wrist developer /bending strength correlation

[wobbler]

Not much in the search, maybe people use abbreviation and search can't pick up 3 characters (wd2, for example.)

 

But, wd2 orange spring I can get notches 4-4 overhand, and underhand sometimes but it's real ugly. 5-4 reverse style, 5-5 if im really rested. Got some of the fbbc beginners bag but haven't tried anything yet. Do I have a decent shot at any of that, or should I keep working with the wrist developer for awhile?

[Shoggoth]

I've had pretty good success with reverse bending and I think you need to bend to be good at bending. The WD is good for helping strengthen associated muscles, tendons, etc. but there's absolutely no replacement for putting some kinks in steel. Grab a bag and give it a whirl. You'll learn a lot more. 

[climber511]

My own two cents is that the WD is a good tool for muscle and tendon development when done for repetitions.  I don't find much relation to bending with max effort testing on it.  Treat it like a bodybuilding tool for progressive development - not as a test for reverse bending - do both hands equally.

[wobbler]

Just looking for anecdotes because obviously I have no idea what my technique will be like, so I don't want to just go at it if it's probably not gonna happen.

[EJ Livesey]

There is no specific correlation. The WD will not make you a monster reverse bender. It will condition your bones, tendons and skin so they won't get hurt. 

Logically speaking hand placement alone will show what I'm talking about and hand placement is huge in bending. Both Steeves and Chris agree, two very respected and established benders.  

Bending is very specific, meaning, if you wanna be a good bender you have to bend. 

Edited March 22, 2016 by EJ Livesey

[Peter Brannstrom]

I'll just chime in and say I agree on just about everything all the very accomplished benders already have said!!!

The WD is an amazing tool in my opinion, BUT!!! it doesn't really say much in regards as to where you are when it comes to steel.
Lets just take myself as an example:
when I was the best I've ever been at reverse bending (I always bent per David Hornes rules and regulations) I failed to get over 40degrees on this piece:
Peter Brannstom (SWE) - 188.8k @ 6" - 6mm x 6" EN8 Square CRS bar, to 37deg - 14 May 2013 Video

during that time I bent a lot of steel, and, well, I also (due to me always being piss-poor) substituted a lot of steel with the use of the WD, but, I was never really at a really high level on the WD... dunno exactly where I was on it but I have far surpassed that level on the WD later on.

Since then I have been (now I haven't really bent anything in a looooooong time, and barely any WD-work either) WAAAAAY stronger on the WD while still being WAAAAY weaker on the bending. For instance high reps on the WD2+orange spring at the top notches (+20reps Left Hand Leading /+20reps Right Hand Leading) also WD2+wasp-spring at level #10 (both sides notch3) I've done over 10reps both left and right hand leading.

And, while I am no one when it comes to bending, I still wanted to chime in and give my two cents.

For me at least, there is no real clear correlation in between WD and reverse bending... to me it is clear that you can be "good" (wherever the line of "good" lies, I dunno ) at either while still being "bad" at either at the same time sort of... 
But, I really do love the WD as a training tool, for reverse bending it is very valuable for strengthening the areas required to bend. But, at the same time, at least for me, I wouldn't be able to train WD exclusively and even hope for being good at bending steel stock.

 

[Andrew P]

You should have no issues getting started on 3/16" Round by 7". 

[wobbler]

Thanks everyone for the input. Not looking to be "good" yet, just want to get my feet wet.

[Peter Brannstrom]

36 minutes ago, wobbler said:

Thanks everyone for the input. Not looking to be "good" yet, just want to get my feet wet.

I'd say the best way to get your feet wet is to just jump in, feet first!!!
Joking aside, just bend some of the stuff in the bag??? I don't know exactly what is in it, but, if there is anything 3/16 in it my guess is that it is very quickly going to be warmups/too easy for you, so, just hone your technique on the lighter pieces, and, otherwise get some nails from some store and go at them for a while. You guys in USA seems to be blessed with good beginner-stuff to bend to be found in regular stores!

All the best! bending is insanely fun and addcitive and I wish you the best of luck on this journey of yours!!!

