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Knurled Handle Baseline Possibility


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#1 OFFLINE   Mighty Joe

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Posted 18 May 2013 - 02:12 PM

Just a quick note here for those interested in hand grip dynomometers.

 

I've been speaking with a design engineer with Baseline and suggesting very strongly

to design a new model with lightly knurled handles and name it something along the

lines as Athletic Model or Competitive Pro Model maybe.

 

My reasoning is that most all if not all dynomometers are design for medical testing and fitness evaluation

for the average person. Now that Grip is a fast growing sport with more and more interest by the day it

would be nice to have a competitive model for contests and to better help one's progress with gripper closes.

Not to mention it's a very accurate way to quantify various aspects of one's grip strength.

 

I hope my suggestions get heard by the right ears at Baseline. All their current units have adjustable ROM

in the front handle for different ROM's to practice with or to maybe help get past a certain spot in a particular

ROM with a gripper. One of the main reasons I believe that you don't get comparable readings along the same

lines as TSG's is because one of those factors is the slick handles. Another factor is non-movement versus movement

and inline versus angled closes and linear versus non-linear ROM's. If enough data is gathered one would start to see a correlation maybe between the two. For example, if I'm closing a gripper from parallel that's rated at #120 my reading on the Baseline will be within 20-30 lbs. high of the rated TSG. It seems the stronger one is such as Paul Knight (269lbs. with a fried grip after a grip contest and 3 different certs.) the numbers even vary more.

 

I will keep you updated if this progresses any further.

 

Any suggestions or input maybe?

 

Thanks for everyone's time!


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#2 OFFLINE   Mephistopholes

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Posted 18 May 2013 - 02:23 PM

Interesting idea!

#3 ONLINE   EricMilfeld

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Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:18 PM

I really like this idea.  I think they have potential in a contest situation, but as we've discussed before, Joe, I'm concerned about the occasional "fluke" reading some of us will get.  

 

I was using Joe's one time and pegged it, or very nearly, with no shaking or jerking of the dynamometer.  Wasn't I getting readings in the low 200s just before that, Joe?  If it's just a matter of hitting that sweet spot, then perhaps fine, but if it's something else...



#4 OFFLINE   Mighty Joe

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Posted 19 May 2013 - 03:22 PM

I really like this idea.  I think they have potential in a contest situation, but as we've discussed before, Joe, I'm concerned about the occasional "fluke" reading some of us will get.  

 

I was using Joe's one time and pegged it, or very nearly, with no shaking or jerking of the dynamometer.  Wasn't I getting readings in the low 200s just before that, Joe?  If it's just a matter of hitting that sweet spot, then perhaps fine, but if it's something else...

Eric, you are correct on the fluke readings and till this day I haven't heard an explanation from

Baseline except that if one squeezes a given number it is indeed accurate and that they had all

the conditions just right to hit that number. I don't buy this but this is what I was told. 

 

Concerning it being an issue in a contest I don't see it as a problem at all because each contest would

have to do 5 attempts and those 5 readings averaged out for their score. If for example contestant A

squeezed 140, 139, 143, 145 and then all the sudden he pegs the meter he would then be allowed yet another

attempt because it's obvious he's not consistently capable of that kind of horsepower. This is exactly why doctors that use

these type meters have you squeeze it 3-5 times to get an average. I had a girl just today get a phantom reading of 191 lbs.

but prior to that she was consistently squeezing around 100 lbs. it's not about a "one time" max effort. it's what you can consistently

squeeze on average. The one with the highest average wins! Quite simple in my estimation.



#5 OFFLINE   mudhutmasher

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 05:18 PM

THIS IS WHERE MY LAST POST WAS THAT I HAD REMOVED BECAUSE IT MADE NO SENSE.


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#6 OFFLINE   Mighty Joe

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 06:30 PM

Okay! Good news here guys!

 

The engineer I talked with gave me a phone number to one of the techs that make and troubleshoot 

these type dynamometers and after explaining to him how we were using the device he quickly figured

out what the problem was.

 

We was creating the phantom readings ourselves by the way we were using the dyno! There's 2 components to

getting an accurate reading within the dyno itself 1) hydraulic component 2) spring component.

 

When you exert a for force against the handle it forces hydraulic fluid against a plunger that operates a spring.

The way I've been allowing others to use my dyno has caused the false readings. What's happens is when you

swing the dyno down swiftly to really generate some power and whole body tension you are inadvertently causing

the spring to move forward by centrifugal  force and it adds to the reading. the spring component is very sensitive

and unless there's a leak it's spring component that has to be tested for calibration certification. It instantly made

sense when he explained this to me. he suggested a few simple tests when i get home to experience what he described and sure enough he was correct!

 

This is precisely why one should follow instructions to the letter with these precise instruments. he went on to say that

this is why in the medical profession they have the patient seated with their arm rested on a table or arm chair at 90 degrees and then without raising their forearm squeeze with as much force as possible. They go on to do this 3 to 5 times (not because of phantom readings) and then average out your grip strength.

 

This particular tech thought the knurled handle version to be a brilliant idea for sport models or competitive models

in the context of how I explained it to him.

 

Now let's hope the idea gets approval through the proper channels!

