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David Horne Is In The Grip Well!


Bill Piche

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Anthony,

Hey no problems. Just surprised how many questions - haha

Anyway good question.

I suppose there are a few of us out there who have trained grip for a long time. But of course there are also many manual workers who trained 'grip' for their whole working career. Some people will get arthritis, and others won't.

I seem to be absolutely fine, and if it wasn't for my elbow I would be all good. I actually keep good care of my hands, massaging them at night, and keeping the skin perfect. I've ben told that I have youthful looking hands, and so maybe this answers your question.

As I say, if something hurts 'you' bad then drop it. There are a million exercises out there.

My elbow causes some exercises to be problematic, so I don't do them anymore.

David,

Thank you for doing this. Moreso than anything, i'm focused on training for longevity. I am concerned about the effects grip training can have on the hands over the long term. How have you been able to avoid conditions like arthritis as you continue to train hard into your fifties? Are there any particularly harsh grip activities which you feel can cause more harm than good to the body over the long term?

Thank you,

Anthony

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Peter,

I am nearly finishing the next volume in the next few weeks, which may I say is one of my best writings ever I think.

Anyway I hope to be all done by the end of 2014, and then I shall never write again. It has been a monumental task!

David!

When will your grip encyklopedia go to print? I really want a hard copy!

/ Peter Hellman Sweden

Woohoo, I'm up to date!

HAHA

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I've been looking forward to it since you first told us that you were wrighting it! I love reading about grip and I love tutorials and instructional DVDs on the subject.

I will definitly buy it and have it as my bible by my bed :)

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Hi David,

Curious about your thoughts on grip training specifically done to augment armwrestling training? What have you found works/doesn't work well for you? How would you adjust volume or intensity of the grip training based on table time? What are your thoughts on using straight weight vs. bands? I'm asking as a total novice in AW.

Thanks for your time.

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It will be Bible sized!

I'd expect the finished book to be around 500 pages.

I hope to get it done as a hardback, with nice paper.

It will be a one print go, so I will get payments in before, and then pay the publisher. The books will arrive here, from where I will send them out, autographed if someone wants that done. Once they are all gone that's it, and I will have one copy like the other people.

I've been looking forward to it since you first told us that you were wrighting it! I love reading about grip and I love tutorials and instructional DVDs on the subject.

I will definitly buy it and have it as my bible by my bed :)

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KRC, what's your name. I like to talk to people as real individuals. Old school - haha

Anyway, most important is for to get to a club to learn the basics, and safety!

That aside, something's that can help you is wrist strength, best done for the time being with some kind of wrist curl. Work hard on lots of volume, because you need prolonged strength in A/W.

Take it from me, I have been in a match where the set-up alone has taken near 5 mins, and the pump is incredible, and we haven't even started to A/W. Also in the Arm Wars televised series which I have done three so far, your Supermatch is 6 matches, with a minute rest between each match. It's tough, but I love them, as I have good endurance.

So workload is key.

Fingertip 'cupping' strength will be useful, so thumbless thick bar Deadlifts and holds.

Finally a bicep lock is also a must. Better than weights and bands are the Lock & Load exercises I designed. Easy to replicate. Here's a video:

Hi David,

Curious about your thoughts on grip training specifically done to augment armwrestling training? What have you found works/doesn't work well for you? How would you adjust volume or intensity of the grip training based on table time? What are your thoughts on using straight weight vs. bands? I'm asking as a total novice in AW.

Thanks for your time.

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And lucky for Kevin he gets to train with one of the best teams in the world! :)

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Hi David,

Me again.lol

Beings you are one of the best reverse benders there is I have to ask a reverse question.

I have been stuck at gr8's in imp's for some time.

All my attempts with them land around 30°,not being able to finish the last 8-10°…

What do you believe is needing to be addressed to get that last little bit...

Thanks again for your time.

Also can't wait for the new book,I definitely want one!

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Guest Squat More

Hello David

Jon Umpherville here.

Had two questions I would like to ask.

1. How would you advise someone new to europinch/2hp training but not pinch training itself to approach things, specific to the device. Would you advice working off percentages, going by feel, light days, heavy days, frequency, volume, always train at competition width or change things up, always straight pulls or holds for time etc. I am not asking for a program perse but how you feel beginners with decent starting numbers (I had 85kg with your webbing protectors on and 40.25kg one hand on my first session) would get the best advance on the implement.

