2016 - 2017 North American Season

[EJ Livesey]

41 minutes ago, climber511 said:

Here’s something to think about.  There has been some pretty good ideas put forth.  I think “YOU” (a generic term here) should step up and make some of them happen.  A Grip Booth at the Arnold or Fit Expo is a tremendous idea – YOU should rent the booth space out of your pocket – have some informational flyers printed up to hand out and take all the items in to represent Grip Sport - man the booth for 3 days and have a blast.  If you don’t have the equipment – do what everyone has done, buy them or make them.  STEP UP.  I just read over the NAGS regulations – no where in them does it say YOU can’t do this.  No where does it say YOU can’t step up and hold a contest – promote it with the events you choose - spread the word however you see fit to do so – STEP UP.  Multi Site Regionals – STEP UP and say you’ll have one.  Qualifiers too heavy – STEP UP and get stronger.   STEP UP.   Don't just type on the  keyboard - Get Involved and actually do something that will solve "one" of the problems discussed.

 

I will always think Nationals should be at one venue - anything else can be as scattered as people want - but that's like the Olympics to me - everyone same time - same day - same equipment - it's the right way to do things "in my mind."  If others disagree, that's fine, but I get an opinion too. 

I have heard various figures quoted for a venue (room) at the Arnold - someone better have some very deep pockets to rent a room there.  Even a booth space there can set you back thousands.

I like this idea a lot. I'd actually be willing to throw some money toward this, to help make it happen. I'm sure a collection or "fund me" type deal might do very well to make this happen. 

Booth pricing for the Arnold

http://arnoldsportsfestival.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/2017-Sponsorship-Pricing-Per-Booth-Sheet1.pdf

Edited May 27, 2016 by EJ Livesey

[Mikael Siversson]

I think Chris' competition (Gripmas) is one of the most popular amongst grip athletes and my top choice if I ever get an opportunity to compete in the US. The current and past people voted in into the NAGS have all shown long term commitment to the sport and have all stepped up and organised grip competitions for years. Of course they will have a major say on how things are run and thank God for that.

 

Personally I want to see how I compare against others with a similar desire to take their hand strength potential to the limit. In order to do so meaningfully I pushed hard for standardisation of events, 'calibrated' weights etc. (and got ridiculed endlessly in the process for years). Now we are at a point where records are broken on a regular basis and the standard keeps rising. There will always be angry 'background noise' that come and go but I do hope the NAGS committee is not distracted by it but continues doing a great but often unappreciated job.

Edited May 27, 2016 by Mikael Siversson

[climber511]

8 hours ago, Tommy J. said:

While i am normally super sarcastic, this post is me being 100% serious.

 

Chris, so what your saying is that you are speaking for NAGS and NAGS is not going to consider trying any of what i or anyone else has suggested? And that if i, or anyone would like to see any of that happen, then i/we need to act as an independant (as in- not NAGS) and make that happen myself/ourselves?

I fully understand your stance now Chris. It is more apparent than ever that you WANT this sport to remain in your backyard. And that you do NOT want it to grow into something bigger than what it currently is.

My next few words are last of what i have to contribute to NAGS, and then im out of here permanently. Tired of wasting broadband for nothing.

Just keep on doing what you are doing Chris. And who ever else is of his same opinion. Things are right where they belong.

 

#1 - I do NOT speak for NAGS.

#2 - I sometimes wonder if you and I are even speaking the same language.

#3 - You do not understand me at all

#4 - What I (as me not as NAGS at all) am saying is that if people want things done then they need to step up and actually do something besides criticize others.   I've read every post in the several threads about what you and others think needs changed and done.  Who do you expect to do all these things?  The guys who make up the NAGS committee?  We're supposed to do booths at the Arnold and Fit Expo - run all these Regional and National contests all over the country - and on and on.  There are discussions taking place already on some of the ideas that have been put forth - what exactly do you expect?  We're supposed to make changes to the decisions we spent months setting up and do this in real time as people type them up on the GB?  Tommy - take on any one of the ideas yourself and make it happen - not me - not NAGS - YOU. 

[KapMan]

I feel like I just got (bad word filter)ing ignored. I'm the one that suggested the Arnold Booth and mini show. I suggested as a community WE (as in everyone who chooses to) should put money in a pot to get the ball rolling. I don't have deep pockets, nor the means to make my own gear. Takes a tribe folks not one person. in order to make this grow we all need to step up.