[Grind]

If you're not into bending and don't intend to would the WD be a functional implement for getting stronger in all the other grip facets? Or is it a waste of money that way. 

[Shoggoth]

I'd say it's just another tool in the toolbox. Another option to stave off boredom and stagnation. 

[Grind]

15 hours ago, Shoggoth said:

I'd say it's just another tool in the toolbox. Another option to stave off boredom and stagnation. 

That's funny but it does not answer my question. 

 

[richcottrell]

Another thing that does not answer your question is this;

The US Dollar has been on the rise against the British currency that David Horne's World of Grip sells items for in their store.

I mention this because while David has not changed the actual price on the WD2, if your in the USA, then over the past maybe 1 and 1/2 years the price has dropped due to the conversion rate.

[EJ Livesey]

16 hours ago, Grind said:

If you're not into bending and don't intend to would the WD be a functional implement for getting stronger in all the other grip facets? Or is it a waste of money that way. 

It does not train crush strength or pinch strength. It just helps to condition tendons in the wrist and possibly lower forearm. So like shoggoth said, just another tool in the tool box. I would not buy for grip strength training. 

[Rick Browne]

The WD really helps to give you stabilization strength in the wrist. As when you may have to punch some asshole in the head. The WD, trained for a consistent amount of time, will help the wrist withstand the impact. Your hand and wrist will be like a hammer head on a handle.  Bwah-ha-ha

[wobbler]

It's good for stress relief, and has slowly helped strengthen my shoulder after a weird injury (yanked one of those 5 gallon quick crete bucket sign posts into a truck bed with one hand.)

[Shoggoth]

3 hours ago, Grind said:

That's funny but it does not answer my question. 

 

No? I thought you'd understand that it's still a progressive strength training device so yes, it can build strength. Whether or not it's for you or not is your choice. 

 

It's like asking if a kettlebell will get you stronger. Sure. 

[climber511]

Most devices will have benefits - some in a very specific way and others much more general.  The WD in my opinion falls in the more general category - a good tool but just that - a tool to include in your toolbox.  In my mind the problem is that everyone wants to simply use it as a "test".  To me its value is as a training tool - done in a progressive manner like all training should be done.  Only you can decide if this meets your goals as well as or better than something else you can add to your toolbox.  There's lots of toys out there that can help you become better in different areas - pick the toy that best meets your current goals. 

[Peter Brannstrom]

21 hours ago, Grind said:

If you're not into bending and don't intend to would the WD be a functional implement for getting stronger in all the other grip facets? Or is it a waste of money that way. 

I'd say it won't give you very much added benefits in other grip-events but bending...
At least not in any noticeable way other than the simple fact that IF you get stronger in the WD you'd have of course simply gotten stronger in arms/wrists/fingers/hands...So, in that way it WILL add to the other things you enjoy in the grip-world...
But, as Jason is touching upon, so would adding any number of things do, like lets pretend you never do sledgehammerstuff and pushup? and then suddenly you add radial/ulnar deviation and pushups to your current training, get waaay stronger in those things? well, then I'd say it would be a similar effect as the WD... But, the WD will give you a great feel of being able to grab on to something and bend it/destroy it in a way that perhaps no other training-tool will, other than actually bending something. Which, is kinda obvious, but, for me it has felt natural to be able to bend steel and stuff since starting doing that, something that I've found many times is NOT normal...  

BUT!!! the wrist developer, in my humble opinion, is INCREDIBLY fun to train with, it will hit a multitude of things at once, +it is highly portable, very easy to knock out a couple of sets in any old hotel-room while away on work (been there, done that) before going down to a dinner+drinks with workfriends for instance

So, I'd say it depends on your current situation, your "life-style" and/or the  way you train/prefer to train... for me, I love it (***even though I have been away from it for a loooong time now, but, I'll adress that a bit more further down as to why and so)
I also have no trouble of "motivating" me to get around to ACTUALLY using (rather the other way around, hard to stay away from) it as it is very fun to use to me and feels very much like I've accomplished something very quickly. I mean, I think most of us grip-nerds have at least one (or two) things that seemed fun and/or was fun to begin with but which we end up just sort of trailing away from and find them like ¨~once a year again and hit them up with the feel of; "damn!?!?! this one* (*insert implement of choice) is damn fun!!! why did I ever stop training with this*?!?!?!" only to forget it again due to something???
I highly recommend it, but, I might be biased, dunno, thinking as I bought my first one (yes, I have the old one as well as the WD2) while training a lot of reverse bending? also, of course, would depend on your current economic situation... 