 

Hope this clears up a huge ? with these dynamometers. It did for me!

 

Now! I can't wait to have this an event as I had planned in my Texas Strongest Grip Challenge on October 5th!!!

 

Thanks for your time guys!!!

 

 



#7 ONLINE   EricMilfeld

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 07:38 PM

I'd really like to see this work in a contest setting.  It could solve a lot gripper related issues, not that the coolness of grippers could ever be replaced.  Joe and I talked at length about it today, and I know he will be doing some further experimentation with his.



#8 ONLINE   EricMilfeld

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 11:39 PM

Joe, could you please inquire if the 300 pound Baseline digital display model is immune to the effects of shaking and jerking of the device.  If so, it might be worth the extra money.  Also, I noticed they offer a deluxe model now in the 200 pound version with tougher, more reliable internal parts, which comes with a 5 year warranty.  So, do any of the 300 pound models come with the new and improved internal parts?  I'm anxious to buy one of these now.



#9 OFFLINE   Gapoz

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Posted 21 May 2013 - 10:43 PM

would be great a standard grip tester, that everybody in the grip sport will use! 

 

by the way anybody knows what is the current record for squeezing the baseline. There are a few videos on youtube, one from carlos pako who gets pretty far! 



#10 OFFLINE   Mighty Joe

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 04:33 AM

would be great a standard grip tester, that everybody in the grip sport will use! 

 

by the way anybody knows what is the current record for squeezing the baseline. There are a few videos on youtube, one from carlos pako who gets pretty far! 

If you're talking about performed correctly I don't know even after testing hundreds of people because I was allowing them to do it

incorrectly. With that being said, the highest I personally tested was Paul Knight after a grip contest and he squeezed 269 lbs.

 

There was a member here that didn't last long at all that from what I could tell basically pegged the meter right at 300 lbs. and

from what I know now he seemed legit even though he was trouble here on the GB.



Joe, could you please inquire if the 300 pound Baseline digital display model is immune to the effects of shaking and jerking of the device.  If so, it might be worth the extra money.  Also, I noticed they offer a deluxe model now in the 200 pound version with tougher, more reliable internal parts, which comes with a 5 year warranty.  So, do any of the 300 pound models come with the new and improved internal parts?  I'm anxious to buy one of these now.

I'm checking into this Eric! Seems that the digital version may eliminate the spring component but I'm simply guessing.



#11 OFFLINE   Gapoz

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 12:06 PM

269 and 300! da*n!  Are there any videos of that around?  

 

I really hope the  Baseline company will answer soon about the new device!



#12 ONLINE   EricMilfeld

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 02:02 AM

Joe, could you please inquire if the 300 pound Baseline digital display model is immune to the effects of shaking and jerking of the device.  If so, it might be worth the extra money.  Also, I noticed they offer a deluxe model now in the 200 pound version with tougher, more reliable internal parts, which comes with a 5 year warranty.  So, do any of the 300 pound models come with the new and improved internal parts?  I'm anxious to buy one of these now.

Update: Joe heard back from Baseline, who confirmed that the digital models do, in fact, have the updated heavy duty internal parts and are immune to the effects of shaking with regards to acquiring accurate readings.  So, although it's not cheap at over $500, it would make for an accurate and easy means of testing crush at a contest.



#13 OFFLINE   Mighty Joe

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 05:04 AM

 

Joe, could you please inquire if the 300 pound Baseline digital display model is immune to the effects of shaking and jerking of the device.  If so, it might be worth the extra money.  Also, I noticed they offer a deluxe model now in the 200 pound version with tougher, more reliable internal parts, which comes with a 5 year warranty.  So, do any of the 300 pound models come with the new and improved internal parts?  I'm anxious to buy one of these now.

Update: Joe heard back from Baseline, who confirmed that the digital models do, in fact, have the updated heavy duty internal parts and are immune to the effects of shaking with regards to acquiring accurate readings.  So, although it's not cheap at over $500, it would make for an accurate and easy means of testing crush at a contest.

 

True! I apologize for the delay in answering this question. I heard back from the engineer last week but I was simply too busy to post

anything.

 

BTW, to know if you have an updated and heavy duty version (internal parts) the last 4 digits should be above 1000. Some of the dyno's do not have a serial # on the unit but they have a serial # with the paperwork. Even easier is to order one that is advertised as the heavy duty version.

 

I got mine from Wisdom King and I'm planning on getting the digital version this year!

 

Hope this helps and thanks to Eric for updating this news!



#14 OFFLINE   Gapoz

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Posted 03 August 2013 - 03:58 AM

Any news about the new grip tester / baseline ??



#15 OFFLINE   Mighty Joe

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Posted 04 August 2013 - 06:00 AM

Any news about the new grip tester / baseline ??

No. I have not heard back from neither of my contacts on a possible knurled handle version Baseline.

 

As soon as I do I will post it here. I may send them a follow up e-mail just to see if they've considered

any changes.

 

Thanks for asking!



#16 OFFLINE   Gapoz

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 02:20 AM

yes I guess in these kind of cases, chasing a bit would be the best, otherwise it could take easily a year or something or might be forgotten forever.  by the way was there ever something like a Baseline challenge already on GB? 




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