[KapMan]

9 hours ago, EJ Livesey said:

I like this idea a lot. I'd actually be willing to throw some money toward this, to help make it happen. I'm sure a collection or "fund me" type deal might do very well to make this happen. 

Booth pricing for the Arnold

http://arnoldsportsfestival.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/2017-Sponsorship-Pricing-Per-Booth-Sheet1.pdf

10x20 non sponsor seems bigger enough and affordable enough to try. Even a 10x30 should be more then enough to accomplish the objective, thanks for getting this sheet.

[climber511]

12 minutes ago, KapMan said:

I feel like I just got (bad word filter)ing ignored. I'm the one that suggested the Arnold Booth and mini show. I suggested as a community WE (as in everyone who chooses to) should put money in a pot to get the ball rolling. I don't have deep pockets, nor the means to make my own gear. Takes a tribe folks not one person. in order to make this grow we all need to step up.

Then do it!  Start a Go Fund Me or something - contact the Arnold and start the process.  Get er done!  I'll chip in.

Edited May 27, 2016 by climber511

[Squeezus]

9 hours ago, EJ Livesey said:

I like this idea a lot. I'd actually be willing to throw some money toward this, to help make it happen. I'm sure a collection or "fund me" type deal might do very well to make this happen. 

Booth pricing for the Arnold

http://arnoldsportsfestival.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/2017-Sponsorship-Pricing-Per-Booth-Sheet1.pdf

Holy crap, that's expensive, but I'm interested in making it happen if I can.

9 hours ago, Tommy J. said:

While i am normally super sarcastic, this post is me being 100% serious.

 

Chris, so what your saying is that you are speaking for NAGS and NAGS is not going to consider trying any of what i or anyone else has suggested? And that if i, or anyone would like to see any of that happen, then i/we need to act as an independant (as in- not NAGS) and make that happen myself/ourselves?

I fully understand your stance now Chris. It is more apparent than ever that you WANT this sport to remain in your backyard. And that you do NOT want it to grow into something bigger than what it currently is.

My next few words are last of what i have to contribute to NAGS, and then im out of here permanently. Tired of wasting broadband for nothing.

Just keep on doing what you are doing Chris. And who ever else is of his same opinion. Things are right where they belong.

 

I think you are missing the point that Chris is trying to make, which is easy to do over the internet. While there are some people who want the sport to stagnate, Chris is trying to make a call to action here. NAGS is not a proper governing body, so they don't have the resources or power to move the sport forward alone, so it will take individual and group contributions from people outside of the board to make things happen. Read some of @KapMan's posts about going to other strength events and setting up a grip booth or mini-competition. This is part of what it will take.

12 minutes ago, climber511 said:

Then do it!  Start a Go Fund Me or something - contact the Arnold and start the process.  Get er done!

Maria and I are in the process of planning for a short event at The Nashville Fit Flexpo. We haven't got all the details ironed out, thus we haven't announced it, but it's a start. I would suggest that our multi-sport guys (strongman, armwrestling, highland games, ninja warrior, climbing, jiu jitsu, crossfit, etc) should start working on outreach and taking their grip stuff to practices and events and getting the other competitiors interested.

[Andrew P]

23 minutes ago, KapMan said:

10x20 non sponsor seems bigger enough and affordable enough to try. Even a 10x30 should be more then enough to accomplish the objective, thanks for getting this sheet.

With a group yes it's doable but sure can't go at it alone. Happy to pitch in. 

[Squeezus]

Just now, Andrew P said:

With a group yes it's doable but sure can't go at it alone. Happy to pitch in. 

Where is our generous millionaire grip-benefactor at? There has to be somebody on the board that needs to offload some cheddar. 

[climber511]

I forget who but I remember talk of holding a Grip Contest at the Arnold venue several years ago.  I don't remember numbers but renting a "room" big enough to hold a competition - let alone any spectators (if you can't have people watch then there's no reason to hold it there) for a day was pretty unreal price wise.

[KapMan]

2 hours ago, climber511 said:

I forget who but I remember talk of holding a Grip Contest at the Arnold venue several years ago.  I don't remember numbers but renting a "room" big enough to hold a competition - let alone any spectators (if you can't have people watch then there's no reason to hold it there) for a day was pretty unreal price wise.