2. What would your best advice be on training to lift the inch dumbbell for someone with 7.5" hands I.E. not a large handed individual (myself). I have your adjustable thickbar after suggestions from Juha on its ability to greatly strengthen the fingers for inch lifting. Do you think this is the neglected aspect of training to lift the inch - everyone focuses on the thumb but not so much the fingers.

Thank you for your time, responses and for doing this. Really enjoying this thread so far, some great questions - I can already tell this is going to be the largest thread the Well has seen yet.

All the best.

EDIT: One last question - what exercises do you feel are best for thickening the wrist, I know you have said wrist work is best light but if you were forced to choose two movements to do, what would they be? I.E. Wrist curls, plate curls, levering etc.

Edited by Squat More
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And that is extremely helpful. Knowledge on the table is worth a lot. I cannot say I am technically good, because I have never trained at an A/W club in my life. I went from one session at Neil Pickup's house to the British A/W Champs. Never competed in a novice comp in any sport ever, just jumped into the deep end. It has been fun, and remember with armwrestling you learn so much by being on the table, so don't be scared of getting beaten, because you will. Lots of times. :)

And lucky for Kevin he gets to train with one of the best teams in the world! :)

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David, how advanced will the text be in the book?

Im from Sweden and I have a hard time understanding really advanced English. Univeristy level English and higher.

Do you know what the prize on the book will be?

Daniel Reinard and I was discussing grippertraining a while ago and he said that doing heavy DO deadlifting on a regular bar helped his gripper strength.

Do you agree?

I've thought about using that as an alternative to grippers every other week during a couple of months next year and see if it does help.

/ Peter Sweden

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David,

No problems mate, ask away. Then I'm gone in a week I think.

Thank you for the kind remarks about my Reverse Bending, but there are certainly a good few names I'd put above me.

It's interesting to see that you are struggling with the Grade 8 bolts.

If you don't get it right with a G8 you can feel like you have run out of room, and your fingers will be up against your thumb mound. Of course when you let go, the bolt springs back. Springy little buggers they are!

My advice would be to use the Jedd Johnson crush when you get to that position to finish, or go to 8mm steel that is similar but with less spring.

IMPs are pretty tough so you can land some force through them, whereas you can feel the bolt in our thin suede wraps we use.

Nice to hear about you wanting the book.

Hi David,

Me again.lol

Beings you are one of the best reverse benders there is I have to ask a reverse question.

I have been stuck at gr8's in imp's for some time.

All my attempts with them land around 30°,not being able to finish the last 8-10°…

What do you believe is needing to be addressed to get that last little bit...

Thanks again for your time.

Also can't wait for the new book,I definitely want one!

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Jon,

Q - How would you advise someone new to europinch/2hp training but not pinch training itself to approach things, specific to the device. Would you advice working off percentages, going by feel, light days, heavy days, frequency, volume, always train at competition width or change things up, always straight pulls or holds for time etc. I am not asking for a program perse but how you feel beginners with decent starting numbers (I had 85kg with your webbing protectors on and 40.25kg one hand on my first session) would get the best advance on the implement.

A - Don't tear your skin.

I'm never a fan of percentages, and never used them in any workout ever = reason, because I cannot know how I am going to feel in a certain time, etc. So I train on feel, and to failure. If I'm slightly off I will down the weight, or work something else. This goes for all grip stuff. Also if I am on fire I will do more that particular day.

Workload is everything!

There is a difference in One and Two hand Pinching.

There are many ways to train, and it really depends on where you are weak.

Video your pinching from the side, to see if you slip. You need to use your palm to squeeze too, not just fingers and thumb.

For the time being, do your Pinch protected (all of it), and do holds. Reps can work too, only if you keep your form. With holds you learn about fingertip pressure, and wrist.

Q - What would your best advice be on training to lift the inch dumbbell for someone with 7.5" hands I.E. not a large handed individual (myself). I have your adjustable thickbar after suggestions from Juha on its ability to greatly strengthen the fingers for inch lifting. Do you think this is the neglected aspect of training to lift the inch - everyone focuses on the thumb but not so much the fingers.

A - Yes Adjustable Thick bar. Think fingertips, and your wrist in a neutral position ie straight down from forearm to hand.

The Inch has been lifted with a Thumbless grip by a few, I'm one of those. So you can see a thumb is not needed. If you have a large hand with long fingers and thumbs then you would not want to do it thumbless.

Q - what exercises do you feel are best for thickening the wrist, I know you have said wrist work is best light but if you were forced to choose two movements to do, what would they be? I.E. Wrist curls, plate curls, levering etc.

