams. I realize that these rapid gains were due to it being a new movement for me, but I do think that I will be in the 300lbs-350lbs range by the end of the year... I'm setting the annual goal of 350lbs to parallel which I do not think will be an issue, but suspect that I can hit that A2G style by December.



#51 OFFLINE   hellswindstaff

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 11:46 AM

 

To everyone working on a squat goal, what is the plan of attack?

 

I have a main squat day every other week. I rotate between 5x5, 5x3, 5x1. Then follow up with sumo and lunges and then some accessory work.

I also squat every Sunday for like 3x10. I usually try to work on form issues and get some volume this day.

 

I always need more ideas of things to try. How are you planning to reach your goal?

What is your goal, and what kind of squat are you doing? If you say back squat, please specify highbar or lowbar. Where are your other lower body lifts (see # 36 for ideas).

 

 

I'm squatting high bar... I dont find low bar comfortable. Can you tell me specifically which lowr body lifts you are refering to? I have been studying since 9am, took a break at 1:30p and told my study partner to meet back up at 2:30pm but it's currently 2:45pm.



#52 OFFLINE   hellswindstaff

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 11:48 AM

I dont remember who this was in reply to but I looked up this quote as a reply:

 Lord Naoshige said, "The Way of the Samurai is in desperateness. Ten
 men or more cannot kill such a man. Common sense will not accomplish
 great things. Simply become insane and desperate"        -- Hagakure


#53 OFFLINE   wulfgeat

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 02:34 PM

 

 

To everyone working on a squat goal, what is the plan of attack?

 

I have a main squat day every other week. I rotate between 5x5, 5x3, 5x1. Then follow up with sumo and lunges and then some accessory work.

I also squat every Sunday for like 3x10. I usually try to work on form issues and get some volume this day.

 

I always need more ideas of things to try. How are you planning to reach your goal?

What is your goal, and what kind of squat are you doing? If you say back squat, please specify highbar or lowbar. Where are your other lower body lifts (see # 36 for ideas).

 

 

I'm squatting high bar... I dont find low bar comfortable. Can you tell me specifically which lowr body lifts you are refering to? I have been studying since 9am, took a break at 1:30p and told my study partner to meet back up at 2:30pm but it's currently 2:45pm.

 

Good luck with finals man!!! Actually, I was aiming that question at JHenze646; I already know what you are doing :). I don't however, mind elaborating. So I am asking where is your deadlft? Do you do conventional too? ? Do you do front squats, cleans, or snatches? Have you ever done snatch grip deadlifts? Where is your jefferson deadlift? Hack lift? Do you do one hand deadlifts? And if so, is the bar in front (like a regular deadlift), inbetween the legs (like a jefferson), or to the side (suitcase)? Do you do hip thrusts or glutebridges? Do you exercise with iron boots? Do you do anything like a hip lift, harness lift, back lift, or hand and thigh lift? Do you train your core, or do rows? Anything along those lines. I am asking because knowing what kind of squat you do, and where you are on your other lower body lifts helps me be more specific with my suggestions.

 

The main thing I would recommend for you is that you get started on either the glute bridge or the hip thrust. When you get to 500 lbs on that you will notice a stark improvement in your squats and deadlifts.



#54 OFFLINE   JHenze646

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 02:58 PM

What is your goal, and what kind of squat are you doing? If you say back squat, please specify highbar or lowbar. Where are your other lower body lifts (see # 36 for ideas).
I place the bar where I can get tightest around it. I am guessing it would be considered highbar. I pull conventional <500. Front squats around 280. No snatch, snatch grip, jeffersons, hacks, hip, hand & thigh lifts. 1-hand deads I do to the front. I do carries. Does that count as core work? -humor

#55 OFFLINE   wulfgeat

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Posted 24 April 2014 - 03:06 PM

 

What is your goal, and what kind of squat are you doing? If you say back squat, please specify highbar or lowbar. Where are your other lower body lifts (see # 36 for ideas).
I place the bar where I can get tightest around it. I am guessing it would be considered highbar. I pull conventional <500. Front squats around 280. No snatch, snatch grip, jeffersons, hacks, hip, hand & thigh lifts. 1-hand deads I do to the front. I do carries. Does that count as core work? -humor

 

A high bar squat is where you place the barbell on the upper trap and go down in a semi-upright postion. It is the back squat version which is most similar to a front-squat and is more conducive to doing full squats (as are front squats). The low-bar squat sets the barbell no higher than the back delt, and often as low as the middle/lower part of the scapula. It combines the hip hinge of the deadlift with the knee press of the squat--practically though, it looks like a squat-morning with one heck of knee drive. Most people end up doing the highbar squat because that is the only version they know--and, it dosen't require wrist straps. So if you think you are doing Highbar, you probably are--powerlifters like my brother are the only people who seem to make time to master the low-bar :).

 

That being said, the most important factors in a highbar squat are ankle flexibility, hip extensor and external rotation strength, hip adductor strength, core strength, and lat strength. Knee extensor strength is important too, it just becomes less important when the hip extensors, adductors, and external rotators pick up their slack.

 

I think what might be most beneficia is for you to determine where you are weakest. An idiotically simple way to test your ankle flexibility, hip extensor, hip adductor, and  hip external rotation strength is to set your high bar squat and then go down to full squat position and pause. I have short femurs and and short torso (classic squat build) so this is no problem for me. When I get there, my thighs touch my calves and I swing my knees so that they are directly over my pinkie toes. Doing this takes almost all the pressure off my knees (I literally don't even feel a stretch), and insures that it is my glutes that drive me out of the hole. If you have never tried that, start with the barbell, and prepare to fall.

 

That however is only one part of the lift. Once you get out of the hole, you need a great deal of lat strength in order to equalize the glute extension and continue the drive upward. I could obviously talk about many other muscles involved in this process (such as the obliques and hip flexors) but I have hit the points that I wanted to.

 

If you determine that you are weak on the initial drive than you need to work your legs and hips. If you determine that you are weak on the lockout (starting inbetween parallel and 1/4 squat postion) then you need to aquire more lat strength.

 

If determine that you need to train your lower extremities, do paused highbar squats for about 1-3 seconds (with a spotter and safety bars). That is the simplest thing. After that, glute bridges and hip thrusts are one of the best ways to improve glute strength. Jefferson deadlifts are one of the best ways to build hip adductor strength and oblique strength, and you don't even have to do them from the floor; I am doing them as a rack pull (i can't be moving the bar more than six inches) and I am noticing substantial improvements in those two areas. Other things you could try are deficit deadlifts, or snatch grip deadlifts from the floor (because of the wider grip, it functions like a deficit deadlift). To speak on what you have already mentioned, I think sumo deadlifts (and other wide stance lifts) are a great way to build adductor strength, I just don't think it transfers as well to an activity (like highbar squat) where the stance is not quite so wide.

 

If you determine that you need more lat strength then I recommend Rack pulls from just below the knees and then snatch grip rack pulls from around there too. Jeffersons can be thrown in first to ensure that the core is warmed up (I am doing Jefferson rack pulls from both sides, then conventional rack pulls, and then snatch grip pulls and I feel like that is working).

 

I hope that the above is helpful, or at the very least, gives you some ideas.



#56 OFFLINE   ImpGrip

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 01:40 PM

i would like to double overhand 405 deadlift