I figured a room at the Arnold would be out of reach. I think 5-7500 green backs would atleast be attainable if we all share the go fund me or whatever.  I'm ok with starting it. But my writing skills are comical at best, so maybe someone like the lovely @MCrushetta can write something to really bring out what we need and the goal. I'm going to hit up the folk I know of in the local strongman community and see if I can push it a tad harder. I think have state reps would also clear things up as well, because people have a go to person. Jedd for PA, Nate for Jersey etc etc. Goal being each rep has their own site, state records and so forth. I think that would be a dandy idea.

[KapMan]

2 hours ago, Squeezus said:

Where is our generous millionaire grip-benefactor at? There has to be somebody on the board that needs to offload some cheddar. 

cheddar

[Lucasraymond]

20 hours ago, climber511 said:

Tommy - several contests have had monetary prizes over the years.  But the amounts were of course small.  Chad's invitation only contest down in Georgia several years back for one that I remember - maybe the biggest package I can remember?  Gripmas has had money a few times as have others.  But bigger money is going to have to come from some kind of sponsor with deeper pockets than we have been able to find so far.  So money has been tried in as much as we had to give away. 

I agree as the money cannot come from the competitors as this is an issue that a lot of people have is the cost. Being new to armwrestling I see the same things but the people that compete seem more willing to dish out some cash to go to contests that may or may not have a financial gain at the end of the day, but there is a difference as there is a route (WAL for instance) that one can get good enough and make a bunch of money (however very improbable). 

*If I ever win the lottery i will sponsor gripsport and make all contests have a financial benefit; however, do the people that still feel that they aren't competitive stop because they know they still cannot win anything

*Money make just keep the higher level athletes working hard, some others working to get there; but possibly turn away the people that realistically never reach that no matter how much they train

 

-just some thoughts is all

[Eric Roussin]

I’m not sure if all the newer GripBoard members are aware, but grip sport was on display – on stage – at the Arnold Classic five years in a row between 2010 and 2014. The Mighty Mitts contest was sponsored by Richard Sorin and Sorinex, and featured some of the athletes with the strongest hands on the planet. Was this exactly the same as the NAGS-sanctioned grip sport contests? No, but it did show that grip existed as a separate discipline. Sorinex also had grip equipment and challenges at their booth, as did a few other booths. Odd Haugen also puts on several grip contests each year (partly sponsored by IronMind) at many of the biggest fitness expos in the US: LA, San Jose, Anaheim, Chicago.

Did anyone see any of these contests, decide to look into the sport and start competing in NAGS-type contests? Probably a few, but based on attendance at contests, participation didn’t skyrocket. Setting up a booth at the Arnold Classic is a noble idea to increase exposure to our sport, but at a cost of $5,000, I don’t see the return on investment being there. I don’t want to be discouraging – I just want to make sure everyone is aware of recent history.

There are many free or inexpensive ways to increase exposure to our sport. I think we should focus on these before putting up significant sums of money to be at an event like the Arnold Classic.

[KapMan]

6 hours ago, Eric Roussin said:

I’m not sure if all the newer GripBoard members are aware, but grip sport was on display – on stage – at the Arnold Classic five years in a row between 2010 and 2014. The Mighty Mitts contest was sponsored by Richard Sorin and Sorinex, and featured some of the athletes with the strongest hands on the planet. Was this exactly the same as the NAGS-sanctioned grip sport contests? No, but it did show that grip existed as a separate discipline. Sorinex also had grip equipment and challenges at their booth, as did a few other booths. Odd Haugen also puts on several grip contests each year (partly sponsored by IronMind) at many of the biggest fitness expos in the US: LA, San Jose, Anaheim, Chicago.

Did anyone see any of these contests, decide to look into the sport and start competing in NAGS-type contests? Probably a few, but based on attendance at contests, participation didn’t skyrocket. Setting up a booth at the Arnold Classic is a noble idea to increase exposure to our sport, but at a cost of $5,000, I don’t see the return on investment being there. I don’t want to be discouraging – I just want to make sure everyone is aware of recent history.

There are many free or inexpensive ways to increase exposure to our sport. I think we should focus on these before putting up significant sums of money to be at an event like the Arnold Classic.