***As for why I haven't been using it much as of late... it is quite...well, how to put it? "demanding" of your arms and recovery...
sure, depends on how you use it, but, there is no two ways about it... it WILL hit you kinda similar as any steel bending, it will very much hit your ligaments and tendons in a way that is at times "unpleasant" (depending on your mind-set, I've grown to love it, but, I kinda like pain, pain from bending and armwrestling that is ), and it will perhaps make you sore in painful weird demanding ways, kinda like armwrestling-training will. Which is also the main reason for me not using it much or bending at all for a looong time now (also too poor to buy much stock to bend was, and is, a huge factor as well to this bending-hiatus of mine).
As I have been hooked for real this time (since a bit over a year now, before that just on/off) on armwrestling I have simply not found any real good way to combine all the things I wanted to train and still make progress, so, I dropped bending and WD for a long time now, instead recently re-gained interest in grippers which I found I can progress on alongside AW without either one killing the other one. Bending and AW in combo has in the past proven to myself to be too harsh for me and give me a bit too much pain at times to be able to push it as stuff just simply "shut down" from the pain.

Edited March 23, 2016 by Peter Brannstrom

[Rick Browne]

(yes, I have the old one as well as the WD2)  Any difference in the action between the two?  For example; Does the WD2 have a  longer line of movement against the spring? 

[Grind]

1 hour ago, Peter Brannstrom said:

I'd say it won't give you very much added benefits in other grip-events but bending...
At least not in any noticeable way other than the simple fact that IF you get stronger in the WD you'd have of course simply gotten stronger in arms/wrists/fingers/hands...So, in that way it WILL add to the other things you enjoy in the grip-world.......

...Bending and AW in combo has in the past proven to myself to be too harsh for me and give me a bit too much pain at times to be able to push it as stuff just simply "shut down" from the pain.

Thnx for the some what short post, haha 

You helped me a lot with your view on the subject. Wrist work is something I need to do in the future. I hope the euro will keep rising, it was really low last year.
 

Edited March 23, 2016 by Grind

[Peter Brannstrom]

1 hour ago, Rick Browne said:

(yes, I have the old one as well as the WD2)  Any difference in the action between the two?  For example; Does the WD2 have a  longer line of movement against the spring? 

Action/feel of the two are VERY different (at least for something that both train just about exactly the same things and moves the same way).

The WD2 is comparatively very much "easier" in resistance than the WD1. Though, no worries, unless you only own an orange spring you won't run out of notches very quickly.

As for line of movement against the spring... I put the two on top of each other on the kitchen-table just now, and, though it is very hard to compare the two like this, I'd say the WD2 will stretch the spring a bit further on the higher notches than the old model. The two will give you about equal "feel" of getting to a 40degree bend though.
I attached an image of it, though, as said, it is not super-clear as to the differences... I ended up lining up the upper "arm" of the two WD's with each other and the result is this below.

As for which one I actually prefer training with, I don't really know... in hindsight I am certain I would've prefered to have had the WD2 before the WD1, as #2 is a lot more forgiving and "easier" which makes it, at least mentally, easier to move up on, which is kinda "more fun" at least for one's own confidence  the old model was very unforgiving the first few times I used it so... but, I don't know, I'd say that it was the old model+steel that gave me my best bending strength (as that was what I had available to me when I got to my highest levels of bending) but I guess the new one would've done the exact same thing, only maybe in a bit "kinder" way...

Ever since I got the WD2 I've wanted to modify it a bit, I would like to "file it" in the same way as one might do a gripper, so as to make it go further for a ROMbend, but, I also kinda don't (apparently as I have now had it for quite some time) as the modification would be irreversible... and, well, as might already be clear from my previous text on it, I really do LOVE this piece of equipment... though, it is ONLY A TOOL to get stronger, so, I might actually go ahead and modify my WD2, we'll see...