A - Just getting heavier can thicken the wrist. But for more muscular density of the wrist, then my wrist has always been at it's thickest when I am armwrestling. The workload on the A/W table with Elizabeth and the guys has always forced it big. When I constantly train like that, it just gets thicker looking 24/7. So the answer is wrist curl, even gripper, or anything. But workload, done with little rest, and the pump is your mission.

Hello David

Jon Umpherville here.

Had two questions I would like to ask.

1. How would you advise someone new to europinch/2hp training but not pinch training itself to approach things, specific to the device. Would you advice working off percentages, going by feel, light days, heavy days, frequency, volume, always train at competition width or change things up, always straight pulls or holds for time etc. I am not asking for a program perse but how you feel beginners with decent starting numbers (I had 85kg with your webbing protectors on and 40.25kg one hand on my first session) would get the best advance on the implement.

2. What would your best advice be on training to lift the inch dumbbell for someone with 7.5" hands I.E. not a large handed individual (myself). I have your adjustable thickbar after suggestions from Juha on its ability to greatly strengthen the fingers for inch lifting. Do you think this is the neglected aspect of training to lift the inch - everyone focuses on the thumb but not so much the fingers.

Thank you for your time, responses and for doing this. Really enjoying this thread so far, some great questions - I can already tell this is going to be the largest thread the Well has seen yet.

All the best.

EDIT: One last question - what exercises do you feel are best for thickening the wrist, I know you have said wrist work is best light but if you were forced to choose two movements to do, what would they be? I.E. Wrist curls, plate curls, levering etc.

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Peter,

There are plenty of photos and diagrams too.

If you can read this forum,. you will read my book.

The price will be the cost of the PDFs and the final printing/publishing costs. It won't be a cheap book. It will be a beautiful one-off book.

Other exercises can create strength, because they actually work as an assistance exercise. But grippers are very technical, and not keeping the technique standard high is a mistake. Well certainly if your goal is grippers.

David, how advanced will the text be in the book?

Im from Sweden and I have a hard time understanding really advanced English. Univeristy level English and higher.

Do you know what the prize on the book will be?

Daniel Reinard and I was discussing grippertraining a while ago and he said that doing heavy DO deadlifting on a regular bar helped his gripper strength.

Do you agree?

I've thought about using that as an alternative to grippers every other week during a couple of months next year and see if it does help.

/ Peter Sweden

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No questions at the moment, but reading with interest.

The Grip Well is an excellent idea!

Cheers David,

Bob van Genugten

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David, I don't know where to start to thank you for providing the outstanding feats, wealth of information ,and dedication to purpose in training and grip for so many years.I was going to ask you personal 5 best feats of grip strength but you seemed to have explained that. If you were only able do any one thing for grip what would it be? And why?

I still remember our first conversation over 20 years ago and treasure and keep close by the Whalebone gripper you made and sent to me. Your efforts to support and promote grip have been tremendous. My most sincere and deep respect to you for these many years of excellence in character and strength. Richard

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Hi David. Thanks for doing this. I have much respect for you..

I have a Blob50 that I cannot lift. And I live in an apartment on the fourth floor. I could train with it, in the apartment (without noise for neighbors) doing holds and weighted holds. You seem to be a fan of holds, from reading some of your answers here. Do you think that I from that limited kind of specific training with it, could reach the level of lifting it? Or would I be wasting my time. I have the option to train less frequently on it, at another place then home.

Again, Thanks

Tobias Johansson (Sweden)

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I updated my first post with David's bio. :)

Thanks goes to Josh Henze for suggesting it.

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Mr. Horne,

Thank you for taking the time to be in the well. This is a very exciting thread and will probably be reread several times.

Was there an evolution to your training principles over time as progress was made i.e. from beginner to intermediate to advanced, different areas of focus for each new level?

Is there an aspect of hand strength that is hard to contest? I have worked many blue collar jobs and have been impressed with many a man's strength but also the easy and dexterity at which they express it.

You have recommended "holds, holds, and holds", would this be holds specific to the requirements of the event/feat or submaximal(weight) holds for time/to failure?

Thank you for all you have done,

Joshua

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Richard,

Many thanks for your kind comments. Honestly I really appreciate them.

I'm glad you still like the gripper, and 20 years later we are still heavily involved in the sport of grip - producing equipment and running contests.

In 1991 I heard about you in a letter from my friend Frank Ciavattone, and a year later I read about you in an article penned by Randy Strossen, and featured in Iron Man magazine. It was great to see that I wasn't the only one!

Later Milo featured an article on me in the April, 1994 issue, and from this exposure you wrote to me and we have been friends ever since.

Many thanks for that!

Now your question.