I wasn't aware of that fact, and you sir bring up very good points.  Lots to consider here.

 

[JHenze646]

On 5/26/2016 at 11:47 AM, Jared Goguen said:

Hmmm I guess I was thinking about how crossfit is structured. Opens, regionals, and nationals. Seems like the whole point of having regional comps was to give people a chance to do well and then be able to go to nationals.

Having regional comps all around the country where the people that place lets say 2nd and 1st still may not hit there numbers to goto nationals seems silly. If the goal here is to create create legitimacy and attract people then having a structured ladder of events for people to participate in and build up to something is best i think.

Even if there are regional championships, there are still athletes that are geographically isolated. If they can submit a wildcard or qualifying feats, and have the means to make nationals that in my opinion is better then them using up their means to make a qualifier and not be able to attend nationals.

On 5/26/2016 at 1:23 PM, Eric Roussin said:

 I think the title of "Regional Champ" would be an incentive to most competitors, and I think to the outside public, the progression from Regionals to Nationals makes sense and is understood.

What is the big deal if the Regional Championships are not all the same? So the results won't be comparable across the country. Is this that much of an issue? We could just say the top two or three spots in each weight class qualify for Nationals, regardless of the number of participants. Plus, with different events, it could make the eventual winners of Nationals harder to predict.

Regional Championships held on the same day, with the same events, and with results compared across venues seems like it would be the same thing as a multi-venue Nationals. The only real difference is that the Regionals would have more participants.

Of course, there should be some sort of guidelines for event selection (e.g. at least one crush event, one pinch event, and one thick bar event).

So Regionals...

At this point, I am not a promoter and this year I am not much of a competitor either so please feel free to disregard everything I am going to write.

Venue Structuring

 I thought through this a little more. I imagine regional championships as multi-venue contests on the same day. The whole continent wouldn't have to be on the same day but just that region.   This allows multiple venues in a certain geographical area to compete in one collective pool. If the southern region has four venues and a solitary female athlete shows up at three of them, by competing collectively, they have a legitimate class. The winner is now the women's Southern regional champion and qualifies for NAGSC. 

By including additional events, each venue could technically have a champion.    

  Example: For the Southern regional championships  the venues are the Hotlanta Hand War, The Southern Squeeze, and the Kapusta Throwdown. They all start with three identical events that can be scored collectively for the southern regional championship. The Southern Squeeze has a medley and a Hercules hold for additional events. The Kapusta Throwdown has a tug of war(on a 4 inch rope, not a 3 or 3.5, only 4) for an additional event. The Hotlanta competitors opt for cold beers over additional events. Each location could crown a victor for that location as well as the overall southern regional champion from the combined score over all three venues. NAGS would need to decide what level makes qualification.

 

The contests

Each region would select the same events to be contested at every venue across that region for the regional championship. However, like WSH, the promoter could include additional events to be contested at his/her location for that locations independent contest. In example, the flask pinch, CCS grippers, and Crusher are contested as the events for the New England Regional Championships.  Each venue could add additional events to personalize that locations contest to draw more competitors and have more fun.

 

I am going to stop here because it is already late and i am certain some of what I said will be misunderstood.

 

22 hours ago, EJ Livesey said:

I like this idea a lot. I'd actually be willing to throw some money toward this, to help make it happen. I'm sure a collection or "fund me" type deal might do very well to make this happen. 

Booth pricing for the Arnold

http://arnoldsportsfestival.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/2017-Sponsorship-Pricing-Per-Booth-Sheet1.pdf

This is something to do after we establish an organization.

These are cheap booths but you also have to pay for electricity, carpet rental, drayage, freight, booth staff registrations, and insurance. Also you probably have to register challenges and competitions would need approved by show management.  Lastly but probably most important, shows have contracts for booth space. The person who registers for the booth must sign the contract and can be held legally accountable for any wrong doings. Also all conventions require a credit card to be placed on file for all incidental charges.

[Jared Goguen]

9 hours ago, JHenze646 said:

Even if there are regional championships, there are still athletes that are geographically isolated. If they can submit a wildcard or qualifying feats, and have the means to make nationals that in my opinion is better then them using up their means to make a qualifier and not be able to attend nationals.

You can't make everyone happy and in doing something like you make the process harder. How is a wildcard fair to everyone else? What makes someone geographically isolated? Do they need to take a dog sled 1000 miles in the winter to reach an airport?