I am going to try them both out again on saturday... it has been a long time coming, and, well, I was saying I would stay away from it until after the swedish AWnationals was over, but, don't think I even want to do that anymore... I actually kinda just wanna go do a few sets immediately right now

[Peter Brannstrom]

1 hour ago, Grind said:

Thnx for the some what short post, haha 

You helped me a lot with your view on the subject. Wrist work is something I need to do in the future. I hope the euro will keep rising, it was really low last year.
 

Sorry for that wall of text...  I just always seem to end up writing...well...waaay too much...

[Rick Browne]

1 hour ago, Peter Brannstrom said:

Action/feel of the two are VERY different (at least for something that both train just about exactly the same things and moves the same way).

The WD2 is comparatively very much "easier" in resistance than the WD1. Though, no worries, unless you only own an orange spring you won't run out of notches very quickly.

As for line of movement against the spring... I put the two on top of each other on the kitchen-table just now, and, though it is very hard to compare the two like this, I'd say the WD2 will stretch the spring a bit further on the higher notches than the old model. The two will give you about equal "feel" of getting to a 40degree bend though.
I attached an image of it, though, as said, it is not super-clear as to the differences... I ended up lining up the upper "arm" of the two WD's with each other and the result is this below.

As for which one I actually prefer training with, I don't really know... in hindsight I am certain I would've prefered to have had the WD2 before the WD1, as #2 is a lot more forgiving and "easier" which makes it, at least mentally, easier to move up on, which is kinda "more fun" at least for one's own confidence  the old model was very unforgiving the first few times I used it so... but, I don't know, I'd say that it was the old model+steel that gave me my best bending strength (as that was what I had available to me when I got to my highest levels of bending) but I guess the new one would've done the exact same thing, only maybe in a bit "kinder" way...

Ever since I got the WD2 I've wanted to modify it a bit, I would like to "file it" in the same way as one might do a gripper, so as to make it go further for a ROMbend, but, I also kinda don't (apparently as I have now had it for quite some time) as the modification would be irreversible... and, well, as might already be clear from my previous text on it, I really do LOVE this piece of equipment... though, it is ONLY A TOOL to get stronger, so, I might actually go ahead and modify my WD2, we'll see...

I am going to try them both out again on saturday... it has been a long time coming, and, well, I was saying I would stay away from it until after the swedish AWnationals was over, but, don't think I even want to do that anymore... I actually kinda just wanna go do a few sets immediately right now

Thanks Peter for your reply and pic. You made a good call.  It does look like the WD2 has a better aesthetic look to it than the WD1. Yes, I agree the WD1 can be brutal, but for what I want it to do for me, it certainly gives me all I want and more. By the way, I am not a Bender

[richcottrell]

I have truly like reading this thread, so much that I have a deal for one of you fine gentlemen...

I do not know if you have seen it yet, but Jedd makes a good DVD that deals with using the WD and WD2 in training.  I have a copy of this video and I can say for the price it is a worthwhile investment.  
Education is always a good thing.  When I first got my WD2, I hurt my finger from not holding it correctly.  It was a minor injury, but it sure took a while to feel healed.  That was before I got this video.

At Gripmas 2015, I won a second copy of this DVD.  

I obviously do not need two copies of the same video, so here is my deal...  
I noticed that 4 of you guys are not or are no longer "sustaining members" of the grip board, so rather then trying to sell this DVD -- as I am too lazy anyway-- the first one of you to "join up" as any of the Contributor Levels of the Grip Board the DVD will be yours.  As some of you are overseas, I would ask  to be paid back for the shipping.
This dvd is still in the shrink wrap.

Does that sound reasonable?

I will give you guys a week to think about this, but if none of you guys want to take me up on this offer, then one of the other three guys who are already members are welcome to this DVD.

And if no one from this thread bites, I will open up this offer up to anyone else who wants the Wrist Developer DVD for free, as long as they become a Sustaining Member of the GripBoard.

rich

Edited March 24, 2016 by richcottrell