Q - If you were only able do any one thing for grip what would it be? And why?

A - Actually this is quite easy to answer, as it is something I am trying to do at this moment. It's to bring the sport, in its easiest and quickest format to the people in the street, to the manual workers out there, who in amongst them we will definitely find some Grip 'Giants'!

David, I don't know where to start to thank you for providing the outstanding feats, wealth of information ,and dedication to purpose in training and grip for so many years.I was going to ask you personal 5 best feats of grip strength but you seemed to have explained that. If you were only able do any one thing for grip what would it be? And why?

I still remember our first conversation over 20 years ago and treasure and keep close by the Whalebone gripper you made and sent to me. Your efforts to support and promote grip have been tremendous. My most sincere and deep respect to you for these many years of excellence in character and strength. Richard

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Tobias,

I have a large section on this in the Gripopaedia book Vol 2.

I'll try and give you some quick pointers here.

If your hand size is an issue, go to three fingers only, putting the Index finger on top of the Blob. Although you will lose one finger's strength you will gain some extra hand span.

If you just are not strong enough you need to build strength, so lower the resistance on the Blob. Before we go to de-loading, start with dragging. In fact dragging is all that is usually needed. Get a short piece of board, with a Formica (slippy top). This is excellent. Put it against something, the more abrupt the angle the harder it is. Start to slide the Blob up, and eventually you will lift it off. I thought of this method many years ago, and it has helped many people.

Finally make sure your hands are warm, and chalked properly.

Yes Holds are great; but right now you need to build confidence on the Blob.

Hi David. Thanks for doing this. I have much respect for you..

I have a Blob50 that I cannot lift. And I live in an apartment on the fourth floor. I could train with it, in the apartment (without noise for neighbors) doing holds and weighted holds. You seem to be a fan of holds, from reading some of your answers here. Do you think that I from that limited kind of specific training with it, could reach the level of lifting it? Or would I be wasting my time. I have the option to train less frequently on it, at another place then home.

Again, Thanks

Tobias Johansson (Sweden)

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Joshua,

Glad to help, and hope people are enjoying it.

Q - Was there an evolution to your training principles over time as progress was made i.e. from beginner to intermediate to advanced, different areas of focus for each new level?

A - Yes there have been many actually, and probably quite a few coincide with learning new skills.

My first exposure to 'grip' I suppose came when I was 17. I was given a 6" nail to have a try at bending, as the two guys (one a novice bodybuilder competitor) couldn't bend it. I bent it easily and got back on with my work of knocking posts in the ground.

The first major change in my grip training thoughts was in 1993 in the run up to the 1994 British Grip Champs. Prior to this I had done a lot of strength sports since 1986. http://www.davidhorne-gripmaster.com/contests86on.html

After the defeat in 1993 I realised that I actually needed to train for the grip contest, and not just arrive with the untrained strength I already had. So I worked incredibly hard that year, and never looked back.

More recently was my work with grippers in the 2010 period, where I realised I had to learn to set a gripper properly. This pushed my grippers up a lot more.

Q - Is there an aspect of hand strength that is hard to contest? I have worked many blue collar jobs and have been impressed with many a man's strength but also the easy and dexterity at which they express it.

A - A contest event has to try and task the areas you want it to test. It has to be safe, available for people to purchase the item and easy to referee. I'd guess wrist events can be the hardest to design successfully.

Q - You have recommended "holds, holds, and holds", would this be holds specific to the requirements of the event/feat or submaximal(weight) holds for time/to failure?

A - All training is to failure. The holds with the same apparatus get you mentally confident, but possibly more important is the ability for you and your brain to fathom out how to hold this thing harder and better. People sometimes realise where they have to apply the pressure in a hold, whereas with a lift they cannot. Fingertips for example.

Mr. Horne,

Thank you for taking the time to be in the well. This is a very exciting thread and will probably be reread several times.

Was there an evolution to your training principles over time as progress was made i.e. from beginner to intermediate to advanced, different areas of focus for each new level?

Is there an aspect of hand strength that is hard to contest? I have worked many blue collar jobs and have been impressed with many a man's strength but also the easy and dexterity at which they express it.

You have recommended "holds, holds, and holds", would this be holds specific to the requirements of the event/feat or submaximal(weight) holds for time/to failure?

Thank you for all you have done,

Joshua

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David,

Thanks for your replies. Think I'll cut the finger lifting out...

So on this recommendation of "holds, holds, holds"...

1) do you think it's more productive to just do a static hold, or to carry the implement until you drop it, with the weight shifting and pulling against your hand?

Bobby

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