Everything in life is pay to play. Don't have enough money for a football, guess you can't play catch...etc.

The very idea of regionals is to make it so there's something with in a reasonable distance that you could go to.

[JHenze646]

13 minutes ago, Jared Goguen said:

You can't make everyone happy and in doing something like you make the process harder. How is a wildcard fair to everyone else? What makes someone geographically isolated? Do they need to take a dog sled 1000 miles in the winter to reach an airport?

Everything in life is pay to play. Don't have enough money for a football, guess you can't play catch...etc.

The very idea of regionals is to make it so there's something with in a reasonable distance that you could go to.

Yes, but this is not going to happen overnight. The wild cards and qualifying feats would need to fade as the accessibility grew.

When I looked at the member map to make the fictional scenario above for the southern regional, there was only one member in Florida and it was south Florida.  He would possibly need to fly to a regional event. He would also need to fly to nationals to attend. If he can only afford one plane flight, which event should he attend?

[MCrushetta]

On 5/27/2016 at 11:49 AM, KapMan said:

I figured a room at the Arnold would be out of reach. I think 5-7500 green backs would atleast be attainable if we all share the go fund me or whatever.  I'm ok with starting it. But my writing skills are comical at best, so maybe someone like the lovely @MCrushetta can write something to really bring out what we need and the goal. I'm going to hit up the folk I know of in the local strongman community and see if I can push it a tad harder. I think have state reps would also clear things up as well, because people have a go to person. Jedd for PA, Nate for Jersey etc etc. Goal being each rep has their own site, state records and so forth. I think that would be a dandy idea.

I'd be happy to write something up. I need to read this whole thread though to know what I'd be writing :-). PM me if need be as well!

[KapMan]

17 minutes ago, MCrushetta said:

I'd be happy to write something up. I need to read this whole thread though to know what I'd be writing :-). PM me if need be as well!

No worries, I think the Arnold thing got shot down for return on investment issues. Eh. I appreciate it though!

[Don Smitley]

@Tank Andrade theres always room outside

[Tank Andrade]

1 hour ago, Don Smitley said:

@Tank Andrade theres always room outside

have definatly been thinking of runnin a comp

[anwnate]

50 minutes ago, Tank Andrade said:

have definatly been thinking of runnin a comp

Hmmmm...thank goodness it's all highway.  I can get there in 2.5 hours.

[KapMan]

On 5/27/2016 at 11:49 PM, JHenze646 said:

  Example: For the Southern regional championships  the venues are the Hotlanta Hand War, The Southern Squeeze, and the Kapusta Throwdown. They all start with three identical events that can be scored collectively for the southern regional championship. The Southern Squeeze has a medley and a Hercules hold for additional events. The Kapusta Throwdown has a tug of war(on a 4 inch rope, not a 3 or 3.5, only 4) for an additional event. The Hotlanta competitors opt for cold beers over additional events. Each location could crown a victor for that location as well as the overall southern regional champion from the combined score over all three venues. NAGS would need to decide what level makes qualification.

 

This would be awesome!! no thumbless grip on that bad boy and it would weight like 600 pounds. This is:

Edited June 17, 2016 by KapMan

[bencrush]

11 hours ago, rjackson said:

If anyone ever considers putting on a meet in the Denver area, I would be more than happy to help. 

 

 

 

Site:  Since I put on USAWA meets, I already have a gym set up for small meets.  [Iron Warrior Gym https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YM_8-GXsm5g]

 

 

 

Equipment:  I only have light grippers suitable only for women.  However the gym has equipment (2” bar, 3” bar, Inch db …. )  that can be used for warming up.  I also have unofficial 2” V-bars and 2” bar.

 

 

 

Scale:  I have a Seca scale “with an accuracy greater than ± 0.15 %”.

 

 

 

Weights:  Iron Warrior Gym has certified lifting plates.  I have certified fractional plates.

 

Very nice offer, Ruth!  Glad to see you posting here.  You and Dan have a LOT of experience with comps in general.  More than most people on here are aware of.  The next time my wife and I drive out to Denver, we'll drop by the gym and check it out.  Her parents don't live there anymore (moved 2 years ago), but we miss visiting and want to introduce our daughter to the mountains.